Nick Against the World (131 Viewers)

[Vinman]

Also watched a tape of the Trinidad-Mayorga fight last night. there needs to be a Trinidad-Hopkins rematch ASAP.

Yes , Trinidad looked great last night

But Mayorga was tailored-made for him. He stands right in front of you with his hands down !!!!

Hopkins is a little too smart for Tito, I can see a repeat performance

 

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[Majed]

++ [ originally posted by Vinman ] ++

Majed, if Israel gives the Palestinians all the land in the world, it wont change the hatred. They will still fight with Israel. It will never end.......

Will the tension ever end? Probibly not. But will less blood be shed on both sides if a solution can be worked out? Yes.

You can't ask for something perfect, but there's no harm in striving for something better.

PS Do you really think that the Palastinians want to blow themselves up!? If there was peace and the Palastinians and their towns are oppressed anymore, then I can tell you this, they are capable to live with Israelis.

 

[Majed]

++ [ originally posted by Andy ] ++
Thats for sure.

And Majed its obvious that his main objective (or one of them) is to kill Americans. Is that so hard to see? Stop trying to deny that Bin Laden wants to kill Americans. That's his top priority!

where did I deny that?
Of course he is targeting Americans..

just for the sake of it? Nope
because he shuffled a stack of index cards that contain country names and picked out one that said America? Nope
Because he has religious scriptures that say "kill Americans?" Nope
Beacuse the USA is backing Israel and is interfiering with the rest of the world in an twisted effort to react to that? Yes

Trust me, If he wanted to kill Americans for the sake of sheding their blood and not worry about crippling the USA, he would have hit non-financial targets or targets with a lot more people!

 

[Kaiser Franco]

Majed,

You are absolutely spot on. Until we (i.e. my country as well, or rather those misrepresenting it) keep using the same manicheist approach when addressing terrorism, instead of analysing the actual roots of it, there won't be any hope of a way out of this impasse. I defy anyone to show me one speech where Al Qaeda states that its ultimate goal is to kill the good American guys. Bin Laden has repeated time and again that what he wants is :

1) the withdrawal of foreign troops from the muslim lands. This has been his tenet ever since the soviets invaded Afghanistan.

2) the end of unconditional support to the state of Israel on behalf of the United States.

Whether he is right or wrong, THESE are his objectives, and NOT the extermination of non-muslims nor the islamisation of the world (a dangerously misguided claim if I ever saw one). Also, that people here try to mitigate how pounding a sovereign nation from two miles up is actually a more humane and cleaner way of killing than by suicide-bombing yourself is simply sickening.

 

[Kaiser Franco]

I meant "explain" not "mitigate".

 

[flieeeekke]

kaiser, what do you study? or do for living?

 

[Kaiser Franco]

Im a free-lance brick counter, according to my profile:cheesy:

Speaking of which, it looks like this is going to be a very busy week.

 

[Bjerknes]

I highly doubt Bin Laden would all of a sudden "stop" his terrorist activities if we comply to all his demands. Isn't that negotiating with terroists anyway?

 

[Amr]

thread should be named politics & Bush

 

[Tom]

++ [ originally posted by Martin ] ++


It seems you weren't willing to adhere to my core basis on this and after all it is my opinion so you don't have to agree with me. But the way I see it, these terrorists leaders don't have any ideological objectives, all they want is power. And the means to obtain power is to use the discontent in the population to recruit operatives for their operations. The leaders never blow themselves up of course, they're too important for that, so it's the brainwashed common man if you will, normal people who actually commit these crimes. Now since the hatred towards the US is pretty damn strong and growing, recruitment probably won't be a problem in the time to come, it's been said that these various terrorist organizations actually have more volunteers than they need. So the key is to do something about everyone hating the US and its government, that's how you eliminate the cause for terrorism. Once that happens, these "warlords" who seek power will no longer find the people they need to launch such attacks. More importantly, once the general public in any said country starts condemning terrorist acts instead of supporting them or at least seeing them in some way justifiable, it becomes much more difficult to recruit people to do these things. Because what is the reality of today? Well, the suicide bombers, the people who actually plan and carry out the bombings are hailed as martyrs, they're actually seen as celebrities, movie stars in their own community, people look up to them. It's like blowing themselves up to kill a couple of Israeli soldiers is the noble mission in life they've been waiting for. So how in the world do you plan to eliminate the problem of terrorism by terrorizing them further? Doesn't work, does it. The more military action, the more people hate you, the more people willing to commit terrorist acts.

And Tommy, negotiating with the terrorist leaders is recognizing the power that they have, only makes their position stronger IMO. The only solution is to cut off their recruitment channel.

Sorry if I'm missing somethign there mate, but what exactly is your proposed solution to the problem? I mean, people are obviously willing to join the terrorist organisations, and people always will. There is no real way to cut the supply lines to to speak, and stop people wanting to volunteer. These people are as near to insane as can possibly be imagined. The entire culture is obviously backwards (people being celebrated for blowing things/people up) .. hell they are even killing Iraqi children! I mean these people are sick! The only way we can stop the threat is

a) find out why the hell they are doing it - if like you say they are just after power/respect then the only way is to completely pull out and leave them to terrorise their own people rather than ourselves.

b) fight terror with terror and threaten them into submission.

 

[Martin]

++ [ originally posted by Paolo_Montero ] ++
Sorry if I'm missing somethign there mate, but what exactly is your proposed solution to the problem? I mean, people are obviously willing to join the terrorist organisations, and people always will. There is no real way to cut the supply lines to to speak, and stop people wanting to volunteer. These people are as near to insane as can possibly be imagined. The entire culture is obviously backwards (people being celebrated for blowing things/people up) .. hell they are even killing Iraqi children! I mean these people are sick! The only way we can stop the threat is

Yes but see this culture of worship for suicide bombers is a new thing, it wasn't always like this. This hatred towards the US has grown over the last 20-30 years, this is a relatively new thing. Obviously you could query for my sources and while I've heard these kinds of opinions from many outlets, this specific one is from "60 minutes" where they attempted to research the reasons for terrorism and hatred, they talked to various people in Israel, Egypt etc. If you take Egypt, that is hardly a marginal state, with its 76m people. And allegedly there is very strong opposition to the US, resulting in quite a few volunteers for these terrorist actions. And this can be traced back to US support for Israel, if not the only problem it's certainly the biggest one.

++ [ originally posted by Paolo_Montero ] ++
a) find out why the hell they are doing it - if like you say they are just after power/respect then the only way is to completely pull out and leave them to terrorise their own people rather than ourselves.

Iran, wouldn't you say? The monarchy was overthrown, the fundamental Islamic leaders took power. Iran is hardly a big fan of the US given that the US supplied Saddam Husein with chemical/biological weapons in the Iran-Iraq war of 1980. But quite isolated and exempt from US economic/cultural influence. I bet the US would claim they "harbor terrorists" which wouldn't surprise me.

++ [ originally posted by Paolo_Montero ] ++
b) fight terror with terror and threaten them into submission.

Israel. The Israeli leadership is supplied with the latest in US military equipment, they constantly "retaliate" to "terrorists actions" like suicide bombings on the part of the Palestinians in that they destroy their homes and make sure to always kill more people than those who died in the bombings. An eye for an eye if you can call that, but there is no balance with the great advantage of Israel. How do you feel that is working out?

 

[The Pado]

Tom, we should simply force the so called "Terrorists" to read the last 10 pages of this thread. After that, they, along with myself, will be begging to be blown up.

 

[Bjerknes]

++ [ originally posted by Paolo_Montero ] ++


Sorry if I'm missing somethign there mate, but what exactly is your proposed solution to the problem? I mean, people are obviously willing to join the terrorist organisations, and people always will. There is no real way to cut the supply lines to to speak, and stop people wanting to volunteer. These people are as near to insane as can possibly be imagined. The entire culture is obviously backwards (people being celebrated for blowing things/people up) .. hell they are even killing Iraqi children! I mean these people are sick! The only way we can stop the threat is

a) find out why the hell they are doing it - if like you say they are just after power/respect then the only way is to completely pull out and leave them to terrorise their own people rather than ourselves.

b) fight terror with terror and threaten them into submission.

I have to agree with Tom here. Like I said before terrorists will always find a reason to hate and perform their trade.

 

[Seven]

++ [ originally posted by Paolo_Montero ] ++


b) fight terror with terror and threaten them into submission.

Imagine fire fighters fighting fire with fire.

 

[Zlatan]

I disagree. Terrorists arent jelaous of America as you think, they have real issues and real causes they are fighting for. We might not understand or approve them, but they do.

 

[Bjerknes]

++ [ originally posted by Seven ] ++


Imagine fire fighters fighting fire with fire.

Imagine terrorists running around with backpacks. :cheesy:

 

[KB824]

++ [ originally posted by Andy ] ++


Imagine terrorists running around with backpacks. :cheesy:

Imagine me nailing a piece of plywood to my nuts and having dwarves use it as a diving board, because that's what I'd rather do than read the last ten pages of this.




Could've sworn there was a terrorism thread somewhere on this prestigious forum

 

[Elnur_E65]

++ [ originally posted by Andy ] ++


Imagine terrorists running around with backpacks. :cheesy:

Yeah... and Mickey Mouse pictures on their t-shirts

 

[KB824]

++ [ originally posted by Elnur_E65 ] ++


Yeah... and Mickey Mouse pictures on their t-shirts

"I survived a suicide bombing and all I got was this stupid T-Shirt"

 

[Zlatan]

++ [ originally posted by Sergio ] ++


Imagine me nailing a piece of plywood to my nuts and having dwarves use it as a diving board, because that's what I'd rather do than read the last ten pages of this.




Could've sworn there was a terrorism thread somewhere on this prestigious forum

There is, and would you believe I started it

I think it's been closed tho, I'm not sure.