Giuseppe Marotta (232 Viewers)

[Vlad]

I respectfully disagree Zizi, my good man.

We are overpaying, but that's what happens with getting established stars in a sellers market.

Higgy is worth 75-80 mil easy. People talking about 60 mil are being retarded. He just scored 36 goals and broke an all-time record. He's only 28, and has a good 4-5 years left at top or near top-level and makes us a contender for those years while we search for the next young star number 9. He's a guarantee.

And FFS, this isn't about marketability or resale value. That shit is irrelevant. Especially resale. Clearly the board knows what they can afford and still be able to rejuvenate the team in coming years. They aren't sacrificing 5 years from now with 1 move.

Hence the moves for younger stars like Pjaca and Pjanic.

And Higuain becomes as marketable as the results he helps us achieve. If we win a CL with him or even play SFs or better for the next 2-3 years with him leading the attack he gains popularity and marketability.

It's a results based move any way you look at it. We overpaid by 10-15 mil. Who the heck cares. Our board knows what they are doing, a bunch of know-nothing, armchair analysts on this forum don't.

Do you know many 32, 33 year old forwards that were capable of high level performance at this age? I think it's pretty uncommon and I'd expect 2 seasons tops for Higuain to perform at high level.

I have no trouble if they pay high fee, but that player needs to perform at high level for considerable amount of time (6-7 years) for that kind of deal to make sense. Let's hope it's the case here. :xfinger: I don't care much about resale value, since a player in his prime isn't brought here for that reason, to be sold for profit once the level of his game drops.

This deal won't make sense to me if they sell Pogba. I don't think anyone in their right mind would consent to this deal only few months ago, but I guess coping mechanism is kicking in now. (I should know that, see Vidal )

Our board knows what they are doing, a bunch of know-nothing, armchair analysts on this forum don't.

Let's close the forum then. We can't discuss our board moves or Allegri's tactical decisions, since they know what they are doing and majority of discussions are around these.

 

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[Jem83]

Do you know many 32, 33 year old forwards that were capable of high level performance at this age? I think it's pretty uncommon and I'd expect 2 seasons tops for Higuain to perform at high level.

So in your world he is 30 now? 31?

 

[Vlad]

So in your world he is 30 now? 31?

wat

 

[Post Ironic]

Lots of top-level forwards perform well into their 30s...

Romario, Ibra, Drogba, C Ronaldo, Raul... Toni, inzaghi, Trez, Del Piero, Totti, Nedved... The list is endless.

 

[j0ker]

If he costs 15-20M sure, doesent have to have a resale value. We buy Matri for 18M on 2M net/4M gross wages (no idea how much wages he had here, guesing here), that means if he spends 3 seasons here and we sell for 10M, we dont make a loss. In this case, 94M + 7.5M net wages (thats what was reported), and lets say he stays here for 4 years. We would have to sell for around 54M to avoid a loss. For a 32 year old player, i doubt someone will pay it. So yes, resale value matters

Its a guess, if you have a single player that eats up so much money per year, he restricts your spending on other areas. Doesent mean we will have to spend 0€ per mercato as long as hes here, but could theoretically prevent us from taking one of our targets every year hes here

Do we need a WC striker at any cost? Id be perfectly happy with a Dybala, Mandzukic, Icardi, Gabigol attack. + Pjaca. We never bought WC players in their prime and were perfectly fine up until now, i dont get the sudden obsession here that we need a WC striker to win the CL

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80M? Never

Where did you get that 54mln?

You should check how it works, again.

 

[GordoDeCentral]

Do you know many 32, 33 year old forwards that were capable of high level performance at this age? I think it's pretty uncommon and I'd expect 2 seasons tops for Higuain to perform at high level.

I have no trouble if they pay high fee, but that player needs to perform at high level for considerable amount of time (6-7 years) for that kind of deal to make sense. Let's hope it's the case here. :xfinger: I don't care much about resale value, since a player in his prime isn't brought here for that reason, to be sold for profit once the level of his game drops.

This deal won't make sense to me if they sell Pogba. I don't think anyone in their right mind would consent to this deal only few months ago, but I guess coping mechanism is kicking in now. (I should know that, see Vidal )

Let's close the forum then. We can't discuss our board moves or Allegri's tactical decisions, since they know what they are doing and majority of discussions are around these.

 

[JCK]

Do you know many 32, 33 year old forwards that were capable of high level performance at this age? I think it's pretty uncommon and I'd expect 2 seasons tops for Higuain to perform at high level.

I have no trouble if they pay high fee, but that player needs to perform at high level for considerable amount of time (6-7 years) for that kind of deal to make sense. Let's hope it's the case here. :xfinger: I don't care much about resale value, since a player in his prime isn't brought here for that reason, to be sold for profit once the level of his game drops.

This deal won't make sense to me if they sell Pogba. I don't think anyone in their right mind would consent to this deal only few months ago, but I guess coping mechanism is kicking in now. (I should know that, see Vidal )

Let's close the forum then. We can't discuss our board moves or Allegri's tactical decisions, since they know what they are doing and majority of discussions are around these.

I agree about the resale value argument that you mention but then there are his high wages which he will hold on to and refuse lower wages in case he stops performing as he should, we want to sell him and he goes on refusing clubs left and right, we have seen that many times before.

 

[Post Ironic]

Do you know many 32, 33 year old forwards that were capable of high level performance at this age? I think it's pretty uncommon and I'd expect 2 seasons tops for Higuain to perform at high level.

I have no trouble if they pay high fee, but that player needs to perform at high level for considerable amount of time (6-7 years) for that kind of deal to make sense. Let's hope it's the case here. :xfinger: I don't care much about resale value, since a player in his prime isn't brought here for that reason, to be sold for profit once the level of his game drops.

This deal won't make sense to me if they sell Pogba. I don't think anyone in their right mind would consent to this deal only few months ago, but I guess coping mechanism is kicking in now. (I should know that, see Vidal )

Let's close the forum then. We can't discuss our board moves or Allegri's tactical decisions, since they know what they are doing and majority of discussions are around these.

I won't be happy with it, if we sell Pogba and replace him with a Witsel...

If Pogba leaves, I view Pjanic as his replacement, and then if we were to sign a top mid like Herrera, Rakitic, or Mascherano, I'd say we improved the team, and I'd be very happy.

I was including myself in that know-nothing section. Haha. But honestly, it's fun arguing about these things, specifically because we get to call each other out in such ways, when we disagree with the moves of the board. I was on the other side at the end of last summer and during the start of the season. Disagreeing with our mercato, while you preached calm and trust in our management. I'm suggesting the same.

But the forum would be a crashing bore (and the world is already full of these ) if we didn't argue about this stuff, and fall into ridiculous hyperbole.

 

[Turk_Bianconero]

Lots of top-level forwards perform well into their 30s...

Romario, Ibra, Drogba, C Ronaldo, Raul... Toni, inzaghi, Trez, Del Piero, Totti, Nedved... The list is endless.

Every single one of them is better than Higuain except Toni. None of them made transfer at 29 for a price remotely close to Higuain's.

 

[Vlad]

I agree about the resale value argument that you mention but then there are his high wages which he will hold on to and refuse lower wages in case he stops performing as he should, we want to sell him and he goes on refusing clubs left and right, we have seen that many times before.

Ofc, this might become a problem as well. Let's asume he has 4 years of contract here and in his 3rd year he doesn't reach double digits (considering his age 31/32 by then this isn't far fetched). Salary of 7.5m for that kind of player will start to look absurd and will become a burden on our budget, might prevent us to bring high level replacement the following summer.

 

[JCK]

Ofc, this might become a problem as well. Let's asume he has 4 years of contract here and in his 3rd year he doesn't reach double digits (considering his age 31/32 by then this isn't far fetched). Salary of 7.5m for that kind of player will start to look absurd and will become a burden on our budget, might prevent us to bring high level replacement the following summer.

Iaquinta/Amauri revisited but on a much higher scale.

 

[j0ker]

Ofc, this might become a problem as well. Let's asume he has 4 years of contract here and in his 3rd year he doesn't reach double digits (considering his age 31/32 by then this isn't far fetched). Salary of 7.5m for that kind of player will start to look absurd and will become a burden on our budget, might prevent us to bring high level replacement the following summer.

We can't afford to pay him for another year?

By that time our finances will most probably rise further.

 

[JCK]

I won't be happy with it, if we sell Pogba and replace him with a Witsel...

If Pogba leaves, I view Pjanic as his replacement, and then if we were to sign a top mid like Herrera, Rakitic, or Mascherano, I'd say we improved the team, and I'd be very happy.

I was including myself in that know-nothing section. Haha. But honestly, it's fun arguing about these things, specifically because we get to call each other out in such ways, when we disagree with the moves of the board. I was on the other side at the end of last summer and during the start of the season. Disagreeing with our mercato, while you preached calm and trust in our management. I'm suggesting the same.

But the forum would be a crashing bore (and the world is already full of these ) if we didn't argue about this stuff, and fall into ridiculous hyperbole.

I think the majority are on this page now bar the very few who simply refuse but then again this Higuain deal is a strange one considering the pattern this management taught us. Then again, in the end, we would all welcome him and love him when he arrives and starts bringing the goods.

 

[zizinho]

That right there costs you a 100 million, because the fee for Barbosa at 18 million was only for 40% of his ownership.

And Inter already told us no on Icardi. We tried before we sealed the deal with Higuain.


And Higuain could very well retire with us as one of the top scorers in club history as well. Is that worth less than any resale value?

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That was 15 years ago. Inflation puts that at nearly double now. Nedved became a "NEDVED" once he joined us. Higuain is already one of the top goal scorers in the world

Barbosa owns 40% of his contract so he would cost 30-35M tops if we buy the remaining 60%. His 40% would be paid through wages. Icardi is 50M and would have been here had we pushed for him. And Pjaca is already iurs, cant include him in that 100M. For 85M we would have got 2 young players that combined would have about the same wages as Higuain and would also improve our attack. We are yet to see how he does here, but I don't see him staying more than 4-5 years. We will see, at this point we only can guess.

Nedved won Serie A, Coppa Italia and UEFA Cup with Lazio, as well as made it to the final of Euro with Czech Republic. So he was Nedved before joining us, with us he only became even bigger. We are yet to see Higuain here who we bought at his absolute peak, cant see him becoming better than hes now

 

[JuveJay]

I'd say the resale argument for Higuain is almost redundant, we wouldn't be looking to sell him. He'll have his contract here then by the end will be past his physical best, these are his peak years. This signing is about trying to win the CL.

 

[KB824]

Every single one of them is better than Higuain except Toni. None of them made transfer at 29 for a price remotely close to Higuain's.

Taking into account the inflation, Nedved was very close. And Nedved was not as good as Higuain at age 28. Nedved became legendary when he got here

 

[zizinho]

It doesn't restrict our spending. We all know and the board knows we are losing Pogba in the next year or two which will cover all of Higuain's transfer and his wages basically.

Aside from the fact we can afford to lose money on the occasional player.

And yes Higuain is worth 75-80 mil. The market has changed. FFS, Martial went to ManU for 80 mil with bonuses included. Sanches to Bayern for similar. These are unproven youngsters who could very well flop over the next few years and be worth peanuts.

Pogba is worth over 120 mil. Of course Higuain smack dab in the middle of his prime years at 28, having just shattered the all-time goals record in Serie A is worth 75-80 mil. Don't be ridiculous.

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41M then is worth about 70-80M now.

And I'm sorry, why can't Higuain play here until 35-36. As in 7 years...

We are yet to see if and when we are losing Pogba. So lets stop pretending we know when he leaves.

Martial is a player that was performing for Monaco in the CL at the age of 19 and was a starter there. United will get some 12 years out of him easily or sell him for similar amount they bought him for. That was also with bonuses which ensures them that he was worth it if he meets them. Same with Sanches (who was 65M btw). Higuain is worth around 60M, same money Cavani went for to PSG (and he was 3 years younger than Higuain is now). Thats the maximum id go for him, if they refuse i would simply not buy him

And don't give me Inflation. Compare the cost to our revenue, Higuain cost us MUCH more than Nedved. Its simple as that

 

[KB824]

Barbosa owns 40% of his contract so he would cost 30-35M tops if we buy the remaining 60%. His 40% would be paid through wages. Icardi is 50M and would have been here had we pushed for him. And Pjaca is already iurs, cant include him in that 100M. For 85M we would have got 2 young players that combined would have about the same wages as Higuain and would also improve our attack. We are yet to see how he does here, but I don't see him staying more than 4-5 years. We will see, at this point we only can guess.

Nedved won Serie A, Coppa Italia and UEFA Cup with Lazio, as well as made it to the final of Euro with Czech Republic. So he was Nedved before joining us, with us he only became even bigger. We are yet to see Higuain here who we bought at his absolute peak, cant see him becoming better than hes now

I didn't include Pjaca, because his transfer had nothing to do from an economic standpoint with the Higuain transfer.

And if Gonzalo is one of the top goal scorers in the world before he got here, then he can't somehow grow in stature either?

 

[zizinho]

What you are basically saying is juventus should turn down the 100% chance to sign Higuain (untill 31st July) for a slim chance that PSG out of the blue purchases some striker (so they are 2 top forwards like last seasons), and that Cavani would be upset enough about it to leave PSG.





Basically, you want us to gamble on something pretty unlikely, and trow away something thats 100% certain.

Basically, you want us to wait untill the end of the mercato and make a panic buy most likely.




I didnt knew someone actually liked that

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Nedved AND thuram*

Both were 28 and 29

29 and 30 if, you count like they do with Higuain

Thats not what I'm saying. If a player is not worth a sum, you should not pay it regardless of if you may or may not have a chance at some other player. So what I'm saying is, dont spend 94M on a player. Try to find a player for less, and if you can't Stick to what you have. And don't give me we need to improve the attack because you've been saying for months that we are a top team as we are

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Where did you get that 54mln?

You should check how it works, again.

How much is it then?

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I didn't include Pjaca, because his transfer had nothing to do from an economic standpoint with the Higuain transfer.

And if Gonzalo is one of the top goal scorers in the world before he got here, then he can't somehow grow in stature either?

Do you think he will break the Serie A record again? Do you think he will score in CL knock out games regularly?

 

[j0ker]

Thats not what I'm saying. If a player is not worth a sum, you should not pay it regardless of if you may or may not have a chance at some other player. So what I'm saying is, dont spend 94M on a player. Try to find a player for less, and if you can't Stick to what you have. And don't give me we need to improve the attack because you've been saying for months that we are a top team as we are

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How much is it then?

After 4 years his value will be 0, he could go for free and it won't be recorded as a loss in the books.