Shooting in USA-thread. (4 Viewers)

OP
Fake Melo

Fake Melo

Ghost Division
Sep 3, 2010
37,077
  • Thread Starter
  • Thread Starter #103
    I read some comments and replies on the Obama's facebook post about gun related deaths.

    To say I was surprised would be an understatement, many seemed to think that if they give their guns away terrorists would invade US. And how US saved EU's ass many times during wars, which I would agree. But what I don't understand is how does an average joe having a shotgun or m16 contribute to any of that? How am I safe if for eg. @swag has a gun at his home? Aren't the armed forces responsible for internal and foreign security?

    What a time to be alive (@bianconero_aus), from thousand miles away I could see their IQ tests came back negative.
    Twitter last night was full of rednecks saying "don't blame the guns" for the tragic even that happened in Oregon.

    Btw as far as US saving Europe many times in Europe during WWII I'd say Russia did more.
     

    swag

    L'autista
    Administrator
    Sep 23, 2003
    84,749
    Patrick Swayze, Lea Thompson, Charlie Sheen, Howard Dean Stanton... what's not to like in the 80s about Red Dawn? :D
     

    Zacheryah

    Senior Member
    Aug 29, 2010
    42,251
    And how US saved EU's ass many times during wars, which I would agree. .
    Russia was by far the nation who had the biggest impact on the Nazi's losing WWII.
    If ze Germans did their history about Napoleon and invading russia in the fucking winter, and like, didnt, there was no way normandy was remotely possible.
     

    Hust

    Senior Member
    Hustini
    May 29, 2005
    93,702
    it's 2 fold, a deep mistruts of the government(warranted) and the movie red dawn. @Hustini
    Depends, X.

    The original or the remake?

    - - - Updated - - -

    I read some comments and replies on the Obama's facebook post about gun related deaths.

    To say I was surprised would be an understatement, many seemed to think that if they give their guns away terrorists would invade US. And how US saved EU's ass many times during wars, which I would agree. But what I don't understand is how does an average joe having a shotgun or m16 contribute to any of that? How am I safe if for eg. @swag has a gun at his home? Aren't the armed forces responsible for internal and foreign security?

    What a time to be alive (@bianconero_aus), from thousand miles away I could see their IQ tests came back negative.
    The point isn't supposed to be your neighbor being safer because the guy 10 houses down has a shotgun, rather, the guy 10 houses down with the shotgun is safer and so is his family.

    - - - Updated - - -

    And law enforcement is a reactive measure not a proactive measure for the most part.... Disarming civilians gives criminals the upper hand because in the immediate sense, the police haven't been alarmed and when they do they still need to get to the scene of the crime.

    - - - Updated - - -

    It's about the illusionary theater of control. Americans have watched too many Schwarzenegger movies to rely on someone else, so they all believe they can shoot the 100 bad guys with zero friendly fire targets like they're starring in a Hollywood movie.
    Who is this "relying on someone else?" How is a parent defending his family from a burglar have anything to do with an Arnold movie?

    Absolutely nothing. You assume we are all gun totin' hoopin' n a hollerin' bible thumpin' white guys chasing shadows...
     

    swag

    L'autista
    Administrator
    Sep 23, 2003
    84,749
    Who is this "relying on someone else?" How is a parent defending his family from a burglar have anything to do with an Arnold movie?

    Absolutely nothing. You assume we are all gun totin' hoopin' n a hollerin' bible thumpin' white guys chasing shadows...
    It's about not relying on anything besides yourself ... neighborhood watches to the public safety system ... to take matters into your own hands.

    Defending your family from a burglar has everything to do with the culture of independent justice, nobody-can-touch-me, etc. that Schwarzenegger movies catered to in America. We eat that shit up because we all like to think we are just like him in those movies. We put on the distortion goggles and dream we are superheroes even at the peril of our family members more readily committing suicide as a more realistic outcome of our decisions and actions.
     

    Hust

    Senior Member
    Hustini
    May 29, 2005
    93,702
    It's about not relying on anything besides yourself ... neighborhood watches to the public safety system ... to take matters into your own hands.

    Defending your family from a burglar has everything to do with the culture of independent justice, nobody-can-touch-me, etc. that Schwarzenegger movies catered to in America. We eat that shit up because we all like to think we are just like him in those movies. We put on the distortion goggles and dream we are superheroes even at the peril of our family members more readily committing suicide as a more realistic outcome of our decisions and actions.
    Me protecting my family has absolutely nothing to do with the movies or a "nobody can touch me" theme you are purporting. I am fairly certain that if I was ever in that position the last thing that would cross my mind is a Marvel superhero or an Arnold flashback from the 80's.

    ---

    If anything it would be Rambo.
     

    Wings

    Banter era connoiseur
    Contributor
    Jul 15, 2002
    21,545
    Something is really off if you can't feel safe without a gun in one of the most developed countries in the world. I've lived in both high & low crime rate countries. While in Kenya I was fortunate never to have been robbed, while my friends who have, simply complied to the burglars. They mostly left without injuring anyone. In Sweden I've had my bike stolen & had my apartment's attic burglarised. In both cases I have never ever thought that if I had a gun things would have been better.
     

    swag

    L'autista
    Administrator
    Sep 23, 2003
    84,749
    Me protecting my family has absolutely nothing to do with the movies or a "nobody can touch me" theme you are purporting. I am fairly certain that if I was ever in that position the last thing that would cross my mind is a Marvel superhero or an Arnold flashback from the 80's.

    ---

    If anything it would be Rambo.
    I disagree. The whole "Taken" franchise is built off of exactly that. Superhero movies are entirely built off the fantasy of the myth of the noble individual who can right his world around him as he cannot depend on his fellow men for security.

    Arming yourself to protect your family is never a rational decision, given basic statistical outcomes, unless you are a drug lord or hitman. It's largely an emotional decision. That's not a moral judgment but rather just how things are with human nature and epidemiological probabilities.

    Ration doesn't sell movies. Movie imagery does not profit from rationalism. But emotions? Absolutely.

    You may not be thinking about Rambo and the invincibility of one when you're firing off rounds in the dark at a suspicious noise. But you would not be in that situation in the first place if your brain didn't feed off the same juice that jacks you when you see those movies.
     

    j0ker

    Capo di tutti capi
    Jan 5, 2006
    22,892
    Depends, X.

    The original or the remake?

    - - - Updated - - -



    The point isn't supposed to be your neighbor being safer because the guy 10 houses down has a shotgun, rather, the guy 10 houses down with the shotgun is safer and so is his family.

    - - - Updated - - -

    And law enforcement is a reactive measure not a proactive measure for the most part.... Disarming civilians gives criminals the upper hand because in the immediate sense, the police haven't been alarmed and when they do they still need to get to the scene of the crime.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Who is this "relying on someone else?" How is a parent defending his family from a burglar have anything to do with an Arnold movie?

    Absolutely nothing. You assume we are all gun totin' hoopin' n a hollerin' bible thumpin' white guys chasing shadows...
    Dod you even read what I wrote?
     
    OP
    Fake Melo

    Fake Melo

    Ghost Division
    Sep 3, 2010
    37,077
  • Thread Starter
  • Thread Starter #117
    Russia was by far the nation who had the biggest impact on the Nazi's losing WWII.
    If ze Germans did their history about Napoleon and invading russia in the fucking winter, and like, didnt, there was no way normandy was remotely possible.
    They didn't invade Russia in the winter, it's a myth.

    The plan was to invade Russia in May, but due to floods and Germany helping out Italy in the Balkan campaign it was delayed.

    Germany launched Operation Barbarossa in June 1941, and they planned that the whole campaign would be over before Christmas.

    Sure the harsh winter was one of the factors why Nazi Germany lost in Russia, but there were so many other reasons well.

    Muddy roads, bad decisions by Hitler/his generals, partisan attacks, Soviet courage, the shortage of German supplies, and Stalin freeing up Siberian soldiers from the Soviet far east and sending them all out attack on the tired Germans were all very important factors.

    Napoloen didn't invade Russia in the winter either, he launched his campaign 24th June (Hitler launched his 22nd June).

    You know who did invade Russia in the winter? The mongols. And they ripped Russia in two. The Poles also invaded Russia successfully in the winter, so did the Japanese.

    Enough history for today folks.
     

    Martin

    Senior Member
    Dec 31, 2000
    56,913
    They didn't invade Russia in the winter, it's a myth.

    The plan was to invade Russia in May, but due to floods and Germany helping out Italy in the Balkan campaign it was delayed.

    Germany launched Operation Barbarossa in June 1941, and they planned that the whole campaign would be over before Christmas.

    Sure the harsh winter was one of the factors why Nazi Germany lost in Russia, but there were so many other reasons well.

    Muddy roads, bad decisions by Hitler/his generals, partisan attacks, Soviet courage, the shortage of German supplies, and Stalin freeing up Siberian soldiers from the Soviet far east and sending them all out attack on the tired Germans were all very important factors.

    Napoloen didn't invade Russia in the winter either, he launched his campaign 24th June (Hitler launched his 22nd June).

    You know who did invade Russia in the winter? The mongols. And they ripped Russia in two. The Poles also invaded Russia successfully in the winter, so did the Japanese.

    Enough history for today folks.
    that was quite an intervention, Mel
     

    Fred

    Senior Member
    Oct 2, 2003
    41,113
    They didn't invade Russia in the winter, it's a myth.

    The plan was to invade Russia in May, but due to floods and Germany helping out Italy in the Balkan campaign it was delayed.

    Germany launched Operation Barbarossa in June 1941, and they planned that the whole campaign would be over before Christmas.

    Sure the harsh winter was one of the factors why Nazi Germany lost in Russia, but there were so many other reasons well.

    Muddy roads, bad decisions by Hitler/his generals, partisan attacks, Soviet courage, the shortage of German supplies, and Stalin freeing up Siberian soldiers from the Soviet far east and sending them all out attack on the tired Germans were all very important factors.

    Napoloen didn't invade Russia in the winter either, he launched his campaign 24th June (Hitler launched his 22nd June).

    You know who did invade Russia in the winter? The mongols. And they ripped Russia in two. The Poles also invaded Russia successfully in the winter, so did the Japanese.

    Enough history for today folks.
    Wow man, I'm impressed :p
     

    Zacheryah

    Senior Member
    Aug 29, 2010
    42,251
    They didn't invade Russia in the winter, it's a myth.

    The plan was to invade Russia in May, but due to floods and Germany helping out Italy in the Balkan campaign it was delayed.

    Germany launched Operation Barbarossa in June 1941, and they planned that the whole campaign would be over before Christmas.

    Sure the harsh winter was one of the factors why Nazi Germany lost in Russia, but there were so many other reasons well.

    Muddy roads, bad decisions by Hitler/his generals, partisan attacks, Soviet courage, the shortage of German supplies, and Stalin freeing up Siberian soldiers from the Soviet far east and sending them all out attack on the tired Germans were all very important factors.

    Napoloen didn't invade Russia in the winter either, he launched his campaign 24th June (Hitler launched his 22nd June).

    You know who did invade Russia in the winter? The mongols. And they ripped Russia in two. The Poles also invaded Russia successfully in the winter, so did the Japanese.

    Enough history for today folks.
    While thats all a nice sidenote, the point remains that Russia had a much greater part in Nazi Germany's defeat, compared to the US.
     

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