The thing is, it all began at the end of 1800's, there were Ottomans back then, right? 
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Egypt: from 2011 demonstrations to today (15 Viewers)
- Thread starter ReBeL
- Start date
I think Sultan Abdelhameed was the last real Ottoman empire, but Turk knows better for sure than me.
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عاجل جدا: الجيش يصادر الكاميرات من الصحفيين ومن هواة التصوير وصادر كاميرات الجزيره ورويترز وعشرات المراسلين.. هناك شئ يجري ترتيبه ضد المتظاهرين ولا يريدون أن يعرفه العالم
عاجل جدا: الجيش يصادر الكاميرات من الصحفيين ومن هواة التصوير وصادر كاميرات الجزيره ورويترز وعشرات المراسلين.. هناك شئ يجري ترتيبه ضد المتظاهرين ولا يريدون أن يعرفه العالم
Finally you agreed with something Martin,this what i was also talking about,the thing the people right to elect is something,and whether that thing is wrong or bad is another thing.Obama is the US president because majority of Americans voted for him,not because he is good,maybe people thought he is good and he is really good,or maybe people thought he is good and in fact he is bad,i always think that if 04 election is repeated now most of Americans would choose Kerr.And that's a disadvantage in Democracy TBH,sometimes maybe what is elected by minority is better than what is elected by majority,but in the end what the majority elected for wins.
And that was exactly my point regarding Hijab in France,i see that girls can just go wearing Hijab like how it is in the secular India,BUT at the same time French government has the right to ban Hijab,why? not because it's good to ban Hijab but it's the right of their goverment to do what they see good for their society,now whether the decision is right or wrong that's a different issue.
And the same goes of Homosexuality,maybe you right and we are wrong,but it's our right to prohibit it or not,as it's also any country's right to prohibit it or not.And that what i wanted to say,i didn't want to discuss it's good or bad.
Regarding Prostitution.
Martin,criticism of Islam is allowed whether publicly or not,i think naggar misused the term 'criticism'.What is not allowed is isulting,abusing,and making fun.and BTW even abusing and making fun of other religions' figures is not allowed,and that's mentioned clearly in Quran.
Non-Muslims during prophet Muhammad time used to go to him and debate and criticise what he says publicly,and we all have this written in our History,and in fact if you don't know,the criticism of Muhammad was even mentioned in Quran itself (i mean what non-muslims siad about him)
I will not get offended if you say you don't agree with some things in Islam or you don't believe in God,i will get offended if you make fun of my religion or insult my prophet or something like that.
The way you are debating and criticising now is fair enough,and i'm not offended at all
Ya Snoop,we don't have holly men in Islam,we don't have popes or priests,no one is holly in Islam and each and every muslim can face criticism and you must be knowing that very well my friend.The only one who we believe had a contact with God is Muhammad and he died,and when he died he left the matter to the people to choose whoever they want,and the very first caliph in Islam who was Abu Baker was choosen by people,in a time when all the world leaders were nothing but Kings and Emperores.How don't you know that mate?
And that was exactly my point regarding Hijab in France,i see that girls can just go wearing Hijab like how it is in the secular India,BUT at the same time French government has the right to ban Hijab,why? not because it's good to ban Hijab but it's the right of their goverment to do what they see good for their society,now whether the decision is right or wrong that's a different issue.
And the same goes of Homosexuality,maybe you right and we are wrong,but it's our right to prohibit it or not,as it's also any country's right to prohibit it or not.And that what i wanted to say,i didn't want to discuss it's good or bad.
Regarding Prostitution.Martin,criticism of Islam is allowed whether publicly or not,i think naggar misused the term 'criticism'.What is not allowed is isulting,abusing,and making fun.and BTW even abusing and making fun of other religions' figures is not allowed,and that's mentioned clearly in Quran.
Non-Muslims during prophet Muhammad time used to go to him and debate and criticise what he says publicly,and we all have this written in our History,and in fact if you don't know,the criticism of Muhammad was even mentioned in Quran itself (i mean what non-muslims siad about him)
I will not get offended if you say you don't agree with some things in Islam or you don't believe in God,i will get offended if you make fun of my religion or insult my prophet or something like that.
The way you are debating and criticising now is fair enough,and i'm not offended at all
Ya Snoop,we don't have holly men in Islam,we don't have popes or priests,no one is holly in Islam and each and every muslim can face criticism and you must be knowing that very well my friend.The only one who we believe had a contact with God is Muhammad and he died,and when he died he left the matter to the people to choose whoever they want,and the very first caliph in Islam who was Abu Baker was choosen by people,in a time when all the world leaders were nothing but Kings and Emperores.How don't you know that mate?
Gamaro, good reply, I just have one point to make.
I think that satire, irony (in general, humor) is an integral part of an honest discussion about any topic. Don't we make fun of Juve players all the time? Don't we make jokes when they play bad? How crazy would it be if that were not allowed? Or if you couldn't make fun of Inter of Milan?
Telling a joke is often a way of saying something serious. In a clever way. In a way that captures people's attention, that makes them think. Even that makes people interested in a topic that they earlier had no interest in.
Martin,criticism of Islam is allowed whether publicly or not,i think naggar misused the term 'criticism'.What is not allowed is isulting,abusing,and making fun.and BTW even abusing and making fun of other religions' figures is not allowed,and that's mentioned clearly in Quran.
Non-Muslims during prophet Muhammad time used to go to him and debate and criticise what he says publicly,and we all have this written in our History,and in fact if you don't know,the criticism of Muhammad was even mentioned in Quran itself (i mean what non-muslims siad about him)
I will not get offended if you say you don't agree with some things in Islam or you don't believe in God,i will get offended if you make fun of my religion or insult my prophet or something like that.
The way you are debating and criticising now is fair enough,and i'm not offended at all
Non-Muslims during prophet Muhammad time used to go to him and debate and criticise what he says publicly,and we all have this written in our History,and in fact if you don't know,the criticism of Muhammad was even mentioned in Quran itself (i mean what non-muslims siad about him)
I will not get offended if you say you don't agree with some things in Islam or you don't believe in God,i will get offended if you make fun of my religion or insult my prophet or something like that.
The way you are debating and criticising now is fair enough,and i'm not offended at all
Telling a joke is often a way of saying something serious. In a clever way. In a way that captures people's attention, that makes them think. Even that makes people interested in a topic that they earlier had no interest in.
Comedy is a good way to get attention. Works pretty well, I should say. By interest in atheism and religion grew after watching George Carlin, Bill Maher and Ricky Gervais.
From Guardian:
Opposition protesters in Syria, where Bashar al-Assad rules over a regime far stricter than in Egypt, are planning protests for tomorrrow. Most observers, however, think his security apparatus will crush any dissent ruthlessly. There are signs tonight that pro-government forces are being mobilised. Stephen Starr, a freelance journalist based in Damascus, says on Twitter: "State-owned cars honking through the streets of Damascus waving flags in support of the government."
Opposition protesters in Syria, where Bashar al-Assad rules over a regime far stricter than in Egypt, are planning protests for tomorrrow. Most observers, however, think his security apparatus will crush any dissent ruthlessly. There are signs tonight that pro-government forces are being mobilised. Stephen Starr, a freelance journalist based in Damascus, says on Twitter: "State-owned cars honking through the streets of Damascus waving flags in support of the government."
From Guardian:
Key quotes from Hosni Mubarak, taken from Christiane Amanpour's interview with the Egyptian dictator earlier today (via ABC's Twitter feed):
"I was very unhappy about yesterday. I do not want to see Egyptians fighting each other."
"I never intended to run again, I never intended Gamal to be President after me"
"I don't care what people say about me. Right now I care about my country, I care about Egypt."
Key quotes from Hosni Mubarak, taken from Christiane Amanpour's interview with the Egyptian dictator earlier today (via ABC's Twitter feed):
"I was very unhappy about yesterday. I do not want to see Egyptians fighting each other."
"I never intended to run again, I never intended Gamal to be President after me"
"I don't care what people say about me. Right now I care about my country, I care about Egypt."
No doubt that making fun is always needed,Muhammad himself had many jokes,i don't want to give u an idea about muslims that they should be boring or should always behave seriously,but there are some certain things that are red light to make jokes about,for example can you make fun of DP with Rab,i don't have any problem making fun of me.One of my friend whenever meets me ask me "have you get married to 4 wives or not yet" this much is not a problem for me but not about God or prophet.
Bahai people gets offended if the photos of Baha'a is shown,so if i'm having a Bahai neighbour or friens i should respect him and not show,though for me there is nothing wrong in showing his photos but still i should respect them.the same thing for hindus,for us it's normal to slaughter animals to eat but they get offended by that,so i should respect them and not do that in front of them
And i believe all this is a part of religion toleration.
,i don't have any problem making fun of me.One of my friend whenever meets me ask me "have you get married to 4 wives or not yet" this much is not a problem for me but not about God or prophet. Bahai people gets offended if the photos of Baha'a is shown,so if i'm having a Bahai neighbour or friens i should respect him and not show,though for me there is nothing wrong in showing his photos but still i should respect them.the same thing for hindus,for us it's normal to slaughter animals to eat but they get offended by that,so i should respect them and not do that in front of them
And i believe all this is a part of religion toleration.
From Guardian:
"'If I resign today there will be chaos," Hosni Mubarak tells ABC News's Christine Amanpour in an interview today:
I've just left the presidential palace in Cairo where I met for about 30 minutes with president Mubarak. He told me that he is troubled by the violence we have seen in Tahrir Square over the last few days but that his government is not responsible for it. Instead, he blamed the Muslim Brotherhood, a banned political party here in Egypt.
He said he's fed up with being president and would like to leave office now, but cannot, he says, for fear that the country would sink into chaos.
"'If I resign today there will be chaos," Hosni Mubarak tells ABC News's Christine Amanpour in an interview today:
I've just left the presidential palace in Cairo where I met for about 30 minutes with president Mubarak. He told me that he is troubled by the violence we have seen in Tahrir Square over the last few days but that his government is not responsible for it. Instead, he blamed the Muslim Brotherhood, a banned political party here in Egypt.
He said he's fed up with being president and would like to leave office now, but cannot, he says, for fear that the country would sink into chaos.