Mumbai Shootings (2 Viewers)
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US 'warned India' about Mumbai
The US warned India about a possible threat at least a month before last week's Mumbai attacks, US media have quoted unnamed officials as saying.
One official said India had been told of an apparent plot to launch an attack from the sea, the AP agency reports.
The reports came as India's navy chief said there had been "systemic failures" in the country's security and intelligence services.
At least 188 people are now known to have died in the coordinated attacks.
The allegations are likely to add to the growing public anger that the attacks were not prevented.
India's home minister and the chief and deputy chief ministers of Maharashtra state have all resigned amid criticism of the government's handling of the crisis.
Two warnings
An Indian official appeared to confirm the US media reports that there was a known threat to at least some of the locations targeted, including the Taj Mahal Palace hotel.
Mumbai police chief Hassan Gafoor told a news conference on Tuesday that they had "had an alert that hotels like Taj could be exposed to such danger".
ABC News quoted Indian officials as saying that after receiving the US warning, they also intercepted a satellite phone message on 18 November warning of a seaborne attack on Mumbai.
The city had been on high alert but security measures at the attacked hotels had recently been relaxed, the network reported.
ABC also reported that the Indian authorities had seized a mobile phone SIM card belonging to the attackers, which they said had led to a "treasure trove" of contacts and information.
Indian officials have repeatedly said there is evidence that the militants behind the attacks had Pakistani links.
Mr Gafoor said that the only captured militant, named as Azam Amir Qasab, was "certainly from Pakistan".
Islamabad has offered India a joint investigation into the attacks but has denied any involvement and warned against attempts to inflame tensions in the region.
Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/south_asia/7761165.stm
Hey, maybe we were the ones that should have intercepted this warning and interpreted it for India. Damn us!
The US warned India about a possible threat at least a month before last week's Mumbai attacks, US media have quoted unnamed officials as saying.
One official said India had been told of an apparent plot to launch an attack from the sea, the AP agency reports.
The reports came as India's navy chief said there had been "systemic failures" in the country's security and intelligence services.
At least 188 people are now known to have died in the coordinated attacks.
The allegations are likely to add to the growing public anger that the attacks were not prevented.
India's home minister and the chief and deputy chief ministers of Maharashtra state have all resigned amid criticism of the government's handling of the crisis.
Two warnings
An Indian official appeared to confirm the US media reports that there was a known threat to at least some of the locations targeted, including the Taj Mahal Palace hotel.
Mumbai police chief Hassan Gafoor told a news conference on Tuesday that they had "had an alert that hotels like Taj could be exposed to such danger".
ABC News quoted Indian officials as saying that after receiving the US warning, they also intercepted a satellite phone message on 18 November warning of a seaborne attack on Mumbai.
The city had been on high alert but security measures at the attacked hotels had recently been relaxed, the network reported.
ABC also reported that the Indian authorities had seized a mobile phone SIM card belonging to the attackers, which they said had led to a "treasure trove" of contacts and information.
Indian officials have repeatedly said there is evidence that the militants behind the attacks had Pakistani links.
Mr Gafoor said that the only captured militant, named as Azam Amir Qasab, was "certainly from Pakistan".
Islamabad has offered India a joint investigation into the attacks but has denied any involvement and warned against attempts to inflame tensions in the region.
Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/south_asia/7761165.stm
Hey, maybe we were the ones that should have intercepted this warning and interpreted it for India. Damn us!
and no-one is questioning why Mr. Karkare was the 1st casualty of this incident
So if India claims it, that makes it fact? It has also been reported he lives in Dubai or Singapore...they aren't harbouring terrorists then?
I have NEVER heard of any Muslim extremists disguising themselves as a person of another religion...maybe these guys were inspired by Bollywood then
So if India claims it, that makes it fact? It has also been reported he lives in Dubai or Singapore...they aren't harbouring terrorists then?
I have NEVER heard of any Muslim extremists disguising themselves as a person of another religion...maybe these guys were inspired by Bollywood then
I love how the Indian media has it all figured out.
1) The terrorists are all Pakistani
2) They speak fluent English
3) They hold US & UK passports
4) They spoke with a Punjabi accent (also heard Pashto)
5) They call themselves the Deccan Mujahideen
6) They called a news channel (using the phone of a Swedish hotel guest) and claimed they were angry at the treatment Kashmiri's were getting
7) They sailed out of Karachi
8) They took orders from an ex-ISI official
9) They are members of Lashkar-e-Taiba
10) One of them is wearing a Hindu wrist band
11) They passed off as students from Mauritius
Conclusion: Blame Pakistan
I think the Indian media would be more successful in compiling a recipe for an international dish than solving this.
1) The terrorists are all Pakistani
2) They speak fluent English
3) They hold US & UK passports
4) They spoke with a Punjabi accent (also heard Pashto)
5) They call themselves the Deccan Mujahideen
6) They called a news channel (using the phone of a Swedish hotel guest) and claimed they were angry at the treatment Kashmiri's were getting
7) They sailed out of Karachi
8) They took orders from an ex-ISI official
9) They are members of Lashkar-e-Taiba
10) One of them is wearing a Hindu wrist band
11) They passed off as students from Mauritius
Conclusion: Blame Pakistan
I think the Indian media would be more successful in compiling a recipe for an international dish than solving this.
I dont expect much coming from you guys. Our media has it all figured out? It's pretty damn obvious we've been feeding Kasav the food his parents couldnt give him, for which they sold him to the LeT for 2 lac rupees, back home? Which is why he seems to be saying what we want to hear, isnt it? Makes perfect sense. Obviously these seem to be issues our media is stirring up.
Surprising none of you guys had anything to say about what your poorly put together channels seem to be reporting about India and its media. About it being all figured out, Ze, Ahmed and Salman. These guys called a news channel and claimed to be the Deccan Mujahideen before losing the accent and speaking Pashto. The one captured terrorist says all of them were trained in Pakistan and were of Pakistani descent and the sat phones have all the calls logged to Karachi, but seems like that isnt evidence enough? I wonder what is? Stop fucking cribbing about evidence when it's there for everyone to see. Ahmed get your facts right. They dint only wave a white flag, they had the vessel approach it and killed one of the officers on board before using the other to help direct it closer to the Indian shores before killing him since they werent as well armed. Let's not forget the trawler and the body that was found in it. They were found to have multiple passports on them. And when they put themselves up at the Nariman house guest house, they claimed to be students from Malaysia or Mauritius or whatever.
Dont even get it started about Dawood Ibrahim. He's fucking protected by the ISI for all the information he provides them about the commercial capital in India. Not to mention, the money. Salman I shouldnt believe the bullshit the media throws up? So who the fuck's been feeding you the poopsoup that makes you believe this isnt the situation in Karachi? The fact remains the ISI doesnt have the balls to hand him back to India because they'll lose their cash cow and also somebody who will provide valuable information to our intelligence about the inner workings of the ISI. It's something they'll never be able to do, they'll never be able to send him back alive anyway. But wait, we've sent you a list of most wanted terrorists. Let's see how your 'proactive' government reacts.
Ahmed, its absolutely lacking in respect to make a joke about something as serious as this. Mission Istanbul it seems to you? Too bad you Pakistani kids dont have a thriving film industry like ours. Maybe the only thing you guys export (i.e terrorists) would find more inspirational material to enjoy with the regressive cinema you guys make back home. Oh but while we're at it, for all the neutrals in this thread, you guys must see a movie called Khuda Kay Liye. One of the more progressive things to come out of Pakistan in recent times.
Madeline Albright is quite right when she says "...my own sense is Pakistan has everything that gives you an international migraine. It has nuclear weapons, it has terrorism, extremists, corruption, very poor and it's in a location that's really, really important to us. And now with this issue with India. So, I think that the current president and the current secretary of state, who's on her way to India right now, have a very big job ahead of them.".
Anyway, so at the end of this, we've recovered a satellite phone and mobile phones, a captured terrorist, seen a city under siege for 60 hours in a military style operation that owes its style to an ex ISI officer, as claimed by the terrorist - but im guessing he's not only being fed but also obviously being offered a bollywood movie right now, eh Ahmed? Now with everything pointing to Karachi, I have my friends here with an attitude spouting scathing sarcasm and a complete lack of empathy. The so called future of Pakistan. Not very bright by the looks of it.
But what the heck, I'm ok knowing that.
Surprising none of you guys had anything to say about what your poorly put together channels seem to be reporting about India and its media. About it being all figured out, Ze, Ahmed and Salman. These guys called a news channel and claimed to be the Deccan Mujahideen before losing the accent and speaking Pashto. The one captured terrorist says all of them were trained in Pakistan and were of Pakistani descent and the sat phones have all the calls logged to Karachi, but seems like that isnt evidence enough? I wonder what is? Stop fucking cribbing about evidence when it's there for everyone to see. Ahmed get your facts right. They dint only wave a white flag, they had the vessel approach it and killed one of the officers on board before using the other to help direct it closer to the Indian shores before killing him since they werent as well armed. Let's not forget the trawler and the body that was found in it. They were found to have multiple passports on them. And when they put themselves up at the Nariman house guest house, they claimed to be students from Malaysia or Mauritius or whatever.
Dont even get it started about Dawood Ibrahim. He's fucking protected by the ISI for all the information he provides them about the commercial capital in India. Not to mention, the money. Salman I shouldnt believe the bullshit the media throws up? So who the fuck's been feeding you the poopsoup that makes you believe this isnt the situation in Karachi? The fact remains the ISI doesnt have the balls to hand him back to India because they'll lose their cash cow and also somebody who will provide valuable information to our intelligence about the inner workings of the ISI. It's something they'll never be able to do, they'll never be able to send him back alive anyway. But wait, we've sent you a list of most wanted terrorists. Let's see how your 'proactive' government reacts.
Ahmed, its absolutely lacking in respect to make a joke about something as serious as this. Mission Istanbul it seems to you? Too bad you Pakistani kids dont have a thriving film industry like ours. Maybe the only thing you guys export (i.e terrorists) would find more inspirational material to enjoy with the regressive cinema you guys make back home. Oh but while we're at it, for all the neutrals in this thread, you guys must see a movie called Khuda Kay Liye. One of the more progressive things to come out of Pakistan in recent times.
Madeline Albright is quite right when she says "...my own sense is Pakistan has everything that gives you an international migraine. It has nuclear weapons, it has terrorism, extremists, corruption, very poor and it's in a location that's really, really important to us. And now with this issue with India. So, I think that the current president and the current secretary of state, who's on her way to India right now, have a very big job ahead of them.".
Anyway, so at the end of this, we've recovered a satellite phone and mobile phones, a captured terrorist, seen a city under siege for 60 hours in a military style operation that owes its style to an ex ISI officer, as claimed by the terrorist - but im guessing he's not only being fed but also obviously being offered a bollywood movie right now, eh Ahmed? Now with everything pointing to Karachi, I have my friends here with an attitude spouting scathing sarcasm and a complete lack of empathy. The so called future of Pakistan. Not very bright by the looks of it.
But what the heck, I'm ok knowing that.
Uhhh, I don't know about you, but I've seen plenty of evidence to the contrary here. If this was primarily about making a statement to the West, they did a pretty piss-poor job.
If anything, based on what we know now, it looks like ethnocentrists in the West want to make every incident about them -- as if it's unfathomable that any significant terrorist incident couldn't give a rat's ass about Westerners.
So far I have to say that the "targeting Westerners" line in this incident is pure self-absorbed hype perpetrated by Western media.
If anything, based on what we know now, it looks like ethnocentrists in the West want to make every incident about them -- as if it's unfathomable that any significant terrorist incident couldn't give a rat's ass about Westerners.
So far I have to say that the "targeting Westerners" line in this incident is pure self-absorbed hype perpetrated by Western media.
baggio, you're being quite rude. Even if you think this incident is all about hating India for all its glory that doesn't mean your neighbors here share that perspective. And for what it's worth you're on quite a crusade about Pakistan as a whole here.
And as far as I can see you haven't refuted the the proposition that even if someone in Karachi was receiving the calls or making commands that doesn't imply it was anyone connected to the government.
And as far as I can see you haven't refuted the the proposition that even if someone in Karachi was receiving the calls or making commands that doesn't imply it was anyone connected to the government.
Ever heard of a proxy war Martin? What you're not understandng here is that Dawood Ibrahim is somebody who is protected by the Pakistani intelligence agency in return for funding and information that he provides them about India's commercial capital. I'm just sick and tired of this going back and forth - a clear demarcation needs to be created. We as a country have been very reciprocal in affection and have always welcomed Pakistan as a neighbour and as a people. Look at their artists, singers, comedians, actors who come here and flourish. But at times like these, all I hear is these guys propelling a jingoistic style without any sense of what is being said. Like i mentioned in the post, the attack that was carried out had a military style of operation, with the terroist even claiming to have been trained by an ex ISI officer. But the complete lack of respect seen by Ahmed has totally put me off, with him saying that they were probably inspired by a flop bollywood movie called Mission Istanbul. I dont appreciate a joke at times like this. India as a country is full of patient and resilient people. And even at this hour, we're restrained and dont intend to strike Pakistan as much as the world is in our favour. We're excersing our rights, asking for co-operation and if you watch the news you'll find, them to just beat around the bush. Again, I have nothing personal against any of these 3 guys, I think they know that.
If there's one thing I've learned about India from being there -- and don't get me wrong, I absolutely love India and feel a little like it's a second home to me -- is that for everything you find in India, you'll find existence of truth in its exact opposite.
For example, I love how India is a multicultural, spiritual nation. But there's also a lot of discrimination of its peoples and religions by many of its very own peoples and religions. And for every person whom I appreciated who saw Muslims as the brothers of Hindus, there are Hindustavas that piss me off to no end. And for every Indian Muslim whom I admired for believing in the ideal of an Indian democracy after Separation, there are Muslims who still want to blow people up. There are Hindus who want to blow people up.
It's amazing that more people don't kill each other there, really...
For example, I love how India is a multicultural, spiritual nation. But there's also a lot of discrimination of its peoples and religions by many of its very own peoples and religions. And for every person whom I appreciated who saw Muslims as the brothers of Hindus, there are Hindustavas that piss me off to no end. And for every Indian Muslim whom I admired for believing in the ideal of an Indian democracy after Separation, there are Muslims who still want to blow people up. There are Hindus who want to blow people up.
It's amazing that more people don't kill each other there, really...