Shooting in USA-thread. (10 Viewers)

[Juventino[RUS]]

They support the BLM terrorists. It's absolutely despicable how leaders like Obama & Lynch can support such divisiveness in their own country.

#aussielivesdoesntmatter

 

Buy on AliExpress.com

[Seven]

A lot of youth in these urban communities have a massive chip on their shoulder and find it necessary to immediately pop an attitude with an officer when it isn't even necessary. As soon as you try to enforce the law they push back. See it all the time in DC.

Conversely, where I grew up in white trash areas around town you saw white youth doing and acting in the exact same way.

Moral: regardless of your color, mind your P's and Q's when dealing with law and the law will respond accordingly.

But why be obedient to a person that is clearly incompetent? The real issue is that most people join the police because they suck at everything else. So you get untalented, often stupid people in a position of power they would never be in under normal circumstances. It's only a matter of time before they start abusing it. And once they do, every action of theirs is seen as abuse. Doesn't matter anymore that they got it right this one time.

Nah it's even worse, they have 0 trust in the system and therefore consider cops/govt the enemy, and the liberal policies only further push the victim agenda, affirmative action was a great disservice to the black community.

Cops often are the enemy. I'm not a part of any minority in Belgium (at least that I am aware of) and I still can't stand police. Mostly that's because I read through their reports on a daily basis and I see them fuck up the most basic things.

 

[Juventino[RUS]]

But why be obedient to a person that is clearly incompetent? The real issue is that most people join the police because they suck at everything else. So you get untalented, often stupid people in a position of power they would never be in under normal circumstances. It's only a matter of time before they start abusing it. And once they do, every action of theirs is seen as abuse. Doesn't matter anymore that they got it right this one time.



Cops often are the enemy. I'm not a part of any minority in Belgium (at least that I am aware of) and I still can't stand police. Mostly that's because I read through their reports on a daily basis and I see them fuck up the most basic things.

Anti Semitic, hate cops, you are freaking disgrace

 

[Seven]

Anti Semitic, hate cops, you are freaking disgrace

Are you aware that you're Russian?

 

[Juventino[RUS]]

Are you aware that you're Russian?

But at the same time he loves Muslims closed neighborhoods.... Hmmm you are some kind of radical Islamist or something? They hate Jews and cops too

 

[ALC]

Fuck the 5.0.

 

[Juventino[RUS]]

Killed by the police in the us in the last half of the year - 235 whites, 123 blacks, 79 Spanish talking but only black lives does matter other doesn't

 

[Hust]

But why be obedient to a person that is clearly incompetent? The real issue is that most people join the police because they suck at everything else. So you get untalented, often stupid people in a position of power they would never be in under normal circumstances. It's only a matter of time before they start abusing it. And once they do, every action of theirs is seen as abuse. Doesn't matter anymore that they got it right this one time.

Most police officers/federal agents I have met are far from being the bottom of the barrel in life. The cops working the day ship at the local shopping mall with the easy job, yeah, maybe you have a case. But the cops working the night shift in the bad part of town are much sharper. I do agree to an extent, your point holds true, but only to an extent.

Lastly, if you do encounter an absolute moron with a badge your first instinct shouldn't be to fight or argue your way out of the situation, it should be obvious by now that isn't going to make things better. There are other more legal means to pursuit if that is the case and you should lodge a complaint, heck, even go to the media if necessary.

- - - Updated - - -

They support the BLM terrorists. It's absolutely despicable how leaders like Obama & Lynch can support such divisiveness in their own country.

Disclaimer: Hoori, this is my first post I agree with him on if you what to jot it down for the record.

- - - Updated - - -

Nah it's even worse, they have 0 trust in the system and therefore consider cops/govt the enemy, and the liberal policies only further push the victim agenda, affirmative action was a great disservice to the black community.

Yet they continue to vote for big government.

Can't agree with you, of course, I'm not allowed to because I run the risk of being cute.

 

[Seven]

Most police officers/federal agents I have met are far from being the bottom of the barrel in life. The cops working the day ship at the local shopping mall with the easy job, yeah, maybe you have a case. But the cops working the night shift in the bad part of town are much sharper. I do agree to an extent, your point holds true, but only to an extent.

Lastly, if you do encounter an absolute moron with a badge your first instinct shouldn't be to fight or argue your way out of the situation, it should be obvious by now that isn't going to make things better. There are other more legal means to pursuit if that is the case and you should lodge a complaint, heck, even go to the media if necessary.

Of course there are competent cops too. But you don't see those on the news. Why? Because the very fact they're competent means that they won't shoot just because they got spooked. Competence means being able to assess whether opening fire is justified or not. Apparently, many police officers are not able to make the correct call. I don't know if it's racism. Maybe it isn't. Maybe they are subconsciously thinking that African Americans commit more crimes and are more likely to kill police officers. Maybe that's why their fear is understandable. But none of that justifies shooting people. At the very least it's gross incompetence. And if you're that incompetent with a gun, yeah, I want you punished. And punished hard.

And of course it's stupid to fight a moron with a badge. Talking back to cops is always a stupid idea, no matter how much of a moron the cop might be. But in some of these cases shots were fired for absolutely nothing and virtually immediately.

- - - Updated - - -

Goddamn, how many times did i got out of a serious fine, because i was immediatly admitting my wrong and appologising when i was driving double the speed limit. Avoided a ticket two weeks ago for beeing parked on the street next to the nightshop with 4 indicators on cause to lazy to park it, getting verbally shafted by a police officer, who was frustrated and just wanted to give me a good fine. Nah, i let him shout at me, admitted it was wrong and appologised.

No ticket. Sometimes you just have to suck it up.

You're a white Western European male in your thirties. You're about as privileged as you can be in this world. If you park your car in the wrong space and a cop tells you you shouldn't do that, yes, by all means, you should just 'suck it up'. Because you're fucking wrong anyway.

But tell me, how many random passport checks you have been subjected to over the past yera?

 

[king Ale]

Great point about the relativism that exists between different races, nationalities, and people.

But this is politics in terms of political change. When you are a minority, you will always be overlooked. It's not just America... it's the world. About the only exception is women, because they strangely make a majority of people and yet have a minority status.

If you keep your issues insular, they remain insular. If you attribute them to universal values, you have a greater shot at building a majority momentum to enact change. Yes, you sacrifice "your thing" and your exclusive identity by broadening it. But you're effectively marginalizing your cause, ensuring you stay on the fringes and pretty much condemning it to ineffectiveness if you keep it as your insular thing.

And as I point out above, framing it as exclusively a "black thing" is one perspective but it's not the only one and thus is not representative of the greater problem. It doesn't account for all the white-on-white lethal policing in predominantly white states like Wyoming and West Virginia.

This is why political coalitions matter all over the world. Without them, no single party in Greece gets elected, for example.

I know it's not just America, you're talking to a woman who comes from Iran I actually think that the US is very very very caring of its minorities. But I don't see it so much as a minority problem as it is imo a stereotyping problem that can be translated into a race problem. That's why crime stats and self-defense arguments are worth listening to and thinking about to say the least. When we talk about stats and past records of a particular group, we are stereotyping. It's not bad per se, because such (sometimes unconscious) categorization can indeed save our lives from time to time. But when it goes too far, as is evident in some of the latest famous examples, the stereotyped group (i.e., blacks) can interpret it as their lack of human value as perceived by the society. My problem with your bringing up white-on-white lethal policing is that only because no one talks about that (which is bad, I understand) doesn't mean we shouldn't be talking about police brutality on blacks. Only when this blm thing started did I hear people complaining about police brutality on whites. It's hypocritical imo. No talks, no complains, no framing the problem as a human rights problem, but then suddenly when a group is finally saying something, those who were silent yesterday remember all the problems in the world and want that group to include all of those if they want their cause to be accepted by them.

p.s. reading your posts is a joy (I wish i'd be able to hang out with you in person ). The perspective you offer is so rich it takes me time to decide for myself where exactly I stand relative to that. This issue is something i'm not yet really certain about. I can't see it as an American problem so I see it as a human problem, which may be wrong given the context. I may share your stand on this in the near future

- - - Updated - - -

Disclaimer: Hoori, this is my first post I agree with him on if you what to jot it down for the record.

- - - Updated - - -

Yet they continue to vote for big government.

Can't agree with you, of course, I'm not allowed to because I run the risk of being cute.

I found/find it annoying so I just said it, but that's just a person's opinion, who gives a crap. I actually disliked myself a little bit for saying that but i was annoyed

Sorry, and you can them as much as you want.

- - - Updated - - -

Cops often are the enemy. I'm not a part of any minority in Belgium (at least that I am aware of) and I still can't stand police. Mostly that's because I read through their reports on a daily basis and I see them fuck up the most basic things.

Low status + high power is the worst combination.

 

[swag]

I know it's not just America, you're talking to a woman who comes from Iran

True dat. Though my friend Farzaneh does pretty well for herself. (And would probably commit suicide if she'd have to go back to Iran and live in the society there.)

I actually think that the US is very very very caring of its minorities. But I don't see it so much as a minority problem as it is imo a stereotyping problem that can be translated into a race problem. That's why crime stats and self-defense arguments are worth listening to and thinking about to say the least. When we talk about stats and past records of a particular group, we are stereotyping. It's not bad per se, because such (sometimes unconscious) categorization can indeed save our lives from time to time. But when it goes too far, as is evident in some of the latest famous examples, the stereotyped group (i.e., blacks) can interpret it as their lack of human value as perceived by the society. My problem with your bringing up white-on-white lethal policing is that only because no one talks about that (which is bad, I understand) doesn't mean we shouldn't be talking about police brutality on blacks. Only when this blm thing started did I hear people complaining about police brutality on whites. It's hypocritical imo. No talks, no complains, no framing the problem as a human rights problem, but then suddenly when a group is finally saying something, those who were silent yesterday remember all the problems in the world and want that group to include all of those if they want their cause to be accepted by them.

You're right in that the white-on-white police violence example only came out as a counter-example to refute the perspective of it being purely a racial issue. Nobody was complaining about it before ... other than every 15-year-old who drinks and smokes a joint now and then hate the harassment of those "power-mad pigs".

But you don't get much change by purely appealing to the minority is my point. Is it more important to have a minority voice that's heard or to actually have the root of the evil addressed somewhat? A choice has to be made which is more critical. If the former, then this is more along the lines of Rosie Perez in the movie White Men Can't Jump:

"If I'm thirsty, I don't want a glass of water. I want you to sympathize. I want you to say, 'Gloria, I too know what it feels like to be thirsty. I too have had a dry mouth.' I want you to connect with me through sharing and understanding the concept of dry mouthedness."

If the latter, the strategy is about making the white majority feel threatened by the very same dangers black America faces every day. If you make white America shit-scared that a cop might blow them away when pulling their car over for a broken tail light, then you will get change.

So which is it that needs to win here? Sympathy or change?

p.s. reading your posts is a joy (I wish i'd be able to hang out with you in person ). The perspective you offer is so rich it takes me time to decide for myself where exactly I stand relative to that. This issue is something i'm not yet really certain about. I can't see it as an American problem so I see it as a human problem, which may be wrong given the context. I may share your stand on this in the near future

You rule, Hoori. I would so love to do that. Gotta find a reason to be out in NY sometime in the near future.

 

[Juventino[RUS]]

Fuck any member of the black lives matter movement , they are like crazy feminist bitches just moan and moan

 

[Layce Erayce]

They support the BLM terrorists. It's absolutely despicable how leaders like Obama & Lynch can support such divisiveness in their own country.

I think divisive language like this contributes to the problem.

Criticize BLM if you want. I have, extensively. But terrorists? That's exactly the over the top rhetoric that contributes to the divisiveness.

Instead, look at them as misguided people trying to solve a legitimate problem ineffectively.

 

[Mohad]

I think divisive language like this contributes to the problem.

Criticize BLM if you want. I have, extensively. But terrorists? That's exactly the over the top rhetoric that contributes to the divisiveness.

Instead, look at them as misguided people trying to solve a legitimate problem ineffectively.

Probably he confused BPP with BLM.

 

[campionesidd]

Killed by the police in the us in the last half of the year - 235 whites, 123 blacks, 79 Spanish talking but only black lives does matter other doesn't

Thousands of black lives killed by other black people don't matter apparently.
Having said that, police brutality is a huge problem, regardless of race. 500 people killed is simply unacceptable.

 

[king Ale]

True dat. Though my friend Farzaneh does pretty well for herself. (And would probably commit suicide if she'd have to go back to Iran and live in the society there.)



You're right in that the white-on-white police violence example only came out as a counter-example to refute the perspective of it being purely a racial issue. Nobody was complaining about it before ... other than every 15-year-old who drinks and smokes a joint now and then hate the harassment of those "power-mad pigs".

But you don't get much change by purely appealing to the minority is my point. Is it more important to have a minority voice that's heard or to actually have the root of the evil addressed somewhat? A choice has to be made which is more critical. If the former, then this is more along the lines of Rosie Perez in the movie White Men Can't Jump:



If the latter, the strategy is about making the white majority feel threatened by the very same dangers black America faces every day. If you make white America shit-scared that a cop might blow them away when pulling their car over for a broken tail light, then you will get change.

So which is it that needs to win here? Sympathy or change?

Change, but that is only if we agree with the premise that the outcome of the former is only sympathy. What you say is ideal but I think the cause is becoming sort of diluted when we include people to whom the problem is not that integral.

Btw, while I understand the concept of blm, I'm not necessarily a proponent of what the movement does. In situations like these, hype x persistence (or even precision) is often a constant and that is likely a pitfall for this movement too.

 

[GordoDeCentral]

Fuck the 5.0.

2 questions, can you ensure your safety and that of loved ones without police presence? Also would you be able to do a better job had you been a cop?

 

[swag]

Change, but that is only if we agree with the premise that the outcome of the former is only sympathy. What you say is ideal but I think the cause is becoming sort of diluted when we include people to whom the problem is not that integral.

Btw, while I understand the concept of blm, I'm not necessarily a proponent of what the movement does. In situations like these, hype x persistence (or even precision) is often a constant and that is likely a pitfall for this movement too.

BLM is sort of stealing a page from ACT UP during the AIDS activism of the US in the 1990s. It's even got a little Westboro Baptist Church in its tactics. It's great for awareness and awareness is key.

But all the awareness in the world wasn't going to change public policy towards AIDS, for example, which really started as a "gay man's disease" and thus supposedly was of no concern to anyone else. But then the mainstream Rock Hudsons started dying of it. Then the Magic Johnsons started talking about becoming HIV positive. Then everything changed. Then you got George W Bush donating millions to Africa to help eradicate it. Then white, heterosexual America realizes that they're not granted AIDS immunity because of the color of their skin or whom they choose to sleep with. That's the power of change when what seems to primarily affect an isolated minority group blows up to something more universal.

I'm not saying that BLM won't help enact some change (and not merely sympathy) if they keep the focus on it being a minority thing. But they're tying both arms behind their back and tying their legs together by doing so.

That said, there's a lot of history to suggest that a lot of people in the black community are immensely frustrated that nobody is listening to them ... to their stories ... to the challenges they have to face that many others do not. (See: Flint, MI.) You can't underestimate the power and value in being heard when you've felt you had no voice. So I bet there's a lot of people so amped about finally having a platform for their unique voices that they're unwilling to give any of that up... even if it means sacrificing the podium a little to enable broader change and impact on their root issues by a broader concensus.

 

[GordoDeCentral]

Why are Nigerian, west indians and other black immigrants successful in America but native ones aren't.

 

[IliveForJuve]

Why are Nigerian, west indians and other black immigrants successful in America but native ones aren't.

The same reason most native indios stay poor in Bolivia.