What is your god like? (18 Viewers)

[Martin]

If you gave me a quote that the cartoonist himself said, then we can't really say he was lying for sure now can we? Perhaps he has seen a ghost that told him to do so? Who am I to say he didn't?

We can speculate that he might be delusional, but we can't say for sure.

Exactly, so you can no more disprove some character that I can invent in 2 minutes than I can disprove god. Which is why I say the two are the same.

 

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[rounder]

Exactly, so you can no more disprove some character that I can invent in 2 minutes than I can disprove god. Which is why I say the two are the same.

Not quite, although I cannot tell you you are wrong in your superman belief. I would require evidence, if you cannot provide me with any evidence than I would have the right to discard your claims since they lack any grounds.

This is exactly why I give reasons for believing in God. That's the difference.

 

[Martin]

Except none of your reasons are convincing at all.

 

[rounder]

Except none of your reasons are convincing at all.

Actually they are. The reasons I have mentioned have converted many atheists to Christianity, thus it is only your opinion that they are not convincing.

 

[Martin]

Well, not only mine, because you have not converted any of the other atheists on the forum either.

 

[rounder]

Well, not only mine, because you have not converted any of the other atheists on the forum either.

You have to understand that having a set of beliefs is no different than owning a set of possessions. How often do you go around trading your possessions for other ones? Probably not very often. It is the same with you beliefs. If you went around changing your mind every 10 minutes, no one would really take you very seriously.

Also, I am not an expert on the subject. Perhaps someone with more expertise than me can do a much better job.

This is not about the person making the arguments but rather the argument itself. Since I can name you some of the most intelligent atheists who have converted their belief to Christianity because of rationality alone including C.S Lewis, Francis Collins ( Leader of the Human Genome Project). This implies that the arguments are in fact sound. Thus we do have more reason to believe in God than we do superman.

 

[Eddy]

Why do all 3 holy books have the same sub-stories in them ? Jews have Moses with other stories in it, then Christianity has Jesus with identical stories to the Jewish one and then Islam has Mohammed with similar stories to the Christian and Jewish book. What's up with that ? If I'm not mistaken, Joan of arc or whatever he/she is called is in all three books. Why ?

To me, it looks like all three books were bestseller novels at that time with each major cultures re-writing and adding a new plot to them.

 

[rounder]

Why do all 3 holy books have the same sub-stories in them ? Jews have Moses with other stories in it, then Christianity has Jesus with identical stories to the Jewish one and then Islam has Mohammed with similar stories to the Christian and Jewish book. What's up with that ? If I'm not mistaken, Joan of arc or whatever he/she is called is in all three books. Why ?

To me, it looks like all three books were bestseller novels at that time with each major cultures re-writing and adding a new plot to them.

Bestseller novels? Who profited from the money earned then? Was it Peter?
Or maybe it was Paul? Yes?

 

[Eddy]

Bestseller novels? Who profited from the money earned then? Was it Peter?

That didn't answer my question. And I didn't mean it literally, but what makes a story of those 3 so powerful to turn them into gods, prophets whatever and be worshipped. The same goes to any religion out there.

 

[rounder]

That didn't answer my question. And I didn't mean it literally, but what makes a story of those 3 so powerful to turn them into gods, prophets whatever and be worshipped. The same goes to any religion out there.

I am a Christian so I will speak for Christianity. In this case, I think it would have to be the miracles Jesus performed, his profound claims that He is the son of God.

 

[Eddy]

I am a Christian so I will speak for Christianity. In this case, I think it would have to be the miracles Jesus performed, his profound claims that He is the son of God.

Fair enough. Don't you think in a way that people at that time would have believed anything to believe in a "higher power" or "god" ? Each culture in this world had their own religion from the start of time and it's strange how they then converted to other religions as time went on. What was so different in their new religion that wasn't any much different than their old one.

 

[Raz]

No, again it's painful that you fail to see the alarming difference.

I can literally prove to you that Superman and Santa Clause never existed, all we have to do is go to the place that created these cartoons and they will give us the information we want sure enough.

Well i see one problem with this, could you prove that poseidon didnt exist?

 

[Raz]

You have to understand that having a set of beliefs is no different than owning a set of possessions. How often do you go around trading your possessions for other ones? Probably not very often. It is the same with you beliefs. If you went around changing your mind every 10 minutes, no one would really take you very seriously.

This just doesnt make sense, why someone wouldnt change their possesions if they are offered better ones?

 

[rounder]

Fair enough. Don't you think in a way that people at that time would have believed anything to believe in a "higher power" or "god" ? Each culture in this world had their own religion from the start of time and it's strange how they then converted to other religions as time went on. What was so different in their new religion that wasn't any much different than their old one.

When you take paganism for example at the time of Jesus Christ. Paganists then converted to Christianity because of the reasons I mentioned, Jesus' miracles, divine authority etc.. I hope that partly answers your question.

Well i see one problem with this, could you prove that poseidon didnt exist?

If you give me good reasons for why I should believe in Poseidon then I will not deny It's existence. But since you have given me absolutely nothing substantial other than your cynical attitude towards religion, then I don;t have to believe in Poseidon.

This just doesnt make sense, why someone wouldnt change their possesions if they are offered better ones?

Exactly, because possessions hold sentimental value to you, you would not easily trade a car that means so much to you for a car you know nothing about.

 

[Eddy]

When you take paganism for example at the time of Jesus Christ. Paganists then converted to Christianity because of the reasons I mentioned, Jesus' miracles, divine authority etc.. I hope that partly answers your question.

Not all of them though, some of them went to war I think right ? But that's like giving any example of why a person would want to convert to another religion just because of it's beliefs. It's a recurring thing.

 

[rounder]

Not all of them though, some of them went to war I think right ? But that's like giving any example of why a person would want to convert to another religion just because of it's beliefs. It's a recurring thing.

If I understood correctly, you are asking why people would convery to one belief in the first place? Yes?

If this is your question, it may due to several reasons. A person may find a certain faith more compatible with his common sense, other people may do so because they find the moral message appealing and may believe it to be true, others because of certain rational arguments that favors one belief over another.

 

[Raz]

If you give me good reasons for why I should believe in Poseidon then I will not deny It's existence. But since you have given me absolutely nothing substantial other than your cynical attitude towards religion, then I don;t have to believe in Poseidon.



Exactly, because possessions hold sentimental value to you, you would not easily trade a car that means so much to you for a car you know nothing about.

Maybe i said wrong or oyu didnt understood me, i meant to say that smart thing to do is to pick the new possesions if they are better then your current ones.

You dont believe in poseidons power? , t. Just imagine how much he tries to make this world a happier place with his tsunamis. Tsunamis thats some godly power alright. If this doesnt make make you believe in him i dont know what will.

What about god Aphrodite? If you once felt love you have felt here directly.

 

[Raz]

If I understood correctly, you are asking why people would convery to one belief in the first place? Yes?

If this is your question, it may due to several reasons. A person may find a certain faith more compatible with his common sense, other people may do so because they find the moral message appealing and may believe it to be true, others because of certain rational arguments that favors one belief over another.

How can someone try to explain god in rational terms, as far as i see it believing in god is anything but rational.

 

[rounder]

How can someone try to explain god in rational terms, as far as i see it believing in god is anything but rational.

Have you ever looked for theistic arguments for the existence of God? There are about 12 rational anf logical reasons. Why don't you try looking for them? It seems when I try to post them here, no one argues against them or proves me wrong, they just don't want to accept them. I suppose it is best to let you learn for yourself though.

 

[DelpieroForLife]

That's right. Human fallibility, I told you yesterday.

How can illiterate Mohammed fake a Divine-book while he can't even read and write... not only that he faked a Divine-book yet he convinced Arab (People at that time was very well informed when it comes to linguistic, poetry, poems...) with it and challenged them to match it or to write something familiar and they all admit their failure of creating a single sentence similar to what is written in Quran.