it's also not a good strategy to engage in simplism and platitudes when you are trying to figure something out, here's an idea: ask a question. and i dont mean in a taunting or admonishing way. Homeboy doesnt know about the subject and its pretty clear too, yet he wants to have a say, i am cool with that as long as hes cool with me calling his bs. Now, river actually had a pretty good campaign and as i said somewhere else actually qualified to sudamericana but they hit a patch of poor form at the end and the pressure from its big fan base(which smaller teams dont have) got to them. This word mismanagement is thrown around without any qualifications, whos mismanaging? who is actually making most of the decisions? what kind of say do the barras and the government have in the clubs? River fans will throw in passarella or Jeta jeta, but the fact is playing or working for either river or boca is just hell.
Deneb, for someone who knows so much about Argie league, I am sure you know that River had not been relegated for 110 years, 20 of which in the Apertura/Clausura format. Now, River and Boca has always had this "fan-base" pressure on them considering they are the elite of Argie football, so how on earth can one make a half-logical argument that all of a sudden, after 110 years, River (who is the Real M of Argie football with 33 titles) bucked under that pressure and from being a finely run club, allowed that to play a major role in the team getting relegated.
I am gonna repeat that word again - "relegated" ... not losing the title and not, not finishing in the top 5 or even 10, but "relegated". So, how does a finely run club, as you seem to claim, which has won 33 titles and is basically born to live under pressure, season in season out, all of a sudden gets to B division after 110 years - sheer coincidence, you say, mixed up with bad luck? ... honestly, seriously?!
Beyond the talent drain which i exemplified with munoz, both boca and river try to recruit the best personnel and coaches from the league only for most of them to fail and falter under teh pressure. if you re dont watch the league you can see that by comparing the performance of the players who arrive at said clubs to that of those who go to other teams within the league. For instance look at teh champs velez and the ex river players it has. And this has nothing to do with mismanagement(whatever the bloody word means).
So, basically, choosing the wrong players for your team, players who cannot perform under pressure, that is, is not mismanagement? Juventus under Marotta anyone? So, you are saying Marotta's acquiring of Motta, Pepe, Martinez etc, etc is not an example of poor management.
Also, River and other Argie, no pretty much all SA, teams have existed under the talent-drain conditions for decades now and not River nor Boca have ended up in 2nd division because of that ... but hey, Mr. Passarella strolls along and everything changes ... another coincidence, maybe? ... One too many, I'd say.
What should the smaller clubs in Argie league say about the talent-drain effect the likes of River and Boca and others have on them? How come those smaller clubs managed to pull it off in the same league that got River relegated? ... too much pressure, again? What, is River full of Mottas and Aquilanis and if so, whose fault it is?
And who is responsible for this talent drain to begin with? Or letting their most talanted players leave too early or for too low transfers fees? And who is responsible for getting proper replacements for the players, who end up leaving? I am really that much of a trailblazer here in claiming that it is up to the management to get this right?
Marotta anyone?!
Now for me to give you a little lesson, before you actually jump to the rescue of someone in distress try to figure out why they got there in the first place.
Deneb, based on your arguments, not just in this case, but from what I have seen on the forum altogether, you need quite a few lessons yourself, especially on basic human interaction, before you are in the position to teach others ... don't mean this in an offensive way, just pure observation.
the same mismanagement which saw river finish last right after the won the league, some mismanagement that is or that of passarella actually refusing to sell funes mori when he could have in the 'summer' break to keep his team strong, or the alienation of buenanotte for the harmony of the squad or that actually river finished 9th in the clausura. But hey in brazil and mexico thats mismanagement.
So, you are basically claim that River management did a fine job at River even if they finished last and eventually got relegated ... because hey, they won a half-season title 3 years ago? Well, if that's the definition of fine job in Argentinian league, I wonder what you guys would define as "failure".
And I am pretty sure millions of River fans would disagree with you on River being managed well, since, you know, they won the title 3 years ago ... come to think of it, a lot Wolfsburg fans would probably dare to chip in too, given how they won the Bindesliga 2 years ago, only to barely fight off relegation this season.
P.S. Deneb, if you have come up with some other "solid" arguments you'd like to have ripped apart, let me know via PM so we can leave this thread to it's original purpose ... and don't be shy, I assure you this requires virtually no effort on my part, minus the typing, of course ... oh, and please, leave Osman out of it.
Peace
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