UCLA student tasered by police (1 Viewer)

gray

Senior Member
Moderator
Apr 22, 2003
30,260
#82
Vinman said:
instead of commenting on all your babbling, I'll let your last sentence speak for me.....

they are trained, and understand situations...while you are not

end of story
Wow, congratulaions...

I think you've just summed up the whole mentality we've been referring to in a nutshell.

"We're cops, and you're not, so we'll just ignore all the relevant information at hand and dismiss the possibility that maybe our judgment isn't perfect. Zap him again, Jack"
 

Vinman

2013 Prediction Cup Champ
Jul 16, 2002
11,482
#84
gray said:
Wow, congratulaions...

I think you've just summed up the whole mentality we've been referring to in a nutshell.

"We're cops, and you're not, so we'll just ignore all the relevant information at hand and dismiss the possibility that maybe our judgment isn't perfect. Zap him again, Jack"
you have a freakin 6 minute video that doesnt show everything...in fact, it really doesnt show much at all

spare me all your bullshit, you dont know or understand these types of situations, so dont pretend you do

Swag said:
And if we're talking about "shoot first" here, let's be clear we're talking about a Taser. A frigging Taser: the kind of "weapon" that will get your ass laughed out of any given NRA meeting. It's not like the guy is brandishing a semi-automatic.

The great irony is that if the officer put him in a headlock and dragged him out, we'd have never heard of this and the student would undoubtedly have suffered some lasting physical damage.
Again, Greg makes sense...this is a non-lethal tool that the police are able to use to control a situation. There are no lasting effects from it
 

swag

L'autista
Administrator
Sep 23, 2003
84,963
#86
Vinman said:
you have a freakin 6 minute video that doesnt show everything...in fact, it really doesnt show much at all

spare me all your bullshit, you dont know or understand these types of situations, so dont pretend you do



Again, Greg makes sense...this is a non-lethal tool that the police are able to use to control a situation. There are no lasting effects from it
Scary when Vinman and I agree, eh? :D
 

gray

Senior Member
Moderator
Apr 22, 2003
30,260
#88
Vinman said:
Again, Greg makes sense...this is a non-lethal tool that the police are able to use to control a situation. There are no lasting effects from it
So lasting effects are all that matter? There are no lasting effects from spraying pepper spray in people's eyes; it just hurts like hell. Should we make that standard protocol too?

Vinman said:
you have a freakin 6 minute video that doesnt show everything...in fact, it really doesnt show much at all
I'm talking about the rest of my post which you dismissed as 'babble', and chose instead to take one sentence out of context to suit your purposes... which, by the way, you did once again for the previous post.
Vinman said:
you dont know or understand these types of situations, so dont pretend you do
I'm not claiming to understand these situations, but if you look at what can be seen from the situation, it's relatively tame compared to what these officers have trained for.

If a parent whips their child with a belt because he spills a glass of milk, you can't dismiss it by saying that there are no lasting effects. You have to question the amount of force used, as well as how they'd react in a more in a more severe situation.

Vinman said:
spare me all your bullshit,
And yet again we see the same attitude exhibited; are the slurs really necessary Vincent? I'm not about to sue you for excessive force, but I can't help but draw comparisons between your approach to this discussion and the 'tactics' used by the police officers in question.
 

Martin

Senior Member
Dec 31, 2000
56,913
#92
The bottom line is that we're not cops. And as such we have no effin clue what we're talking about. While we may know entirely what it's like to sit in a lab and not have your id on you, it's a whole different ballgame to assess all the possible outcomes of that situation through a pair of standard police eyeglasses. And the fact that they tazed this guy five times, including after he was already in cuffs, in no shape or form gives us, the peasants that we are, the right to question the LAW over how they handled the situation. In fact, if we were to question their methods on the spot, we might just deserve a good tazing ourselves.

Police training is very hard and gruelling kids, and you can never be too careful with these criminals-pretending-to-be-students. After all, cops specialize in this business, so they would naturally be a lot more apt at throwing someone out of a building than we would. Pah, we would probably just drag him out. Imagine the story in the papers.


Greg: Is there really no way to remove a person without causing them 'lasting injuries'? What is this technique you keep quoting that causes spinal injuries? If you lift someone up by the shoulders, do you injure their spine?
 

Seven

In bocca al lupo, Fabio.
Jun 25, 2003
39,443
#93
Monday, November 20th, 2006
UCLA Police Repeatedly Taser Handcuffed Student For Refusal to Show ID, University Orders Outside Probe

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Officials at the University of California in Los Angeles are launching an independent investigation into campus police officers' repeated shocking of an Iranian-American student with a Taser stun gun. The student was handcuffed the entire time. The incident was captured on video has and sparked outrage across his campus and the country.

Officials at the University of California in Los Angeles are launching an independent investigation into campus police officers" repeated shocking of an Iranian-American student with a Taser stun gun.
The incident took place last Tuesday evening in a UCLA library filled with students studying for their midterm exams. The student, Mostafa Tabatabainejad - a 23-year old senior - was in the library's computer lab. Campus police ordered him to leave after he failed to produce a student ID.

Police then handcuffed Mostafa and shocked him with a Taser gun at least five times. The entire incident was captured on video by another student and has been widely seen on local TV news and the website YouTube. In the video Mostafa can be heard screaming "I said I would leave" after police repeatedly shock him with the Taser gun.

Mostafa"s attorney, Stephen Yagman, said he plans to file a federal civil rights lawsuit accusing the UCLA police of "brutal excessive force," as well as false arrest. He said Mostafa initially refused to show his ID because he thought he was being singled out because of his Middle Eastern appearance. Mostafa is of Iranian descent but is a U.S. citizen by birth and a resident of Los Angeles.
Meanwhile more than 200 UCLA students marched to the university police station on Friday calling for an independent investigation and the suspension of the officers involved. Hours later, the university announced that a veteran LA law enforcement watchdog would head up the probe. Merrick Bobb served as staff attorney for the Christopher Commission, which was formed to examine allegations of excessive force in the Los Angeles Police Department after the Rodney King beating in the early "90s.

We speak with the Southern California Council on American Islamic Relations which has also called for an independent investigation into the case.
 

Seven

In bocca al lupo, Fabio.
Jun 25, 2003
39,443
#94
He was handcuffed? That really made the taser necessary :howler:

I can imagine them handcuffing him and then tasering him because he "resufes" to show his ID :D.
 

Vinman

2013 Prediction Cup Champ
Jul 16, 2002
11,482
#95
if he was already handcuffed, then no, a defendant should not be tasered, pepper sprayed, or anything else done to him

the video did not show that, and up until the last few posts, I didnt know he was already handcuffed (if that was truly the case)

Even though Gray thinks he is such an expert on such incidents, and he is not just the guy I thought globe-trotted handing out bibles, and converting people to Christianity, I wiill give you guys a quick lesson on what I could have done as a police officer in New York State under the same circumstances....

If the student didnt have his required ID, I could have charged him with TRESSPASSING, simply because he had no proof that he was a student at the university (I probably would not have done that, however), but then if he refuses to leave the building, then I could again charge him with TRESSPASSING.

Once he became the village idiot, yelling all sorts of nonsense and acting the fool in public (what did the Patriot Act have to do with this anyways ??), he could then be charged with DISORDERLY CONDUCT

Now, I can take him into my custody, and place him under arrest. If he doesnt comply, or struggles, then I can charge him with RESISTING ARREST

Now, the way New York State's use of force laws go, in laymans terms, the police are allowed to basically "one up" the defendant, which means if he is using his hands or feet, or in anyway struggling to prevent the arrest, I dont have to sit there and wrestle him back, and turn this into a WWE match, I can use pepper spray, a taser, or my collapseable baton (ASP) to bring him under control, to execute the arrest. If the defendant has a knife, gun, stick, etc, then I can use my service weapon to stop the defendant...I dont have to turn this into a Bruce Lee movie where its his knife against my Baton, or my baton versus his stick, etc

So, if thats the way things went down, what they did was perfectly legal, and the police were justified (again, it was a 6 minute tape where you couldnt see everything), but if he was tasered after the cuffs went on, then its not justified...under no circumstances

I personally think the kid was looking for trouble, and has no respect for authority...if a police officer requests you to do something, dont be stupid and try to look like a tough guy in front of a bunch of people, do what he requests

If that was my son under those same circumstances, and he acted like that, the taser would be the LEAST of his worries, once he came home
 

Vinman

2013 Prediction Cup Champ
Jul 16, 2002
11,482
#96
Andy said:
True story:

Today I asked a police officer outside the food court if he had a light. He pulled out a black metallic object and proceeded to taser me.

thats because you gave him the wrong weather forecast :eyebrows:
 

Martin

Senior Member
Dec 31, 2000
56,913
#98
Vinman said:
if he was already handcuffed, then no, a defendant should not be tasered, pepper sprayed, or anything else done to him

the video did not show that, and up until the last few posts, I didnt know he was already handcuffed (if that was truly the case)

Even though Gray thinks he is such an expert on such incidents, and he is not just the guy I thought globe-trotted handing out bibles, and converting people to Christianity, I wiill give you guys a quick lesson on what I could have done as a police officer in New York State under the same circumstances....

If the student didnt have his required ID, I could have charged him with TRESSPASSING, simply because he had no proof that he was a student at the university (I probably would not have done that, however), but then if he refuses to leave the building, then I could again charge him with TRESSPASSING.

Once he became the village idiot, yelling all sorts of nonsense and acting the fool in public (what did the Patriot Act have to do with this anyways ??), he could then be charged with DISORDERLY CONDUCT

Now, I can take him into my custody, and place him under arrest. If he doesnt comply, or struggles, then I can charge him with RESISTING ARREST

Now, the way New York State's use of force laws go, in laymans terms, the police are allowed to basically "one up" the defendant, which means if he is using his hands or feet, or in anyway struggling to prevent the arrest, I dont have to sit there and wrestle him back, and turn this into a WWE match, I can use pepper spray, a taser, or my collapseable baton (ASP) to bring him under control, to execute the arrest. If the defendant has a knife, gun, stick, etc, then I can use my service weapon to stop the defendant...I dont have to turn this into a Bruce Lee movie where its his knife against my Baton, or my baton versus his stick, etc

So, if thats the way things went down, what they did was perfectly legal, and the police were justified (again, it was a 6 minute tape where you couldnt see everything), but if he was tasered after the cuffs went on, then its not justified...under no circumstances

I personally think the kid was looking for trouble, and has no respect for authority...if a police officer requests you to do something, dont be stupid and try to look like a tough guy in front of a bunch of people, do what he requests
You know what, this actually makes you sound like a proper, reasonable cop. I notice how you mention what options you have on the condition that the case is such and such, accompanied with the appropriate charges. Not just choosing to do something for the hell of it.

Vinman said:
If that was my son under those same circumstances, and he acted like that, the taser would be the LEAST of his worries, once he came home
:D
 

swag

L'autista
Administrator
Sep 23, 2003
84,963
#99
Martin said:
Greg: Is there really no way to remove a person without causing them 'lasting injuries'? What is this technique you keep quoting that causes spinal injuries? If you lift someone up by the shoulders, do you injure their spine?
That's a better question for Vinman than I.

However, I can tell you this much: 45 minutes of a taser makes for a fine Thanksgiving turkey. Crispy on the outside, tender on the inside. :lick:
 

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