Post of the month: November - nominations (1 Viewer)

[HelterSkelter]

will you buy me a new underwear if i do?i hate my current one.

 

Buy on AliExpress.com

[bianconero]

 

[Lawnchair Bes]

i ll mail it myself

 

[Bozi]

http://www.juventuz.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1211923&postcount=150

Ok, after much research, thought & deliberation I am going to try to provide some kind of answer to this debate. Bear with me, here goes.

To define greatness is the hardest part of the arguement. Obviously every Juventino will say il bianconeri are the greatest club in the world, otherwise how could that man claim to be a Juventino, why support them if you don't hold that very belief close to your heart?

However, trying to be unbiased & objective about this, which club(s) can claim to be greater than Juventus? Firstly, who are the greatest teams from each major footballing nation? I think the definative list would read:

UK - Liverpool
Germany - Bayern
Netherlands - Ajax
Portugal - Benfica
Spain - Real Madrid
France - Marseille
Italy - Juventus

These clubs are chosen on domestic sucess, fan base & world wide support/identity.

Now, how to rank their domestic achievements? I figured the best ranking system is that used by UEFA in the Golden Boot top scorer rankings, which gives each league a multiplier, depending on strength of the league. Spain, Italy, Germany, France and England are all given a multiplier of 2, Dutch & Portuguese leagues a 1.5. So, mulitplying the number of titles won by this number gives the following results;

Real - 58
Juventus - 54
Benfica - 46.5
Ajax - 43.5
Bayern - 40
Liverpool - 36
Marseille - 16

Then I felt the need to add domestic cups, at the value of half a league title, and UEFA cup victories at the same value as a league title. Factoring in CL/European Cups was more difficult, but finally decided that it must be worth 2 league titles. At this stage I also felt the need to bring Milan into the equation, as their continental sucess far exceeds our own, as well as Manchester Utd & Barca, due to their worldwide reputations. The following points totals were thus reached;

Real Madrid - 97
Juventus - 77
Bayern - 71
Liverpool - 69
Ajax - 69
Barca - 68
Benfica - 67.5
Milan - 51
Man Utd - 51
Marsielle - 30

These rankings show that the clubs I added rank some way behind the original list, & that Marsielle are even further out & thus are discounted from the discussion. Looking at the above table I find the top 5 to be a fair reflection of the rankings in Europe in terms of size, sucess & percieved "greatness". Real Madrid ARE head & shoulders above the rest, esp when you consider that in 51 years of the European Cup, they have won approx 1 in 5. Our domestic glory, even only counted 27 titles (that nearly killed me!), added to our huge worldwide fan base, plus 2 European cup wins & 5 losing finals apperances is enough to put us above Bayern, who's league is somewhat weaker, despite 4 EC wins. Liverpool & Ajax make up the top 5, & rightly so. Fans of all 5 clubs could argue all day about the final order they should take, but clearly these ARE Europes top 5 clubs, & I feel my ranking system is fair.

The answer to the original question, how many European teams are greater than Juve, is one, Real Madrid. Hope this helps, either solving the arguement or giving more reason to continue it!

exellent post here and a lot of thought went into it to really settle a discussion
well done adam

 

[mikhail]

I disagree. By Adam's criteria, Notts Forrest may be a greater club than Man Utd, and regardless, the numbers chosen for winning each competition are entirely arbitrary.

 

[Jem83]

:rofl2:

 

[Elvin]

Damn, stuck between Adam's and Erik's posts...

hmmm

 

[bianconero]

Damn, stuck between Adam's and Erik's posts...

hmmm

Ouch!

 

[Elvin]

 

[Zé Tahir]

I don't get it

 

[JuveAdam]

I disagree. By Adam's criteria, Notts Forrest may be a greater club than Man Utd, and regardless, the numbers chosen for winning each competition are entirely arbitrary.

Sorry for going off topic a little here, but need to defend myself & my system (ooh came over all Luciano Moggi there for a second!) But Nottingham Forest come nowhere near the level of Manchester United, or even Marsielle for that matter. Their megre achievements are;

1x English League win = 2pts
2x European Cup win = 8
2x FA Cup wins = 2

Giving Notts Forest a grand total of 12, not to mention their small club status, lack of fan base or worldwide recognition. Sorry.

 

[/usr/bin]

I don't get it

it's a post.. get it? ha-ha? umpkin:

 

[Zé Tahir]

it's a post.. get it? ha-ha? umpkin:

That is so lame

 

[Jem83]

That is so lame

Noooooo :toast:

It's excellent.

Just look at it. It's the "POST OF THE MONTH".

 

[Bisco]

http://www.juventuz.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1211923&postcount=150


exellent post here and a lot of thought went into it to really settle a discussion
well done adam

def a superb post by juveadam and therefore is my nominee for this month. thanks for the effort and time u actually put trying to end this debate about who is greater than juventus.int:

 

[snoop6]

def a superb post by juveadam and therefore is my nominee for this month. thanks for the effort and time u actually put trying to end this debate about who is greater than juventus.int:

that's post of the year!

 

[JuveAdam]

def a superb post by juveadam and therefore is my nominee for this month. thanks for the effort and time u actually put trying to end this debate about who is greater than juventus.int:

Grazie, nice to be appriciated. Cheers for the nomination & +reps.

 

[Bisco]

that's post of the year!

to be honest snoop 2 i dont quite understand what u r trying to point out??

 

[bianconero]

 

[Marc]

I nominate this one:

http://www.juventuz.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1207432&postcount=3713

I cannot quote it because the Thread is closed.