Wikileaks (20 Viewers)

Seven

In bocca al lupo, Fabio.
Jun 25, 2003
38,198
The law is fucking stupid. So they agreed to have sex, but did not agree to have sex without a condom? If Assange then has sex with them without a condom without their consent, that is rape. But rape like any other rape, meaning nonconsensual sex. This law is complete bollocks.

Unless the woman doesn't know what a condom looks like or didn't realise that they had sex without one.
 

Nenz

Senior Member
Apr 17, 2008
10,420
I suppose, I just don't see it happening.
Its very likely that it will happen. Governments assassinate people all the time. No country with anything to hide (and that's no country) is going to care if he is murdered.
That video is so fucked up.
I saw journalists do a follow up on the survivors of that attack. Turns out that it was just a bunch of journalists and that van that went to pick up the wounded was a father taking his daughters to school. The father is dead.

Regarding whether Assange is hero or villain. The only possible reason for not supporting this man is having something to hide. Free information is an extreme rarity. To oppose such a thing opposes the very foundations and values of liberalism. And that's the basis for democracy.
 

Seven

In bocca al lupo, Fabio.
Jun 25, 2003
38,198
The basis for a democracy is also the protection from terrorism and the freedom of minorities. A democracy needs security and a democracy needs to have limited access to some sources of information while being as trasparent as possible. It's a difficult equilibrium to mantain, but you need both.
 

Martin

Senior Member
Dec 31, 2000
56,913
The basis for a democracy is also the protection from terrorism and the freedom of minorities. A democracy needs security and a democracy needs to have limited access to some sources of information while being as trasparent as possible. It's a difficult equilibrium to mantain, but you need both.
Yeah, but wouldn't you say that some of the stuff that has been leaked clearly needs to be public?
 

Nenz

Senior Member
Apr 17, 2008
10,420
The basis for a democracy is also the protection from terrorism and the freedom of minorities. A democracy needs security and a democracy needs to have limited access to some sources of information while being as trasparent as possible. It's a difficult equilibrium to mantain, but you need both.
Very true. But if certain leaks really were endangering national security then something would have already eventuated.
 

Nenz

Senior Member
Apr 17, 2008
10,420
Yeah, but wouldn't you say that some of the stuff that has been leaked clearly needs to be public?
Some of the information does need to go public, yes. Like the US committing war crimes in Iraq. That endangers no one but the perpetrators of those crimes.
 
OP
Bjerknes

Bjerknes

"Top Economist"
Mar 16, 2004
111,573
  • Thread Starter
  • Thread Starter #310
    But you seem to be loosely basing this difference on the notion that government transparency must be absolute. If that's the case, the name of every anti-terrorist operative would be public domain and they would all be killed in a heartbeat with their covers compromised.

    My point of using personal data with Zé T was to show that not everything needs to be, nor should be, public knowledge. And the rules for violating that may not be concrete, but they do cross a sense of legality by any nature of the word.
    I'd rather have full transparency than no transparency at all, which is the case right now with this government that can't get anything right.
     

    Enron

    Tickle Me
    Moderator
    Oct 11, 2005
    75,252
    There is a question of legality in distributing the information, however. Agree with their actions or not.

    For example, how would you react should someone publish a Web site with all your credit card numbers, family members and their phone numbers, former professor and employer names and numbers, former residences, bank balances, past sexual partners, etc.?
    Well, considering Assange is using secondary information (he didn't take it himself but got it from a source) and is acting as a media outlet (Wikileaks is considered a media outlet) the distribution of the information is perfectly legal a la the Watergate scandal and the Deepthroat aftermath.

    As for your example, it doesn't really compare. As a government isn't privy to personal privacy laws, libel, etc. I think the real issue that comes into play is if Assanges leaks indirectly cause harm to US citizens.

    What Bush and Cheney did to that CIA agent a few years back is more along the lines of what your talking about.
     

    X Æ A-12

    Senior Member
    Contributor
    Sep 4, 2006
    86,697
    :lol:

    Martin, like a parked car in SF without an emergency brake, you are on a roll.



    But you seem to be loosely basing this difference on the notion that government transparency must be absolute. If that's the case, the name of every anti-terrorist operative would be public domain and they would all be killed in a heartbeat with their covers compromised.

    My point of using personal data with Zé T was to show that not everything needs to be, nor should be, public knowledge. And the rules for violating that may not be concrete, but they do cross a sense of legality by any nature of the word.
    :tup: :tup:
     

    X Æ A-12

    Senior Member
    Contributor
    Sep 4, 2006
    86,697
    Well, considering Assange is using secondary information (he didn't take it himself but got it from a source) and is acting as a media outlet (Wikileaks is considered a media outlet) the distribution of the information is perfectly legal a la the Watergate scandal and the Deepthroat aftermath.

    As for your example, it doesn't really compare. As a government isn't privy to personal privacy laws, libel, etc. I think the real issue that comes into play is if Assanges leaks indirectly cause harm to US citizens.

    What Bush and Cheney did to that CIA agent a few years back is more along the lines of what your talking about.
    Is it public yet how or from who he got ahold of the leaks?
     

    Lion

    King of Tuz
    Jan 24, 2007
    31,826
    governements are public servants hired to serve you. it`s your right to know wtf is it they do with all these huge budgets (i`m not talking about undercover agents being compromised so save it).

    people should not be afraid of governments. governments should be afraid of people.
     
    Apr 15, 2006
    56,618
    Right, so my company is advising its employees not to access the WikiLeaks website nor download any content from it while on the HP network. Fair enough, considering they're not asking us to not read them at all.

    At least we can read news articles about WikiLeaks and their leaks.
     

    Sadomin

    Senior Member
    Apr 5, 2005
    7,212
    The law is fucking stupid. So they agreed to have sex, but did not agree to have sex without a condom? If Assange then has sex with them without a condom without their consent, that is rape. But rape like any other rape, meaning nonconsensual sex. This law is complete bollocks.

    Unless the woman doesn't know what a condom looks like or didn't realise that they had sex without one.
    There is no condom-specific law. It either goes under rape or molestation, has nothing to do with the condom. Read my post a few pages back.
     

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