Moggi appreciation thread! (1 Viewer)

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Seven

In bocca al lupo, Fabio.
Jun 25, 2003
38,235
But it seems that Juve entered this farce of a trial and pled guilty, accepting Serie B before the evidence was presented in full.
There are millions of reasons why it indeed was a farce of a trial, but it seems plausible to assume Juventus were guilty of at least influencing games. That said, we do look a lot cleaner now and I couldn't care less about this part of our history.
 

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Vimto

Junior Member
Jan 18, 2006
228
But it seems that Juve entered this farce of a trial and pled guilty, accepting Serie B before the evidence was presented in full.
THE INSIDE JOB

I try and avoid talking about this stuff because it bothers me a lot.
There are two sides to the Agnelli family. There is Andrea Agnelli (who loved the triade) and the Elkan side (that loves Montezemolo). The Elkan side wanted to assume total control of FIAT operations (including sport) and for this reason there was an internal struggle at Juventus for the last 5 years or so. I remember reading about it when I lived there so it was a while back. We all knew the Agnelli’s were no longer supporting Juventus financially because they didn’t hide it at all.

To assume control the Elkan side needed to get rid of Moggi and Giraudo because they had control of the team’s business affairs. Not only that, but the Triade was loved by the fans and had a secure position within Juventus’ shareholders. Not to mention that if they fired the Triade they would just wind up working for Inter or Milan…I’m sure you remember both teams trying to recruit them, (Galliani admitted it and Moggi went on TV with the written contract signed by Moratti and later Moggi obviously refused). They needed Moggi and Giraudo out of soccer all together. That meant they needed them suspended.

Proof 1)
In the weeks prior to the scandal, the Milan Stock Exchange registered 4 times the average transactions of Juventus’ shares. After the Italian Revenue Agency (Guardia di Finanza) concluded their investigations they noted that Special Shares were sold to hand picked (new) shareholders. These new shareholders increased the number of voters on Juventus’ shareholders panel and as a result reduced the voting power of the two biggest (individual) shareholders which were Antonio Giraudo and Luciano Moggi. This ensured that if the two refused to step down, the shareholders on the Elkan side (now outnumbering the Andrea Agnelli side) could easily vote out Moggi and Giraudo. The two didn’t even put up a fight and decided to resign rather than be humiliated further after being voted out.

Proof 2)
FIAT and its holding company IFIL did not defend Giraudo and Moggi who had to find their own lawyers. To “defend” Juventus they used FIAT lawyer Zaccone who did pretty much nothing. He was quoted numerous times stating that things “could have gone worse (Serie C) given the evidence” (speech at the Juventus Shareholders Assembly on October 26th 2006). Now that we have the evidence and questioned him on what could have sent Juventus to Serie C, he has opted to remain silent. Zaccone only woke up and defended Juventus after the other squads had their sentence reduced and were all in Serie A (one even in he CL) except Juventus. At that point Juventus decided to appeal to the Civil Court of Lazio (TAR Appeal which I can provide for anyone interested). It seemed almost as if they (Elkan group) had been betrayed by the court. Maybe Serie B with 30 points (and then 17) was not what they had agreed to. The TAR appeal was created with a fury and deposited in court. On the 31st of August Zaccone retreated and withdrew the Appeal. Weeks later Juventus’ sentence was reduced to Serie B with -9 points. No further action was ever taken. In an interview in Tuttisport on the 4th of October former Constitutional Court President Antonio Baldassarre claimed “had Juventus proceeded with their appeal in civil court, they would have likely won and as a result crushed the system that currently controls soccer in our country.” So why did they withdraw hours before standing trial?

Proof 3)
Zaccone and Cobolli Gigli stated that the pressure of the public blame that would result due to the Italian tournaments being suspended by FIFA & UEFA (including Euro qualifiers) as a result of their appeal forced certain upper management figures to change their minds at Juventus and FIAT. Who though? Who put pressure on Zaccone and Gigli (who had finally woken up) to withdraw? Sports Minister Melandri may have answered that question for us after publically thanking Luca Cordero di Montezemolo (Elkan’s right arm) after Juventus’ withdrawal from the Civil Courts. Montezemolo is a FIAT Director and more importantly the President of Ferrari SpA. During the Calciopoli trial a woman by the name of Caterina Platea (who worked with the wire transcripts under Investigator Adamo Bove) confessed not only to manipulating and destroying wire transcripts for Bove (who committed suicide two weeks after the confession) also made another shocking revelation. Montezemolo was frequently at Telecom Italia where she was intercepting calls. She admitted to seeing him coming out of the offices of Tronchetti Provera and Massimo Moratti. Why would they be meeting? We got the motive recently when Telecom Italia sponsored Ferrari SpA for millions of Euros, the same Telecom Italia that spied on Juventus and is owned by Tronchetti (also owner of Inter’s biggest sponsor Pirelli tires and the FIGC/Lega’s biggest sponsor TIM).

Fact: All Juventus personnel are now part of the Elkan side of the Agnelli family (note Tardelli and Bettega of the Triade side were let go or didn’t have their contracts renewed).
- Secco (IFIL Director)
- Cobolli Gigli (former FIAT Manager)
- Blanc (IFIL Director)

A popular theory amongst Juventini is that FIAT intend on offloading Juventus and cashing in on the sale of the team now that they own more than 60% of the team’s shares and control the team entirely. It is expected that if Juventus qualify for the Champion’s League that the team will be put to market. One of the bigger signs was the Elkan family’s 104.5 million Euro investment into the team which should have gone to player signings and salaries. It was instead used to pay off debts that resulted from their relegation (75 million) and finance the stadium that Juventus own (Delle Alpi for 20 million). Very little (less than 10 million) was used to purchase players. Most player signings this year were actually paid for with the sales of prior and current players. The decision is logical. After all, it’s easier to sell a team with fewer quality players and good books than a team with stars on the bench and debts in the bank with a busted stadium to fix. If sold FIAT could finally focus on and invest greatly in the team that has always been their priority…Ferrari. One team was sacrificed (and is still being sacrificed) for the other.

We may not have all the answers yet…but what we do know points in the direction of an inside job, a betrayal, and a compromise between the Telecom Teamsters (Moratti-Tronchetti-Rossi) and the FIAT bosses (Elkan-Montezemolo).
 

Vimto

Junior Member
Jan 18, 2006
228
THere is first degree murder and second degree murder. Both fall under the category of murder. In Juventus' case its Article 6 violation a.k.a Match fixing.
it states clearly that Juventus were not found to have violated any article 6 from the accusation that were thrown at them.
In addition the article 1 violations (which lets say is like (drink and drive) were found on idividual levels, e.g. Moggi Locking up Papresta.
It also states that such personal acts were done behind the eyes of Juventus and their owners.

The Verdict: Demotion

Mind you:
Article 6 violation = relegation
Article 1 violation = points deduction if it was THE CLUB thats involved not a person acting alone.
The Paparesta deal is easy and stupid. Paparesta made terrible calls against Juventus in favour of Reggina (ignored penalty and two annulled goals). After the game Moggi went into the locker to room with Giraudo and yelled at Paparesta. It should be noted that according to league rules, directors are allowed to go into the referee locker room before and after a game but not during. In this case no harm done since it was after the game.

Moggi yelled at Paparesta and the linesmen (Coppelli who was found on the phone taking instructions from Milan's Meani on how to keep the flag down for Milan and up for others) and Di Mauro in an embarrassing fashion.
Moggi later made a crucial error. In a phone call afterwards he claimed that he locked the referees in the locker room, boarded a plane and left. Eye witness accounts including Paparesta's testimony to the court (which I have and can send to anyone interested) do not state that he or anyone else was ever trapped in a locker room. In addition, stadium surveillance recordings show Paparesta leaving at the normal hour.

Unfortunately Moggi’s attempt at sounding tougher than he was backfired as the Gazetta got the recording and publicized it. The declaration from Chief Investigator Borelli and testimony of Paparesta himself (I have both if anyone is interested) didn’t make the headlines. Moggi’s charges for “Unlawful Detainment” of Paparesta, Di Mauro, and Coppelli were all dropped. No one wrote about it though.

The day after the game Paparesta called Moggi to explain himself. Moggi insulted him and said “non ho voglia di parlarti” (I have no desire to speak with you) and hung up. I have the call and sent it to many.


By the way, Paparesta is an admitted Milanista
 

gsol

Senior Member
Oct 14, 2007
1,448
still hitting on me bumblaster? I SAID NO!

The "guilty plea" is apopular misconception as is the rquest for "Serie B"

Throughout all trial documents that never appears.

It was contested but not well enough by lawyer Zaccone. Frankly I think my nonno could have done a better job.
 

Vimto

Junior Member
Jan 18, 2006
228
still hitting on me bumblaster? I SAID NO!

The "guilty plea" is apopular misconception as is the rquest for "Serie B"

Throughout all trial documents that never appears.

It was contested but not well enough by lawyer Zaccone. Frankly I think my nonno could have done a better job.
:lol:
 
Apr 12, 2004
77,165
still hitting on me bumblaster? I SAID NO!

The "guilty plea" is apopular misconception as is the rquest for "Serie B"

Throughout all trial documents that never appears.

It was contested but not well enough by lawyer Zaccone. Frankly I think my nonno could have done a better job.
That shit is good! Add a litte Skeezey-barrone and you got yourself a good meal.
 
Jun 13, 2007
7,233
Posting evidence is ball sucking now?
Actually , I thought the evidence was very interesting but I still am a little skeptical . I have no doubt in my mind that Juve were somehow set up but I also have no doubt that moggi was far from innocent . This is the way I see it .
Moggi is Guilty and that nearly destroyed Juventus completely .
Regardless of the fact that Juventus might have been setup , Moggi is not innocent . I see no point of defending this idiot , I don't undetstand why people still persisit in sucking his balls .
 

.zero

★ ★ ★
Aug 8, 2006
80,672
Posting evidence is ball sucking now?
but whats the point? are you going to get him redemption? if you want to take offense to what i said then be my guest. just realize that i dont know wtf you said so i could care less if you or anyone posted "evidence".

Actually , I thought the evidence was very interesting but I still am a little skeptical . I have no doubt in my mind that Juve were somehow set up but I also have no doubt that moggi was far from innocent . This is the way I see it .
Moggi is Guilty and that nearly destroyed Juventus completely .
Regardless of the fact that Juventus might have been setup , Moggi is not innocent . I see no point of defending this idiot , I don't undetstand why people still persisit in sucking his balls .
:agree: word

juventus (the players) did not do anything wrong, moggi and the other fat cats were the guilty party if anything. i "appreciate" what he has done in the past but thats what it is -- the past. no need to keep praise alive and defend him after the sentence was handed down. the worst part is that he didnt care if juventus suffered -- i.e. us the fans and its great players.
 
Apr 12, 2004
77,165
No that isn't the point, the point is you talk bullshit, he comes with facts and you don't, you cock-breath.
The point is it is a joke. His "facts" are pointless because I don't even care about this club or the bloody trial. The point is, I joke around with him, and now you just to try and piss you off. It worked, and currently is still working. You two are the laughing stock of half of the forums not because of your "facts" that people agree or don't agree with, it's because everyone knows i'm messing with you and you take me more serious than a suicide bomb in Mother Teresa's ass.
 
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