Türkiye (6 Viewers)

[Turk_Bianconero]

You will make one very lovable dictator.

You're the one who is suggesting to relocate a nation in another planet you :jester:

 

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[Maddy]

.. And now the real coup has begun.

 

[pavelnel]

That's not cool.

I don't know how would you feel if you neighbor is an Islamist nutjob whose wet dream is to restore the Ottoman empire. This could be real danger for my country in the not so distant future. So I say fuck off to any cuckoo wannabe sultan and his equally despicable followers.

 

[Hængebøffer]

I don't know how would you feel if you neighbor is an Islamist nutjob whose wet dream is to restore the Ottoman empire. This could be real danger for my country in the not so distant future. So I say fuck off to any cuckoo wannabe sultan and his equally despicable followers.

I wouldn't care. As long as people respect basic law, they can dream and talk about anything they want. Threatening other people doesn't include that.

 

[Hængebøffer]

And his wife, girlfriend etc. has nothing to do with your debate.

 

[pavelnel]

I wouldn't care. As long as people respect basic law, they can dream and talk about anything they want. Threatening other people doesn't include that.

I am sorry but this statement is utter and complete bullshit. The radicalization in Turkey is not some perceived danger but a real thing and could have great negative implications not only for the region but for the world. And every sensible man and woman especially in close proximity to that country should be aware of that. Not to panic but to be prepared for any possible outcome. This is pure common sense.

And his wife, girlfriend etc. has nothing to do with your debate.

And I did not mean it as a personal insult to anyone related to him but a personal insult to him as his kind are the type of men who create and sustain the toxic environment in which such heinous acts are common. And he wants to create and sustain this environment where that will be one of the many privileges the ruling class (dare I say it - men with perverted religious understandings which are manifested through ruthless autocratic rule) will have.

 

[Hængebøffer]

I am sorry but this statement is utter and complete bullshit. The radicalization in Turkey is not some perceived danger but a real thing and could have great negative implications not only for the region but for the world. And every sensible man and woman especially in close proximity to that country should be aware of that. Not to panic but to be prepared for any possible outcome. This is pure common sense.



And I did not mean it as a personal insult to anyone related to him but a personal insult to him as his kind are the type of men who create and sustain the toxic environment in which such heinous acts are common. And he wants to create and sustain this environment where that will be one of the many privileges the ruling class (dare I say it - men with perverted religious understandings which are manifested through ruthless autocratic rule) will have.

What are you talking about? I'm not talking about perceived danger, and already stated that Turkey is becoming less free. Banning something you don't agree with doesen't help. Well, it helps if you don't care about personal liberty.

Sorry for the last part. Sometimes I misunderstand.

 

[king Ale]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...gift-from-god-soldiers-istanbul-a7140516.html

 

[Turk_Bianconero]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...gift-from-god-soldiers-istanbul-a7140516.html

Can you humiliate yourself further? What are you trying to prove? Even fiercest Erdogan enemy, kemalist, nationalist or communist accept this as coup attempt and thankful to police forces and civilians who prevented.

make one of your Turkish friends translate it for you, this guy is opponent to erdogan and everything he represents, he is mad when he is criticizing the ruling party and even the voters. website itself is nationalist/kemalist/leftist. he says commanding chiefs of air force were shouting ''we made a promise to mahdi(feto)'' while bombing the parliament, tells about the operation going on social media as coup fails, tells about how would Istanbul serve as battleground for a fight between terrorists and police forces for months if people were not on streets.
http://odatv.com/mehdiye-yeminimiz-var-1707161200.html

what is the source of the article you post; ''Social media users''. Di Culo among them? Bitter hashashin who are extremely pissed upon realizing that their cult of damned finally comes to an end.

theatre but a damn good one, about 50 generals who are months away from retirement and thousands of others put their life to a trash bin while ashaming their families in a worst way possible over a show.

 

[Seven]

I wouldn't care. As long as people respect basic law, they can dream and talk about anything they want. Threatening other people doesn't include that.

Many people in Europe do care though. For the most part I agree with what you're saying and I guess democracy is first and foremost about everyone being entitled to their own opinion.

But I think many European countries are now debating how far this should go. With the Muhammad cartoons and Charlie Hebdo, we're all about free speech. But when people celebrate a terrorist attack they are arrested and convicted (usually because they supposedly threatened others, which is a bullshit charge, they celebrated a previous attack that doesn't mean they say they will carry one out themselves). Now I don't need to tell you that convicting people for celebrating like that is about as strong as a limitation on free speech can be.

 

[Hængebøffer]

Many people in Europe do care though. For the most part I agree with what you're saying and I guess democracy is first and foremost about everyone being entitled to their own opinion.

But I think many European countries are now debating how far this should go. With the Muhammad cartoons and Charlie Hebdo, we're all about free speech. But when people celebrate a terrorist attack they are arrested and convicted (usually because they supposedly threatened others, which is a bullshit charge, they celebrated a previous attack that doesn't mean they say they will carry one out themselves). Now I don't need to tell you that convicting people for celebrating like that is about as strong as a limitation on free speech can be.

I agree and I think it's a big problem. Imo, it won't help criminalizing words.

 

[Juliano13]

Many people in Europe do care though. For the most part I agree with what you're saying and I guess democracy is first and foremost about everyone being entitled to their own opinion.

But I think many European countries are now debating how far this should go. With the Muhammad cartoons and Charlie Hebdo, we're all about free speech. But when people celebrate a terrorist attack they are arrested and convicted (usually because they supposedly threatened others, which is a bullshit charge, they celebrated a previous attack that doesn't mean they say they will carry one out themselves). Now I don't need to tell you that convicting people for celebrating like that is about as strong as a limitation on free speech can be.

There always have been limitations to free speech, even in America. You are not allowed to incite violence. How exactly do you celebrate a terrorist attack without inciting violence? Which cases are you referring to?

Charlie Hebdo and the cartoons is totally different.

 

[Hængebøffer]

There always have been limitations to free speech, even in America. You are not allowed to incite violence. How exactly do you celebrate a terrorist attack without inciting violence? Which cases are you referring to?

Charlie Hebdo and the cartoons is totally different.

You are right. That's why we need to debate. Law won't save us. How do you incite violence by words? An example: Sweden have been banning what they believe to be right wing propaganda. They also have the most problems with right wing extremism, in Scandinavia.

 

[Turk_Bianconero]

There always have been limitations to free speech, even in America. You are not allowed to incite violence. How exactly do you celebrate a terrorist attack without inciting violence? Which cases are you referring to?

Charlie Hebdo and the cartoons is totally different.

When i told you press is more free than it should be as they are allowed to support pkk who are everyday killing people, you reacted different. Is it ''my terrorist is good and yours is bad'' like heinous government of usa have been telling the world.

 

[Seven]

There always have been limitations to free speech, even in America. You are not allowed to incite violence. How exactly do you celebrate a terrorist attack without inciting violence? Which cases are you referring to?

Charlie Hebdo and the cartoons is totally different.

Of course there are always limitations. But putting people in jail for saying things is a big ass limitation. And if you do so you should at least prove they actually incited violence or threatened people. Inflammatory speech is usually not enough btw, if they are jailed it's because a judge felt they were saying they'd carry out an attack themselves.

Also, you live in a neofascist country that discriminates people on the basis of religion. Excuse me if I don't take you 100% seriously here.

 

[Seven]

I agree and I think it's a big problem. Imo, it won't help criminalizing words.

Probably not. But I see judges every day and they're people like you and me. They are also usually in their forties or fifties and far from impressed with the local twentysomething thug thinking he's all that and rejoicing when people are hurt. Their natural instinct is going to be to put the moron in jail.

I'm not saying they're bad judges btw. I think it's just an inescapable fact.

 

[Seven]

When i told you press is more free than it should be as they are allowed to support pkk who are everyday killing people, you reacted different. Is it ''my terrorist is good and yours is bad'' like heinous government of usa have been telling the world.

Yes. He's a hypocrite when it comes to this stuff. Not very surprising because most of us free speech champions are.

 

[Juliano13]

Of course there are always limitations. But putting people in jail for saying things is a big ass limitation. And if you do so you should at least prove they actually incited violence or threatened people. Inflammatory speech is usually not enough btw, if they are jailed it's because a judge felt they were saying they'd carry out an attack themselves.

Also, you live in a neofascist country that discriminates people on the basis of religion. Excuse me if I don't take you 100% seriously here.

You didn't say which cases of jailed people you were referring to. There certainly are cases in which jail is appropriate. For example, urging people to commit murder for the crime of drawing cartoons, or for the crime of writing a book, as in the case of Salman Rushdie.

Oh, and I live in Bulgaria so what the fuck are you talking about?

- - - Updated - - -

When i told you press is more free than it should be as they are allowed to support pkk who are everyday killing people, you reacted different. Is it ''my terrorist is good and yours is bad'' like heinous government of usa have been telling the world.

So, you agree with me now?

 

[Hængebøffer]

Probably not. But I see judges every day and they're people like you and me. They are also usually in their forties or fifties and far from impressed with the local twentysomething thug thinking he's all that and rejoicing when people are hurt. Their natural instinct is going to be to put the moron in jail.

I'm not saying they're bad judges btw. I think it's just an inescapable fact.

I'm not blaming the judges. I believe our society has become too autocratic. Lawyers actually benefit from that.

 

[king Ale]

Can you humiliate yourself further? What are you trying to prove? Even fiercest Erdogan enemy, kemalist, nationalist or communist accept this as coup attempt and thankful to police forces and civilians who prevented.

make one of your Turkish friends translate it for you, this guy is opponent to erdogan and everything he represents, he is mad when he is criticizing the ruling party and even the voters. website itself is nationalist/kemalist/leftist. he says commanding chiefs of air force were shouting ''we made a promise to mahdi(feto)'' while bombing the parliament, tells about the operation going on social media as coup fails, tells about how would Istanbul serve as battleground for a fight between terrorists and police forces for months if people were not on streets.
http://odatv.com/mehdiye-yeminimiz-var-1707161200.html

what is the source of the article you post; ''Social media users''. Di Culo among them? Bitter hashashin who are extremely pissed upon realizing that their cult of damned finally comes to an end.

theatre but a damn good one, about 50 generals who are months away from retirement and thousands of others put their life to a trash bin while ashaming their families in a worst way possible over a show.

I was and am against a coup, and as I said the fact that anti-government politicians, journalists and people condemned the coup was a sign of civilian maturity in Turkey in my opinion. This however doesn't prove that the coup was not staged, right? I'm not saying it was, but I suspect it was. I may be wrong. What I linked was an interesting take on the incident. What I want to link below is another interesting piece that you may fine disturbing. I warned you.

https://www.theguardian.com/comment...term=Autofeed&CMP=fb_cif#link_time=1468796041