UK Politics (22 Viewers)

IrishZebra

Western Imperialist
Jun 18, 2006
23,327
#22
I was imressed by Nick Clegg in that debate. His manifesto has figures, the other don't they say that he is all style but in real terms he exceeds them in substance. Real change would be a Lib-Dem government, the EU-sceptic Torrie would damage the UK even more, Thatcherite bastards.

Straight-Talking, Fact Dealing, Showman. :tup:
 

AngelaL

Jinx Minx
Aug 25, 2006
10,215
#23
I can't stand the Tories.
I can't stand them either!
That's because in the Scot's language, the word 'tory' means 'thief'! It's only natural that decent Scots hate tories!

Andy, you're the resident economist here, so what is the better bet for the UK at the moment, in your very humble opinion:

a. Raising taxes and reinvesting that to try to sustain the slight improvement in the state of the economy before trying to tackle the budget deficit; or

b. Making big cuts straight away to try and tackle the budget deficit?
I'd pick 'b'. The quicker we get rid of the budget deficit; the quicker we will get out of the financial mess we're in. Option 'a' only appears to be better. In reality, it only gives a temporary 'slight improvement'. Sometimes it has to get worse before it gets better.

That's my bone of contention with Labour! They have no idea on how to control the countries finances. Their answer to money problems is borrow/spend more and it's the poor taxpayer that pays for the mess they make.

Labour are plan a and Tories are plan b.

The banks that were in danger, rightly or wrongly, are now in government hands, so they need to be dealt with.

As far as I can tell, the plan seems to be to hold on to the banks until everything improves and they can be sold off, but God knows how long that would take to happen.

What do you make of the Labour claim that the Tory plan to make significant cuts straight away would send the UK straight back into recession?
1. They should also do something about banks giving themselves (the bigwigs at the top) huge rewards for doing nothing/making bad financial performances.

2. Short term it would look bad, but long term, if they do the job right, we would pull through the recession a lot better than applying plan 'a' above and who knows, we may even have a period of prosperity, but that requires good money management on a long term basis.

I'm not entirely aware of the GDP situation in the UK, but if it is anything like it is in the US, the increase in GDP is mostly due to government spending. That's not real growth and it will dry up soon unless the government wants implode itself.
:agree:

This whole borrow and spend towards economic recovery only works in the short run at the expense of the long run and future generations. Sure, pull the stimulus out now and we will have negative GDP numbers again, but that's what needs to occur. Debts need to be cleared. It's going to happen anyway. If not, then you're only delaying the inevitable and putting the country more at risk of default.
:tup: I agree with you.

Would the Labour party rather have a major recession or government collapse? Because that what it comes down to. Their policies have been used all over the world and have never worked, from the Wiemar Republic to Japan.
You're absolutely right!
That's what happened with a previous Labour Government in the UK! It collapsed and the Tories took over: - the Thatcher years! :snoop: We (the UK taxpayer) went through hell because she had to repay the IMF or whoever the Gov't lender was, a vast fortune that had been borrowed by the previous Labour Government. The UK has never forgiven her for it. My parents cursed her weekly at least!

For my other tuppence worth, I don't think either of them are worth voting for, but we don't have a lot of choice. Coming from a family that has always voted Labour, I loathe the tories, but I have to admit that the local Labour MP has not done a lot to improve my lot or that of others in our area. It's a safe seat for him, so he just sits on his fat posterior and collects his wages and expenses for doing as little as he pleases. If he was in a marginal seat, he would have had to have done a lot more! He's spending a lot on his campaign, but I don't like junk mail! TBH, I don't know who I'll vote for: - I don't know all the candidates, let alone if I should vote for any of them. I don't think any of them are worth voting for!

:sigh: I must be getting cynical in my old age! That must be Jack's influence on me! ;)
 

Ford Prefect

Senior Member
May 28, 2009
10,557
#24
I am either voting labour or spoiling my ballot. Torries...i couldnt think of much worse (aside from the BNP). I would vote for the libdems but they are far too disorganised, they aren't united, they have no collective identity and a lot of there policies of the recent years have been ridiculous. Nick Clegg is a very good leader and a very good public speaker, and if he were leader of labour i dont think i would be considering a spoilt ballot, but the lib dems are not going to do anything good for the country. A lot of what Gordon Brown has been trying to do of late has been really positive towards economic recovery and dealing with sorting the benefit systems to get people back into employment but the tories have been organising there votes so that they can bring it in and make it into there idea. This is exactly why party politics doesn't work. They are meant to work for us, not the interest of the party.
 

Boksic

Senior Member
May 11, 2005
14,291
#25
Nick Clegg had the easiest job in the debate.

Everyone is concentrating on Labour vs Con.,they attack each other and he can sit back and look like the good guy.

They are all as bad as each other, but Torries are best of a bad bunch IMO.
 
OP
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  • Thread Starter #26
    I agree it's easiest for the Lib Dem's to look good.

    If the Tories get elected, I expect a sudden increase in the number of people supporting Scottish independence.
     
    OP
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  • Thread Starter #28
    It's rather noticeable the Tories have completely avoided speaking about Europe so far.

    The other parties should bring it up, as it usually causes some in-fighting in the Tory party.
     

    Ford Prefect

    Senior Member
    May 28, 2009
    10,557
    #31
    I agree it's easiest for the Lib Dem's to look good.

    If the Tories get elected, I expect a sudden increase in the number of people supporting Scottish independence.
    I fully support devolution, if the majority of any of the given 'countries' dont want to be in the union then shouldn't be. And they can then deal with all the repocutions that come with not being part of the union.

    I personally view us as one country, Great Britain, and not in anyway seperated (and not because i view England as being above the others and owning the others, i see all parts of the union as equal). Its mainly communities in Scotland & Wales that view everyone as sepeterate, which fundamentally goes again what i believe in...federalism :D.

    It's not like the torries would push for isolationism, further damaging british relations with friends in europe...
    The Torries want scotland independent because its a massive labour & snp area, they never get elected there.
     

    Ford Prefect

    Senior Member
    May 28, 2009
    10,557
    #32
    Just heard something that me lol hard

    When asked on Have I Got News For You, what did Nick Clegg say this week Marcus Brigstock replied - "i dont want to be prime minister, thats why im leading the lib dems"

    bahahahahahahahahahaha
     
    OP
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  • Thread Starter #33
    :D

    It's interesting how the two main parties are dealing with the Lib Dem's apparent surge in popularity.

    Labour seem to be trying to chum them up (in preparation for a coalition in a hung parliament?), while the Tories are trying to attack Lib Dem policies and undermine them (despite the Tory claim their campaign would be 'relentlessly positive').
     

    Bjerknes

    "Top Economist"
    Mar 16, 2004
    115,898
    #34
    :agree:


    :tup: I agree with you.



    You're absolutely right!
    That's what happened with a previous Labour Government in the UK! It collapsed and the Tories took over: - the Thatcher years! :snoop: We (the UK taxpayer) went through hell because she had to repay the IMF or whoever the Gov't lender was, a vast fortune that had been borrowed by the previous Labour Government. The UK has never forgiven her for it. My parents cursed her weekly at least!

    For my other tuppence worth, I don't think either of them are worth voting for, but we don't have a lot of choice. Coming from a family that has always voted Labour, I loathe the tories, but I have to admit that the local Labour MP has not done a lot to improve my lot or that of others in our area. It's a safe seat for him, so he just sits on his fat posterior and collects his wages and expenses for doing as little as he pleases. If he was in a marginal seat, he would have had to have done a lot more! He's spending a lot on his campaign, but I don't like junk mail! TBH, I don't know who I'll vote for: - I don't know all the candidates, let alone if I should vote for any of them. I don't think any of them are worth voting for!

    :sigh: I must be getting cynical in my old age! That must be Jack's influence on me! ;)
    Glad to see you agree. ;)

    The political situation in the US is very much like that in the UK from what I gather. The duopoly is nothing more than two heads on the same dragon.
     
    OP
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  • Thread Starter #35
    The third party is threatening to get enough seats this time round than no party will have an overall majority this time, Andy.

    Will probably lead to lots or haggling, only for them all to give up and call another election within a year.
     

    Ford Prefect

    Senior Member
    May 28, 2009
    10,557
    #36
    The lib dems are far too disorganised/not united to even consider having them lead the country. They would need another 4 years min before i could see as being in a state to be elected. It would be a case of the past year we have had with Labour. I think Clegg is the right guy to geteffectivley cbut they just arent in a position to effectivley challenge for the good of the country. Labour are currently the only realistic positive step forward for the country.
     

    Ford Prefect

    Senior Member
    May 28, 2009
    10,557
    #38
    you just dont agree?

    The problem i have with the party system we have is that if you dont agree with the big three you are screwed to elect someone to represent you. I currently believe that it will be our childrens generation that will make the differences to civil liberties that we our generation cant make due to the elder voting populace.

    I would love to vote libdem, i fit perfectly into there demographic but they just arent an electable part at the moment. Nick Clegg performed brilliantly in the Debates but that doesnt mean his party could effectivley bring positive changes to help move us beyond the past year of political hell.
     

    Bjerknes

    "Top Economist"
    Mar 16, 2004
    115,898
    #39
    The third party is threatening to get enough seats this time round than no party will have an overall majority this time, Andy.

    Will probably lead to lots or haggling, only for them all to give up and call another election within a year.
    What is the third party like? More fiscally conservative, not the phony conservatives?
     

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