True, I'm just reacting to it being implied that I'm an elitist moron when I use common sense in an argument.
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About honor killings (6 Viewers)
- Thread starter Martin
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Qur'an doesn't mention any of the stuff I told there, all of those are detailed facts from either Muhammed's companions or his past enemies that became muslims soon after his death. Had you actually known what Qur'an is all about you would have known it rarely spoke about Muhammad's era when mentioning history But hey, don't let that stop you from carrying on this clueless argument of yours.
Wow, you're retarded 
it is so pointless even having a conversation with you when you disregard the point and go off on tangents.
Date of Muhammad Death?
Date Written Qur'an Originated?
Date Historical Accounts of Muhammad's life originated?
You with your superior arguing ability and with the facts on your sideshould have no trouble explaining it to my retarded self how the numbers lie.
The Qur'an is at least 3rd hand information
The life of Muhammad is at least 3rd hand information
FACT.
it is so pointless even having a conversation with you when you disregard the point and go off on tangents.Date of Muhammad Death?
Date Written Qur'an Originated?
Date Historical Accounts of Muhammad's life originated?
You with your superior arguing ability and with the facts on your sideshould have no trouble explaining it to my retarded self how the numbers lie.
The Qur'an is at least 3rd hand information
The life of Muhammad is at least 3rd hand information
FACT.
Wow, you're retarded it is so pointless even having a conversation with you when you disregard the point and go off on tangents.
it is so pointless even having a conversation with you when you disregard the point and go off on tangents.
Here's where you FAIL yet again. Qur'an was written before Muhammad's death, he was the one who ordered it to be written down in the first place, Genius. The Qur'an at his time was written on animal skin, palm leaves and scripted on stone. As to your knowledge there was no papers back in those days. All of the Qur'an known now, was written at that time.
Later after his death Abu Baker who took over the Islamic empire, ordered those parts that was already written to be gathered and re-written on papers gathered in one book which is the Qur'an as we now it now. Year later Othman Bin Affan, copied that Qur'an to another one and since then the copying is continuing.
Now you don't have to continue any conversation with me, I really don't give a damn what you think about Qur'an I simply hate reading BS and try my best to correct the ones that I read along the road.
JBF: obviously you can see how the book could contain some false information. There are a huge number of ways people could have fucked up during the process you just described. I'm not asking you to stop believing, but you have to admit that if you use common sense, the entire development of the Quran as described by muslims seems rather unlikely.
The original written version during the Muhammad era was reviewed many times by the prophet himself and that was used to copy the other one, and the other and so on. The original version that Im talking about here is still preserved at the Madina Mosque IIRC. And as a believer, we believe that the Qur'an is untouchable of being changed. It maybe false to you in the meaning as the info that is in it is not accepted by your part but I can assure one thing, it's the same one that was in the Muhammed era.
And till this day, every time the Qur'an is printed a group of high level religious muslim professors have to check it first or else its not printed and the checking process takes months, sometimes years.
And till this day, every time the Qur'an is printed a group of high level religious muslim professors have to check it first or else its not printed and the checking process takes months, sometimes years.
It was an aural tradition carried by his followers until it was collated, the Hoy Qur'an, which is the true Qur'an came after his death from the collation of his followers memorization of the message that he preached.
God-Muhammad-Followers-Collator.
4th hand information, you can't argue with that, that's all I said, you really are just being over defensive.
God-Muhammad-Followers-Collator.
4th hand information, you can't argue with that, that's all I said, you really are just being over defensive.
Only because squat is what you're looking for.
That is true in the sense that almost all the followers memorized the Qur'an but it was in fact written down in the shape I talked about before.
It wasn't a book in the sense of books we've at our time, I think I've explained that just a couple of posts before this one. It was written down on what was at that time used for such a purpose so naturally it didn't form one book as we know today till after his death and even years later.
That is true in the sense that almost all the followers memorized the Qur'an but it was in fact written down in the shape I talked about before.
It wasn't a book in the sense of books we've at our time, I think I've explained that just a couple of posts before this one. It was written down on what was at that time used for such a purpose so naturally it didn't form one book as we know today till after his death and even years later.
If I were you JBF, I'd really not trust Alen here 
It's a trap I tell you!
It's a trap I tell you!
P) but I'm not willing too.
Info like what? I've said all I know about it in the posts above.
Yeah, I've seen many of those
Yeah, I've seen many of those
I think what you're talking about is Uthman Quran or the Samarkand codex? But that's not kept in Medina. That's a manuscript and it's written in the late 8th-early 9th century. That's long after the prophet's death. The scripting* that is used in this version is from the 9th century.
A newer version is found in Yemen, but that too is after Muhammad died.
Edit: * Kufic script