Renovation time... (11 Viewers)

OP
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Lo-Pan

Disciple of Gonzo
Feb 11, 2009
2,788
  • Thread Starter
  • Thread Starter #21
    Amauri isnt being deployed right... plus when was the last time we had had decent crosses?? .........oh yeah he scored...

    I agree with some of the obvious call outs (zebina,tiago,mgt) but you need to chill out dude...
    There is no irritation in my stance. Only optimism. And as for Amauri...can you seriously mean to imply that for the last year, he has ben deployed correctly??? As you yourself wrote, when he has crosses, decent crosses, he can score...so how would say he had been deployed, the team as a whole deployed, when he has been playing for the vast majority of this last year??? I would say 'wasnt deployed right'. You dissagree...I would be interested to read why.

    I am not expecting such a renovation to take place. I am interested in how the majority of other juve supporters, view our current squad, and higher reaching club management. At best, a portion of what I, and likely many others, would like to see happen, will happen. I don't see $100m suddenly appearing in Secco's pocket. Though...for sure, some of the players I have highlighted for an exit, would bring in a half decent amount, which could be invested in players good enough to make us once again, a team to be feared.

    As to the comment of selling Momo, but keeping Candreva....I rate momo bery highly. But we have Melo, Marchisio who can do his exact job. Yes, they are weaker in the challenge, Melo notby much, but without any doubt, they are both superior to Momo in terms of ball control, basic passing, basic shooting. And for that reason, yes, if a decent offer came in, I would not be horrified to se it accepted. In some ways, Momo typifies what we have become...all muscle and hustle, but not technique. No crisp, fluid passing...Just a straight jackhammer approach.

    Candreva CAN pass, create, shoot. Not world class, but still, he is young, and has, what i consider, definite potential. As we have two other players who can play Momo's role, which whatever way you look at it, MUST BE, central midfield, or defensive midfield. Only a lunatic would play him on the flank or further forward...Why not lose one of the excess??? Whose game CAN be world class, but forus, he is all too often, expected to, or feels the need to, actually play football?? for those of you who rate benitez as a coach...why the fuck would he have let him leave so cheaply??? and yes, in the current market, a world class defensive midfielder is expensive, much more expensive than Momo cost us...

    So yes, I would rather look to the future.
     

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    OP
    Lo-Pan

    Lo-Pan

    Disciple of Gonzo
    Feb 11, 2009
    2,788
  • Thread Starter
  • Thread Starter #23
    Its not a master plan, JCK...its my total view on our current squad and higher reaching management. And I wanted to see what others thought, rather than in between other posts related to another thread entirely...Who should stay, who should be sold? What spine to keep, to build from, and what with? I have no belief that what you see as my 'masterplan' will be implemented. Some of it...yes.
     

    mondo1

    Senior Member
    May 14, 2006
    10,612
    #24
    Everytime the disaster hits us someone comes with a master plan to revolutionize the squad.
    but to be honest he isn't so wrong...ok 14 players is a bit to much and its not realistic to change to whole squad but its clear that we need a revolution here.
    but players like legro dc momo should stay.
    legro dc are good squad players and momo is killer!
    what we need is a new defence... let'S get canna and grosso out and go for a new lb and cb. leaving carcers as a rightback or looking for a better option
    in midfield i wouldn't change to much
    diego gio marchisio melo momo have to stay. as for poulsen tiago def. need to go (to high wages for squad players) not sure about candreva...and camo(he is one of the best right midfielders u gonna see but his injuries are way to much) and players like sali could still be usefull as he can play everywhere if we continue to have so many injuries.
    as for the attack.
    one of amauri/iq/trez has to leave.....or maybe two if we r going to get a new striker.

    so that makes it canna grosso tiago poulsen molinaro and one of the strikers thats 6 players to leave maybe 1 more.
     

    Buck Fuddy

    Lara Chedraoui fanboy
    May 22, 2009
    10,647
    #25
    We don't need 6 or 7 (or even more) new players. What we need is a real coach.
    We had a good (not great, but getting there) team last season & the foundations of that team are still the same this season. So I don't buy it that now, all of a sudden, these same players aren't good enough any longer.
     

    Suns

    Release clause?
    May 22, 2009
    21,929
    #26
    Yesterday, we played the same partnership up front as we did almost 10 years ago. That says it all, really. Take that, Barcelona, Inter and all you other elite teams out there.

    But seriously, although this guy is right about who should stay and who should go, its not realistic at all.
     

    mondo1

    Senior Member
    May 14, 2006
    10,612
    #27
    We don't need 6 or 7 (or even more) new players. What we need is a real coach.
    We had a good (not great, but getting there) team last season & the foundations of that team are still the same this season. So I don't buy it that now, all of a sudden, these same players aren't good enough any longer.
    ya a great coach is the first thing we need... but we also need to get rid of some of the old players.
    and the players that saved our asses the seasons before were delpiero camo buffon chiellini....maybe momo
    thats it.... and all of them should stay.
    maybe just camo should leave... i think it was alen who had one hell of a post with camo leaving... if i remember correct he said that camo is one of the best that we have but his injuries kill us. cause we rely to much on him but when he is injured we just don't have any other options
    we just can not rely on the old guard anymore.
     

    blondu

    Grazie Ale
    Nov 9, 2006
    27,404
    #33
    as a commentator said in the away game with ajax, a drastic fall comes in every big team's life..the thing is that to bounce back with style, to get glory once again, to be what we once were, and more than that.
     

    Dominic

    Senior Member
    Jan 30, 2004
    16,692
    #38
    First of all there is no way anybody is going to pay more than €6 m for Camoranesi, if not less, and he is our best right winger - he won't go... Players like Tiago might leave but Poulsen is probably staying. We will have no spine if we kick out around 15 players.

    Look at how average the England national team was under a bad coach, Capello took over and look now. Our team is full of internationals and most of them are actually quality players and if not then they should at least be in the top 15 of the league. Our real problem is that we don't have any great coach.

    Look what Capello did to England, Madrid, Guus To South Korea & Russia, Lippi to Italy, Pep to Barca, Jose to Inter. With out set of players we are supposed to easily march to, at least, the top 4.
    I'm of a somewhat opposite opinion. I wouldn't go completely as far as saying 'a coachi is only as good as his material', but close.
     

    rounder

    Blindman
    Jun 13, 2007
    7,233
    #39
    I really don't think selling half the team is going to solve our problems. I don't think we lack quality in defense because of Cannavaro and Legro. Our main problem has been the same for the last three years and remains the same now. We have no fullbacks. That's a huge handicap, especially when you're going to play a 4-3-1-2 formation. Virtually all of our crosses depend on how well our fullbacks can push forward. If they don't perform up to standard, a good part of our attacking threat is eliminated.

    We can't depend on quick one touch passes. we don't have too many technically gifted players that can hold up possession and create chances. Sissoko and Melo can't help out too much offensively. Del piero, Diego, Candreva, and Marchisio are the only players we have that can actually pose a threat going forward.

    So that's the problem in my opinion. We don't have the right players to make this formation work(4-3-1-2 or 3-5-2). Our best bet would be to play the 4-2-3-1 and depend on crosses from players like Camo, Giovinco, or even Marchisio to create our chances.

    Defensively, again, I think the problem is with our fullbacks. Grygera and Zebina are both shit. De Ceglie is a headless chicken. He has absolutely no control on the ball, no composure, the only saving grace is that he is fast. Grosso is playing like trash; sadly, he was never able to repeat his Italy performances for us. Caceres I think is our best fullback. He's not great yet but at least he has some potential and is relatively solid both offensively and defensively.

    The reason I'm not blaming the center backs is because they aren't fucking up the way the other players are. If you look at the goals we are conceding you'll notice that it's not because of defensive blunders from our CB's, they are actually performing quite well.

    We just need to find the right system for this team. The talent is there without a question, it's only a matter of making use of it. Ferrara made a terrible job of it, let's wait and see if Zac can do a better job.
     
    OP
    Lo-Pan

    Lo-Pan

    Disciple of Gonzo
    Feb 11, 2009
    2,788
  • Thread Starter
  • Thread Starter #40
    Defensively, again, I think the problem is with our fullbacks. Grygera and Zebina are both shit. De Ceglie is a headless chicken. He has absolutely no control on the ball, no composure, the only saving grace is that he is fast. Grosso is playing like trash; sadly, he was never able to repeat his Italy performances for us. Caceres I think is our best fullback. He's not great yet but at least he has some potential and is relatively solid both offensively and defensively.
    I am with you on that score, JR...but even as our best fullback, he has hardly looked amazing, just better than several awful fullbacks. Which is not enough for me to be happy for the club to pay 10m+ for his services on a full contract. That seems excessive. but yes, he has shown potential.

    I am not suggesting we sell ALL the players I mentioned, or rather, that i think its the best way forward. I was highlighting the parts of our squad which I feel are clearly below the standard I am used to, at Juve. During the years I have supported the club, we have never had a whole team of superstars, always instead, a few special players, with players around them who were exceptionally diligent, determined, lacking technical expertise and flair, but nonetheless, combining beautifully with the more talented individuals...like...Di Livio, Torricelli, Ravanelli...

    no club would clear out all the players i mentioned, for they would be left with half a team, and bringing in replacements on such a large scale, would make the chances of the new team gelling together, slim, and lengthy. Obviously...

    My interest, remains, who do the majority see as dead wood???

    There is no panic in my words, or stance here. Its an analysis, which I am sure many others consider frequently in these dark times. And no, i haven't made many threads of this nature. Perhaps one other, a while back, about the transition from the Old Guard to the New Guard. NOW, as we approach crunch time in the league, its becoming more interesting to see who will be part of the new Juve, and who will be sold, or sacked. Because i doubt there are many juventini who can put their hand on their heart and say..
    'yep! its been a solid season, the future looks ever so bright. We have the right squad, the right coach, the right board...'
    I am mainly interested in PLAYERS...dead wood or foundations for the new Juve, which I hope, will emerge from the disaster of this season.
     

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