News that makes you say WTF! (47 Viewers)

[Seven]

Are you deliberately trying to annoy me or really can't understand even the most simple concepts? There is no civil marriage in Israel. You know that and you still ask weather atheists can get married! Under the circumstances my answer was as complete as possible.

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I don't know about that. It's possible and retarded and it sucks. My point from the beginning was that if the Jew converts to Islam or Christianity or whatever, than it's not up to the Jewish orthodoxy.

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There are two ways this statement can be understood:
1. Either they means the jews, in which case it means that jews cannot get married to non-jews even if the jew converts to the other religion. That is not correct.
2. Or they means the non-jew, in which case it means that jews cannot get married to non-jews even if the non-jew converts to Judaism. But you also said by law. Which means this statement is also incorrect. By law they are allowed, even if in practice the Jewish orthodoxy tries to make it as hard as possible.

Your answer should have been 'no, they cannot'. But because you know this makes Israel sound bad, you added a whole lot of ifs and buts. They don't matter. Fact is, atheists cannot get married.

 

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[king Ale]

In the article the percentage of people whose conversion is accepted by Jewish orthodoxy is negligible

I think the law says they can if they have an orthodox jewish conversion though.

 

[GordoDeCentral]

I think the law says they can if they have an orthodox jewish conversion though.

Which is almost impossible to get per stats, realistically your mother has to be a jew to be considered a real jew

 

[king Ale]

Which is almost impossible to get per stats, realistically your mother has to be a jew to be considered a real jew

Do the stats suggest that people tried to have an orthodox jewish conversion and couldn't? From what i understand many people don't want that and instead prefer to go abroad to get married and come back.

 

[GordoDeCentral]

Do the stats suggest that people tried to have an orthodox jewish conversion and couldn't? From what i understand many people don't want that and instead prefer to go abroad to get married and come back.

They can only do that if it doesn't say Jewish on their id cards, if it does then their marriage is not recognized.

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@Seven http://www.haaretz.com/jewish/survey-record-number-of-israeli-jews-believe-in-god-1.409386

 

[swag]

True, but the point of atheism is that is just the absence of belief in a God. It is no ethos as such. And while you definitely have people who can become almost religious when defending the idea, Hawkins is a fine example, atheism can never be considered a religion because it has no inherent values.

For most atheists who define themselves as such, the point of atheism is to codify a belief system that they can claim as superior to those of any other and all "religious types". Of course, every other religion has done the same thing throughout history, but no matter. They're not religious. They are above religion, which is how superior they frame themselves.

The inherent values are arguably a life free and above petty human religious beliefs. It's the hubris that one can escape their human frailties with a sense of ideological superiority. But it's still hubris. And it's still motivated in the human need to ascribe to a metaphysical belief system. Even if you call "black" the absence of color (in the light spectrum), it's really a color unto its own and not just in the pigmented world.

 

[Seven]

For most atheists who define themselves as such, the point of atheism is to codify a belief system that they can claim as superior to those of any other and all "religious types". Of course, every other religion has done the same thing throughout history, but no matter. They're not religious. They are above religion, which is how superior they frame themselves.

The inherent values are arguably a life free and above petty human religious beliefs. It's the hubris that one can escape their human frailties with a sense of ideological superiority. But it's still hubris. And it's still motivated in the human need to ascribe to a metaphysical belief system. Even if you call "black" the absence of color (in the light spectrum), it's really a color unto its own and not just in the pigmented world.

But that is be their belief system. It's not atheism.

Take that South Park episode in which several factions of atheists are killing each other in the name of atheism.

That doesn't happen with atheism in real life. What you get is atheists killing, for example, in the name of science.

Atheism is, in their mind, a consequence of scientific thinking.

 

[Ocelot]

But that is be their belief system. It's not atheism.

Take that South Park episode in which several factions of atheists are killing each other in the name of atheism.

That doesn't happen with atheism in real life. What you get is atheists killing, for example, in the name of science.

Atheism is, in their mind, a consequence of scientific thinking.

Agreed completely

 

[GordoDeCentral]

For most atheists who define themselves as such, the point of atheism is to codify a belief system that they can claim as superior to those of any other and all "religious types". Of course, every other religion has done the same thing throughout history, but no matter. They're not religious. They are above religion, which is how superior they frame themselves.

The inherent values are arguably a life free and above petty human religious beliefs. It's the hubris that one can escape their human frailties with a sense of ideological superiority. But it's still hubris. And it's still motivated in the human need to ascribe to a metaphysical belief system. Even if you call "black" the absence of color (in the light spectrum), it's really a color unto its own and not just in the pigmented world.

atheism is the belief in man

 

[Martin]

Also, whether a belief is held (in your view) for the purpose of feeling superior to others that hold a different view has nothing to do with whether something is or isn't a religion.

If my neighbor drives a car and I don't because I want to feel like I'm better that doesn't make me somehow a car driver because I want to feel superior and my non-driving somehow becomes a category of driving anyway.

 

[Seven]

atheism is the belief in man

No, I think that's where I disagree. Humanism is the belief in man. Critical to humanism is the preference for critical thinking and evidence over dogma.

I think a lot of humanists will tell you that science and rational thinking leads them to atheism, which is thus a consequence of humanism. But atheism as such holds no values.

Also, whether a belief is held (in your view) for the purpose of feeling superior to others that hold a different view has nothing to do with whether something is or isn't a religion.

If my neighbor drives a car and I don't because I want to feel like I'm better that doesn't make me somehow a car driver because I want to feel superior and my non-driving somehow becomes a category of driving anyway.

I like the way you put that .

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[ALC]

Also, whether a belief is held (in your view) for the purpose of feeling superior to others that hold a different view has nothing to do with whether something is or isn't a religion.

If my neighbor drives a car and I don't because I want to feel like I'm better that doesn't make me somehow a car driver because I want to feel superior and my non-driving somehow becomes a category of driving anyway.

Oh snap

 

[GordoDeCentral]

No, I think that's where I disagree. Humanism is the belief in man. Critical to humanism is the preference for critical thinking and evidence over dogma.

I think a lot of humanists will tell you that science and rational thinking leads them to atheism, which is thus a consequence of humanism. But atheism as such holds no values.


I like the way you put that .

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That is a narrow view imo critical thinking can lead down more than one Avenue. If you don't submit to a higher authority in matters of truth then you must take on that role fully, and that is atheism add a dogma.

 

[Zacheryah]

During my studies for master of science in industrial engineering, i've come across alot of people from various scientific branches, at different ages.


Grand majority was agnost, not atheist

 

[Seven]

That is a narrow view imo critical thinking can lead down more than one Avenue. If you don't submit to a higher authority in matters of truth then you must take on that role fully, and that is atheism add a dogma.

Of course. And I don't agree with the idea at all. But I think that's how atheists see it. One could even claim atheism itself is a dogma (wouldn't fully agree with that), but a dogma is still only part of religion and not the religion itself. Either way I just don't think one can say atheism is a religion too.

 

[Mohad]

For most atheists who define themselves as such, the point of atheism is to codify a belief system that they can claim as superior to those of any other and all "religious types". Of course, every other religion has done the same thing throughout history, but no matter. They're not religious. They are above religion, which is how superior they frame themselves.

The inherent values are arguably a life free and above petty human religious beliefs. It's the hubris that one can escape their human frailties with a sense of ideological superiority. But it's still hubris. And it's still motivated in the human need to ascribe to a metaphysical belief system. Even if you call "black" the absence of color (in the light spectrum), it's really a color unto its own and not just in the pigmented world.

What is your position on intellegant design?

 

[lgorTudor]

oh boy
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36800730

 

[piotrr]

jesus

+18

Spoiler

[video=facebook;1827645890801819]https://www.facebook.com/konfliktyPL/videos/1827645890801819/[/video]

 

[Valerio.]

oh boy
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36800730

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[campionesidd]

Not again!