Spoiled? (1 Viewer)

[V]

Yes and I am glad I quit, it is disgusting.
When I started dating with my gf, I immediately told her she needed to stop as soon as possible, everytime we kissed, it tasted as if I was kissing an ashtray, disagusting.

Well I quit for 2 years because of my ex so I know what you're saying. I'm all for compromise, but like I said everyone's got their vice. I just don't like those types of comments from non-smokers, they're too exagerated(disgusting habit, kissing an ashtra, etc). I can understand someone doesn't like it but give the rest of us that do their peace.

That became especially apparent when I met some of my students' parents

Erm..you teach?

I didn't say it's disgusting when I smoke, because I never have. It's a disgusting habit that people have, because it affects me when I'm around them, and in most cases they don't give a shit.

Well I'm sorry you're in such a situation. I am much more thoughtfull of non-smokers and I don't smoke in their presence, if I know it honestly bothers them. For example I'll never light one in the presence of my old man, I know it bothers him, he starts choking and can't breathe. I'll go outside where I won't bother anyone and light one. Because of that I don't like to be judged. I've met a lot of non-smokers with a houlier than thou attitude who won't get of your case just because they don't smoke. Everyone's got their own vice, I don't like having to defend myself because of mine.

 

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[Cuti]

In Malta in clubs, you don't need a smoke machine cause is enough cigarette smoke to fill a club. But i'm one of the only people in our group that do not smoke, but when we are out together(not in a club) they always ask me if they can smoke etc.

Also MODS could you ban Shakur/kostarica cause he is opening multiple threads and speaking georgian. Thanks.

 

[Martin]

I just don't like those types of comments from non-smokers, they're too exagerated(disgusting habit, kissing an ashtra, etc).

They're not exaggerated at all. This is honestly what people think of it. You may not get that, because you're used to it, but trust me it's true. Not only that, the presence of smoke permeates the air to the degree that it makes everything smell. That's absolutely horrid.

Well I'm sorry you're in such a situation. I am much more thoughtfull of non-smokers and I don't smoke in their presence, if I know it honestly bothers them. For example I'll never light one in the presence of my old man, I know it bothers him, he starts choking and can't breathe. I'll go outside where I won't bother anyone and light one. Because of that I don't like to be judged. I've met a lot of non-smokers with a houlier than thou attitude who won't get of your case just because they don't smoke. Everyone's got their own vice, I don't like having to defend myself because of mine.

People are different, of course. Everyone has undesirable habits that other people don't want to know about, and if smokers were equally discrete about smoking as they are about whatever it is you don't want people to know about, then noone would say anything. But that nature of smoking is such that it pollutes the air, it affects people around you. There is no way you can get away from this crucial difference between smoking and say drinking.

Of course, if you try to minimize the impact then people will notice. If you smoke outside so that your house won't stink from it, especially when you *live with other people*, that will be greatly appreciated. If you air out a room in which you've been smoking so that the stench is at least greatly reduced, again that will be appreciated. If you refrain from smoking in public places (which these days is finally regulated by law in many countries), again a positive gesture.

 

[V]

They're not exaggerated at all. This is honestly what people think of it. You may not get that, because you're used to it, but trust me it's true.

That's what non-smokers think of it, I disagree and find it offending. Even when I stopped smoking, the smoke bothered me but I never complained to others and I never judged them. There are lots of polutors in the air nowadays, smoke is just one of many.

Of course, if you try to minimize the impact then people will notice. If you smoke outside so that your house won't stink from it, especially when you *live with other people*, that will be greatly appreciated. If you air out a room in which you've been smoking so that the stench is at least greatly reduced, again that will be appreciated. If you refrain from smoking in public places (which these days is finally regulated by law in many countries), again a positive gesture.

I do all of the above mentioned except smoking in public places, there are non-smokig joints, those who simply can't stand it can go there. I'm against this ban smoking from everywhere propaganda. There are public places that don't allow smoking and there are those that allow, that's the way it should be.

To conclude this; I smoke, you don't. It bothers you so because of that I won't blow smoke directly in your face, in return I expect to be allowed to do what I wish and not condemned for it just because you're against it. That's all I'm saying.

 

[Martin]

That's what non-smokers think of it, I disagree and find it offending. Even when I stopped smoking, the smoke bothered me but I never complained to others and I never judged them. There are lots of polutors in the air nowadays, smoke is just one of many.

You're confusing things here. You can't claim that what people say is exaggerated. I told I don't find those statements to be exaggerated. That you don't agree with them has no bearing on them being accurate or not.

For the record, tho I am quite bullish about this in discussion, I don't actually harass smokers when I encounter them. I try to tolerate people the way they are and I don't castigate anyone. In an honest discussion like this it's quite different, here I say what I think of it.

I do all of the above mentioned except smoking in public places, there are non-smokig joints, those who simply can't stand it can go there. I'm against this ban smoking from everywhere propaganda. There are public places that don't allow smoking and there are those that allow, that's the way it should be.

This is an idealized picture that doesn't work in practice. The fact is that non-smokers will inevitably find themselves in these places anyway, and they shouldn't have to. Do you agree with the proposition that non-smokers shouldn't have to endure smoking? There are lots of cases where this system breaks down. Parents who smoke bring their children with them. Social pressures on people who are friends with smokers will also land them among smokers. Since it's the smokers who are causing the problem here, I think it's fair that they concede where there is a conflict.

 

[Martin]

To follow up on the last point. When smoking was banned in public places in Norway a few years ago (restaurants, bars etc), the debate wasn't about customers, it was about the people who work there. Can you imagine a waitress who works in a restaurant and has to endure smoke all f day because the customers are smokers? This is a serious health problem. And you can't legally discriminate in your hiring policy either, if you got it into your head that you will only hire smokers to solve this problem.

 

[chester]

And like this, a topic about a spoiled girl turns into a discussion about smoking.

Gotta love those internet forum.

 

[V]

To follow up on the last point. When smoking was banned in public places in Norway a few years ago (restaurants, bars etc), the debate wasn't about customers, it was about the people who work there. Can you imagine a waitress who works in a restaurant and has to endure smoke all f day because the customers are smokers? This is a serious health problem. And you can't legally discriminate in your hiring policy either, if you got it into your head that you will only hire smokers to solve this problem.

If I were to run a bar, disco, restaurant or whatever, the person who I would be hiring would be fully aware of that fact from the very beginning. If he/she doesn't want the health risk he/she doesn't have to take the job, there are places that legally prohibid smoking, he/she can go work there. What, I should ban smoking from my joint so I can hire a certain someone who doesn't smoke?

Non-smokers want too much, they want to exterminate smoking all together and that's pushing it. I honestly think smokers and non-smokers can can live together, it just takes a little tollerance and good will. I have friends who are smokers and non-smokers, I've been one and I've been the other, I've lived with smokers, I've lived with none smokers.

And if you do find yourself in a smoking bar for a cup of coffee every now and then, big deal, it's one hour tops, you can live through it.

Like I said I'm sorry if the situation in your household is that way, try and work things out, both sides need to tollerable, not just one.

 

[Martin]

If I were to run a bar, disco, restaurant or whatever, the person who I would be hiring would be fully aware of that fact from the very beginning. If he/she doesn't want the health risk he/she doesn't have to take the job, there are places that legally prohibid smoking, he/she can go work there. What, I should ban smoking from my joint so I can hire a certain someone who doesn't smoke?

That's not the way it works. Laws exist to protect people "whether or not they are aware of the danger". If you work at a place that endangers your health, it's not about whether you know it or whether you want to work there. In the 30s workers' unions battled for an 8h workday, which became common for everyone. So from that point on people who had to work 12h days because they couldn't afford not to no longer had to do that, whether or not they really wanted the job. The law protects workers, *all* of them.

Non-smokers want too much, they want to exterminate smoking all together and that's pushing it. I honestly think smokers and non-smokers can can live together, it just takes a little tollerance and good will. I have friends who are smokers and non-smokers, I've been one and I've been the other, I've lived with smokers, I've lived with none smokers.

That's not good enough. You obviously aren't sensitive to smoking, not now and not even before you started. Some people are. Just because you aren't bothered by it doesn't mean your experience should be the standard yardstick for everyone. It may very well be that you will never understand why it's a big problem and how it bothers people. But so be it.

As I said, smokers are the ones causing the problem here. And as long as we all accept the standard mantra that "everyone can do whatever they want as long as they don't bother other people", then that's exactly why non-smokers "want too much", precisely because they are bothered by it. It's not something we invented because we hate smokers, it's very real, and it's based on actual experience.

 

[V]

I give up Martin. I really think your viewpoint on this is completelly one-sided and you leave no room for discussion. I'm really reasonable when it comes to this problem and I'm honestly proof smokers and non-smokers can co-exist under the same roof without one side's health being impaired unwillingly.

 

[JCK]

There is no discussion here, smoking is bad, disgusting and annoying, I smoke and I know that and admit it. The most stupid thing is that I quit it just to find myself smoking once again....but I somehow know the reasons.

 

[Martin]

I give up Martin. I really think your viewpoint on this is completelly one-sided and you leave no room for discussion. I'm really reasonable when it comes to this problem and I'm honestly proof smokers and non-smokers can co-exist under the same roof without one side's health being impaired unwillingly.

vlatko, how are you forthcoming when you claim that people's experiences aren't true? How can you say that people who are bothered by smoking are just exaggerating? You are being "reasonable" to the extent that your experience should determine the rules for everyone. How is that fair?

Ask yourself this. If it really is true that non-smokers are exaggerating the problem, why on earth would they do that? Is it because we hate you? What reason could we possibly have? Except it being true.

 

[Martin]

There is no discussion here, smoking is bad, disgusting and annoying, I smoke and I know that and admit it. The most stupid thing is that I quit it just to find myself smoking once again....but I somehow know the reasons.

Yeah, that's what most smokers say. I just wish people weren't so impressionable in their youth to be fooled by this in the first place.

 

[JCK]

Marts, do you have the verb "fimpa" in Norwegian?

 

[JCK]

Yeah, that's what most smokers say. I just wish people weren't so impressionable in their youth to be fooled by this in the first place.

But it is not the habit that brings me back to the cigarette, it is something else.

 

[Martin]

Marts, do you have the verb "fimpa" in Norwegian?

No, what does it mean?

But it is not the habit that brings me back to the cigarette, it is something else.

At the risk of generalizing, at least it would seem that most people start smoking in their teens because of social pressures. And then it becomes a habit and 10 years later they wish they never started. Of course there are exceptions always.

 

[JCK]

No, what does it mean?



At the risk of generalizing, at least it would seem that most people start smoking in their teens because of social pressures. And then it becomes a habit and 10 years later they wish they never started. Of course there are exceptions always.

En fimpa is the cigarette filter, to fimpa is to turn off the cigarette and leave the filter around

 

[V]

vlatko, how are you forthcoming when you claim that people's experiences aren't true? How can you say that people who are bothered by smoking are just exaggerating? You are being "reasonable" to the extent that your experience should determine the rules for everyone. How is that fair?

Ask yourself this. If it really is true that non-smokers are exaggerating the problem, why on earth would they do that? Is it because we hate you? What reason could we possibly have? Except it being true.

That's not at all what I said, I said words that you use to describe the babit are exaggerated, like andy said; "kissing an ash tray", that is something that's exaggerated. I've kissed smokers and been kissed, never did it taste like an ash-tray.

And I never said I am a standard for everyone else, I'm just implying with tollerance and good will from both sides compromise can be easily found.

I don't deny there is a problem, but non-smokers are doing nothig to help solve it either. The attitude "it's bad for us, everybody must stop doing it" is wrong IMO. Like I told you I respect people that have a problem with it, my Dad is the best example, and I'll do everything I can to not hurt them and make them suffer. In return I only ask the same thing, if I want to smoke on the freaking balcony or in my room where I don't bother anyone why shouldn't I? The non-smokers in my home see it that way and don't give me problems.

 

[Rami]

children are in their own nature rebellious . children who aren't rebellious aren't so because of their parents .
the problem is exactly that of the parents but not in the way everyone thinks , parents are actually restricting their kids too much therefore their kids become hooligans . if kids are given the right amount of space then they will understand what theyre doing is wrong .

Ya just take a look at Kostarica

 

[Martin]

En fimpa is the cigarette filter, to fimpa is to turn off the cigarette and leave the filter around

And why do you bring that up? :/