'Murica! (83 Viewers)

Quetzalcoatl

It ain't hard to tell
Aug 22, 2007
65,497
There are generally morons everywhere but they are not getting excluded from jobs or friendships. What you listed are people I'd punch in the head. However, I don't think those traits necessarily mean a bad parent. A friend of mine is ill tempered and impatient, however, those traits are being shown when there's a kid in the room. I think people are great when it comes to adapting. I've seen a vast number of examples. Sometimes you get great people even if they had shit parents. There are no written rules there imo. Lastly, like I said, we can never know until there are kids around.
Well you don't always know, but you can sometimes tell that certain people should never have kids. And people know themselves better than anyone else, so if they don't want a child they're probably right to not have one. In other words, one of the first criteria for having a child should be actually wanting one, not because society thinks you should.
 

Dostoevsky

Tzu
Administrator
May 27, 2007
88,433
Well you don't always know, but you can sometimes tell that certain people should never have kids. And people know themselves better than anyone else, so if they don't want a child they're probably right to not have one. In other words, one of the first criteria for having a child should be actually wanting one, not because society thinks you should.
Of course one shouldn't be forced to have kids. I'm just arguing the reasons on why not to have kids, and I find those hilarious and stupid. Career being more important or being afraid of the dooms day, resource scarcity or financial meltdown is just lolz. I would totally understand if the argument was/is on which book to read or where to travel. But as women can only have kids in certain age, it's unbelievable that people are prioritizing other things & get selfish so they can travel and eat nicer meals because having kids would mean not getting a new BMW and travels with no Maldives.
 

Quetzalcoatl

It ain't hard to tell
Aug 22, 2007
65,497
Of course one shouldn't be forced to have kids. I'm just arguing the reasons on why not to have kids, and I find those hilarious and stupid. Career being more important or being afraid of the dooms day, resource scarcity or financial meltdown is just lolz. I would totally understand if the argument was/is on which book to read or where to travel. But as women can only have kids in certain age, it's unbelievable that people are prioritizing other things & get selfish so they can travel and eat nicer meals because having kids would mean not getting a new BMW and travels with no Maldives.
Some women do enjoy their careers and think they won't enjoy having a family as much. Is it really stupid? What if she can't find a good man, or she sucks at relationships and would therefore be miserable in one? Maybe she's right.
 

Bjerknes

"Top Economist"
Mar 16, 2004
111,444
My girlfriend wants kids. Only doubt I have in the relationship. Seems like it will place such a damper on the things we can do for 20 years.
My wife and I have felt the same way for years. We've never thought gee, we just have to have kids. We really enjoy our lifestyle and being able to travel and do what we want any given night, so it's never even been a question, really. But this is something only you can decide, and whatever you do, don't ever get forced or pressured into having kids. I've had to combat that for years and it's fucking draining, but worth the battle. It's your life.

And this is another reason why I think swaggers is correct in calling it a cult.

I think not having kids is a life choice anyone will regret as they get older.
Not necessarily. Life is short. There's lot of shit to do and things to see. You could also have kids and regret it. I know a few people who have admitted they do regret it, and these aren't cases of disability either.

On the real, you ought to have kids but it comes at a great great risk and expense in the west.
This is another good reason not to have kids.

Cause slowly dying in an old folks home is a terrifying fate
This is something people always say. But there's no guarantee your kids will be there for you anyway. Just go talk to someone in a nursing home, you'll hear a lot of sad stories about that. And if this is a major factor in deciding whether you (not you personally, but anyone) have kids or not, you're doing it wrong.
 

Dostoevsky

Tzu
Administrator
May 27, 2007
88,433
Some women do enjoy their careers and think they won't enjoy having a family as much. Is it really stupid? What if she can't find a good man, or she sucks at relationships and would therefore be miserable in one? Maybe she's right.
She's not right and yes that's really that stupid. Or she's stupid.

You know why she can't find a good man? Because she's working for 15 hours per day and possibly during the weekend too because "she wants to make it". It's the ego. Plenty of women can be mothers but not many can have a great career. That's what triggers them. Chasing the lower percentage bracket gets her more admiration by the society. You know when she will feel miserable? When she gets to her 50s, 60s and see that she's alone. She might have bank account full but she'll be empty. Majority around her will have families. She'll have TV, nice restaurants and... well, probably nothing else, because she has to go to work for another 15 hours.
 

Quetzalcoatl

It ain't hard to tell
Aug 22, 2007
65,497
She's not right and yes that's really that stupid. Or she's stupid.

You know why she can't find a good man? Because she's working for 15 hours per day and possibly during the weekend too because "she wants to make it". It's the ego. Plenty of women can be mothers but not many can have a great career. That's what triggers them. Chasing the lower percentage bracket gets her more admiration by the society. You know when she will feel miserable? When she gets to her 50s, 60s and see that she's alone. She might have bank account full but she'll be empty. Majority around her will have families. She'll have TV, nice restaurants and... well, probably nothing else, because she has to go to work for another 15 hours.
I agree that may be the case for most women, but there are many who do not regret not having children. You gonna say they wrong, or they're in denial? Are the ones with kids who regret it also wrong?
 

Dostoevsky

Tzu
Administrator
May 27, 2007
88,433
I agree that may be the case for most women, but there are many who do not regret not having children. You gonna say they wrong, or they're in denial? Are the ones with kids who regret it also wrong?
I can't say it sucks to be a millionaire because I never had it.

As for the latter, I think it's the wrong partner as there's no synergy there. If team sucks, it surely will suck. They might have a feeling of missing out. I think that gets sorted out as time goes by and when their kid grows up and they see what they "created" they will be proud and won't regret anything. Or they can at least be proud until their kid creates an account on Tuz.
 

Post Ironic

Senior Member
Feb 9, 2013
41,830
Funny to see how life’s differentiate, I became a dad at 22, 25 and 30.
Holy moly. I was not ready at all to have children in my 20s. 39 now, and sorta feeling ready, but want to wait a couple more years. Girlfriend is 31 and in a rush. Apparently it’s higher risk after 34 for disabilities for women. So I have 2-3 years to decide. If I do have kids, I don’t really want to have them after about 42 though, so that works I guess.
 

Quetzalcoatl

It ain't hard to tell
Aug 22, 2007
65,497
I can't say it sucks to be a millionaire because I never had it.

As for the latter, I think it's the wrong partner as there's no synergy there. If team sucks, it surely will suck. They might have a feeling of missing out. I think that gets sorted out as time goes by and when their kid grows up and they see what they "created" they will be proud and won't regret anything. Or they can at least be proud until their kid creates an account on Tuz.
One particular example comes to mind now. A woman a bit older than me who grew up in my neighbourhood, she was a real thot to put it nicely. Anyway, she got knocked up and had a kid. Baby daddy nowhere on the scene, she continued her party life, all kinds of men in and out the house. The boy was sadly neglected other than having his material needs met. Stopped going to school, hangs out with drug dealers, got shot at recently, and is now making gangsta music videos. I don't think he will live very long. Not to mention they seem to hate each other.

She should not have had a child.
 

Dostoevsky

Tzu
Administrator
May 27, 2007
88,433
Holy moly. I was not ready at all to have children in my 20s. 39 now, and sorta feeling ready, but want to wait a couple more years. Girlfriend is 31 and in a rush. Apparently it’s higher risk after 34 for disabilities for women. So I have 2-3 years to decide. If I do have kids, I don’t really want to have them after about 42 though, so that works I guess.
Bro you would be a great dad. Bar sometimes when you're insane. But you'd do great.

But yeah. I was thinking about men too. It would kind suck to be 50 when your kid starts going to school lol.
 

GordoDeCentral

Diez
Moderator
Apr 14, 2005
69,303
i can confirm. i was 38 when my son was born and i had a hard time explaining myself why i left it so late. obviously i can't do anything about it now. i can only suggest you guys to not overthink it. just do it. the first year was tough, after that every minute is a blessing

but i get point of those who won't have a kid. a friend recently explained how a kid and a maternity leave would compromise her career, and all i could reply was fair enough. we all have different priorities

we've also given up on things in our careers. now i don't earn nearly as much as i could, but at least i have the freedom to stay at home with my son when he's sick, we can spend plenty of time together, and i wouldn't want it any other way. my son will be 8 in may, we still have a few years until he doesn't want to be around us that much anymore, so we're enjoying the current situation until we can


it's not cheap for everyone and in every country, it's certainly something you need to consider. we were lucky enough to already have a few real estates before my son was born, so when he'll need a place to move in, we'll just sell something and buy an other in any city he prefers (unless it's in switzerland or luxembourg or facsimile lol). we're also not opposed to give him well kept used clothes, and my gf has a friend with a son who's like 2 years older and has basically the same build, and she's giving away basically unworn brand clothes regularly. our only additional regular cost on the long run is the food until he goes to university. and so far he's been smart enough so that i can realistically expect him to get a state financed scholarship. he's having some additional stuff like drawing school, horse riding, etc, but those aren't too expensive. half an hour of horse riding cost like $5 even last year lol, it was recently raised to ~$7.5, still not expensive. buying a bycicle or building him the tree house i spent my time with durig last spring/summer aren't terrible either. for example the tree house cost me around $1000 or so in materials, an other few hundreds in tools, and i enjoyed it much more than any project i did in the last few years, and my son loves the thing a lot, so the benefits easily overshadow the costs, be it time or actual money

anyway, when it comes to costs, we were probably both prepared and fortunate enough. we're also closer to being ascetics then hedonists so there's that too haha

bottom line is that there wasn't a single moment when i didn't feel blessed and i never regretted my choice of having a kid. it never felt like a task or a sacrifice

The longer i live the more i realize it's really insane to ignore tens of thousands of years of social wisdom because of 50 some years of experimentation and hubris. It took me a while but i am fully convinced now on the delayed gratification and accomplishment of having and raising kids.
 

Bjerknes

"Top Economist"
Mar 16, 2004
111,444
She's not right and yes that's really that stupid. Or she's stupid.

You know why she can't find a good man? Because she's working for 15 hours per day and possibly during the weekend too because "she wants to make it". It's the ego. Plenty of women can be mothers but not many can have a great career. That's what triggers them. Chasing the lower percentage bracket gets her more admiration by the society. You know when she will feel miserable? When she gets to her 50s, 60s and see that she's alone. She might have bank account full but she'll be empty. Majority around her will have families. She'll have TV, nice restaurants and... well, probably nothing else, because she has to go to work for another 15 hours.
The question is, why do you care so much about something that doesn't impact you? If another person wants to have a good career and doesn't want a family, why does that matter to you?
 

Dostoevsky

Tzu
Administrator
May 27, 2007
88,433
One particular example comes to mind now. A woman a bit older than me who grew up in my neighbourhood, she was a real thot to put it nicely. Anyway, she got knocked up and had a kid. Baby daddy nowhere on the scene, she continued her party life, all kinds of men in and out the house. The boy was sadly neglected other than having his material needs met. Stopped going to school, hangs out with drug dealers, got shot at recently, and is now making gangsta music videos. I don't think he will live very long.

She should not have had a child.
She should go to prison for at least 30 years if you ask me.

Still, on each shitty example there are like 20 good ones too. But we should separate whether it's good to have kids vs should morons have kids.
 

Dostoevsky

Tzu
Administrator
May 27, 2007
88,433
The question is, why do you care so much about something that doesn't impact you? If another person wants to have a good career and doesn't want a family, why does that matter to you?
Who said it does? I was just laughing at the arguments. I never stopped anybody even if their ideas were stupid.

It's a forum and its point is to speak our mind. I never hold lectures to people on the streets. They can go put their paycheck and bonuses up their ass for all I care. I just wish they'd do my 8 hour shifts too since they are insane.
 

Post Ironic

Senior Member
Feb 9, 2013
41,830
Bro you would be a great dad. Bar sometimes when you're insane. But you'd do great.

But yeah. I was thinking about men too. It would kind suck to be 50 when your kid starts going to school lol.
Thanks, bro. You would be too. Raising kids on the classics! Well-adjusted, able to handle whatever the world throws at them kids.

If I have kids, I definitely don’t want to be 70 when they turn 20. I have an uncle like that and it just seems unfortunate to be in that position, physically unable to really do all the things you would want to do with your kids as they grow up.

- - - Updated - - -

Accident or on purpose?
 

X Æ A-12

Senior Member
Contributor
Sep 4, 2006
86,613
Your nope implies to what exactly? I have only pointed out certain traits in careers that make good parents too.
Sure the traits you mentioned are all probably better to have than not have in any endeavor but they by themselves are hardly any indicator of being a good parent.

But i guess its hard to go further in this conversation without defining a successful parent? What do you look as an indicator that you've been a successful parent? That your kids are obedient, that they are superficially successful or that they are happy/ stable?
 
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Vlad

In Allegri We Trust
May 23, 2011
22,581
Thanks, bro. You would be too. Raising kids on the classics! Well-adjusted, able to handle whatever the world throws at them kids.

If I have kids, I definitely don’t want to be 70 when they turn 20. I have an uncle like that and it just seems unfortunate to be in that position, physically unable to really do all the things you would want to do with your kids as they grow up.

- - - Updated - - -



Accident or on purpose?
Wasnt planned ofc, I dont know many people that want kids at 21 :p. But once it happened we decided to go through with it and we also had means so made the decision easier. I never felt like I was missing out on something, seemed natural to slot into dads role. Other parents would have always thought I was her brother at playground :lol:. I'll turn 39 this year, my daughter 18 and Im shipping her off to college. :)
 

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