Mirko Vučinić (44 Viewers)

[baggio]

You want them to be weak.
From the start, some weeks ago, you set the argument this way: "Quag is superior to Vucinic. He can single handedly lead a team in matches, as proven last year. Vucinic can never do it". Then you were given the example how he was the best player in Roma when they almost won a scudetto in 2010 and days later the Fiorentina and Milan match happened. After that, from asking Mirko to lead Juve in one single match you ask for him to single handedly lead the team to trophies. It's impossible to follow your demands.

Haha. Go back a few pages in this very thread, and look up what I said would be acceptable for a player like Vucinic. We play the 433 largely to suit two players on this team. Pirlo and Vucinic IMO. And in your own words he is instrumental to that formation and has a guaranteed spot on this team. But I don't see how it is wrong to expect more from Vucinic to have more than 6 goals and 5 assists when he's got one of the best midfields in all of Europe playing behind him. You give me an example of how he almost led Roma to a Scudetto in 2010, but then go on to say that me expecting him to repeat that feat at Juventus is an impossible demand. I'd say that's a contradiction of sorts.

And just to clarify, my criticism of Vucinic doesn't even stem from his inability to carry the team. It has always been about his temperament, inconsistency and attitude. I've never considered him to be a match-winning player, let alone a championship.

As for the Quag argument, i think after arguing that Quag at his best had a greater impact on the team last year than Vucinic has had this year coming in as prime signing in attack - we'd agreed that they didn't compare as players because of differing roles. But I did think as a player Quag had a better work ethic and off the ball movement, and ran a lot more than Vucinic. You went on to say he wasn't good enough to play the team around him but Vucinic was and that's why we play the 433. How then, is it wrong for me to expect more from a player around who we channelize our play?? Isn't this the same reason Diego had received so much criticism before being sold last year!? The 433 is a formation, which by the way, I have consistently supported because it's good for the team (you know that because we discussed it in the formation thread,) even though it doesn't suit my so called 'FAVOURITE' player.

Please don't forget. I'm a Juve fan first.

 

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[Alen]

such fucking bullshit ahmed. his level over the past 6 games has been good in general. it's you who needs to remove the cricket ball anal bead from your ass and acknowledge his importance.

Maybe, but it was only good enough to be Juventus player of the month for March (http://www.juventus.com/juve/en/news/31mar2012_vuc_eng). Certainly not good enough not to be by far the most criticized player at the same time.

 

[baggio]

I am 'bitching' because rather than accept he played a shit game people are justifying his shit with 2 good moments in 80 mins of play.

And his 2 good performances all season. We can't afford that kind of player to be a piece of the puzzle in a CL season where his responsibility is going to be double.

 

[Alen]

We play the 433 largely to suit two players on this team. Pirlo and Vucinic IMO.

Absolutely not. We didn't even play 4-3-3 when Pepe was absent while we kept it when Vucinic was absent. And, afterall, even in 3-5-2 Conte is playing Vucinic while Pirlo's best performances were at the start of the season in 4-4-2 or against Catania in 3-5-2.
Conte already showed that he doesn't give a damn about big names or expensive buys. He has a philosophy and plays only those who understand what the coach wants and do it on the pitch. He still isn't that stubborn though and he knows that the trio of CMs is the backbone of the team. So, the 4-3-3, as well as the 3-5-2, were used to suit the midfield as a unit. It has nothing to do with Vucinic. Mirko is just a guy who makes the team and whatever formation Conte is choosing. He's certainly not someone who dictates the formation.

 

[Nzoric]

Maybe, but it was only good enough to be Juventus player of the month for March (http://www.juventus.com/juve/en/news/31mar2012_vuc_eng). Certainly not good enough not to be by far the most criticized player at the same time.

 

[Fake Melo]

We play the 433 largely to suit two players on this team. Pirlo and Vucinic IMO

Conte said it was because of Vidal.

 

[Alen]

And his 2 good performances all season.

The way you started, at the end of the season you'll say that he didn't have a single good performance.

You're talking about absolutely brilliant performances. And if you look at the last two seasons, only Krasic against Cagliari last year and Pirlo against Parma and Catania had such performances.
We can't afford having players like Matri, Quag, Del Piero, Marchisio and Pepe in CL seasons when even in serie A they didn't have a single good performance (if by "good" we consider the above).

 

[Cheesio]

Marchisio against Inter in Milan was phenomenal

 

[king Ale]

I have nothing against Vucinic. I think he's a good player, a bit inconsistent but a good player. All I was trying to tell Nick was that people weren't really hating on Vucinic, they were just saying that he wasn't playing good when he wasn't.

He needs to score, say, five more by season's close for me to deem him a success.

Same here.

First there was Amauri then we had Diego, Krasic and now we have Vucinic. He might show some moments of class every now and again but overall the sooner we replace him with someone truely WC the better. We've wasted too much time and money on players who are all fart and no shit.

100% agree with Stevie! Sell his ass now! Krasic-Vucinic combo for 25Mil to anyone!

having duties and fullfilling them is two separate things.
last time i saw him really track back was a good few month ago, so it can't be the defending that does stop him from giving a fuck about us

why is this guy a sticky?

15m for this guy another overrated serie A player
never liked him in the first place didn't convince me at all this whole season. don't blame him not scoring
blame him being selfish and ghostic

Martinez 2nd coming....

25 mils for this one and for that twitter boy who rubs the bench...after real madrid we're the worse at transfers.

Him and Bonucci, total of 30 milion, one Tevez please.And no Bonucci, no lost points due to retardation

Just a matter of time before the crowd fully turns on him.

He got a little taste near the end of today's match when he miscontrolled a pass.

Got dispossessed 12 times today. 10 times more than any other Juve player tonight. And he had 0 shots on goal. Abysmal stats for a creative player.

Read the same story. He is a flop

He's frustrating to watch. Not as frustrating as Amauri was in his final matches, but goddamnit Vucinic is trying real hard to be the new Amauri!

In fact, when he was clutching his hip, I thought he was gonna get subbed off, and my heart was like for a few minutes!

Selfish. Overrate himself, said it before and i'll say it again.

I swear, Conte should leave him on the bench in the next game, sub him in and the first time he loses a ball and doesnt chase after it to get it back, he should sub him out, just to prove a point to him!

Yeah considering Conte likes players who give everything and play for the team u think he would start Quag every game over Vucinic.

Just a few posts from the past month up until now. I wonder how many players are benched because of Vucinic

Reading the past few pages, I noticed there are different posters criticizing Vucinic' bad performances like it could happen to any other player, from Bonucci to Marchisio to Matri. But there are always a few who are so defensive even against the deserved criticism he's occasionally gotten. Nzoric believes Vucinic's had 9 assists so far and Nick doesn't seem to add anything to the argument except "Mirkoooooooooooooooooo". Alen compares him to Buffon and thinks those who criticize him want their favorite players to play instead, and someone else believes he's the best player in the world when on form

---------- Post added 09.04.2012 at 11:56 ----------

Marchisio against Inter in Milan was phenomenal

Or Matri against Udinese. Not surprising if you read his other posts in this thread though

 

[baggio]

The way you started, at the end of the season you'll say that he didn't have a single good performance.

You're talking about absolutely brilliant performances. And if you look at the last two seasons, only Krasic against Cagliari last year and Pirlo against Parma and Catania had such performances.
We can't afford having players like Matri, Quag, Del Piero, Marchisio and Pepe in CL seasons when even in serie A they didn't have a single good performance (if by "good" we consider the above).

Not at all. I think Del Piero against Napoli for the short time he was there was unbelievable. Quag did that against Catania this season too, both were amazing performances. The point is not about the sarcasm behind his 2 good games. Its to highlight Mirko being too inconsistent for the responsibility given to him. On the basis of this season, its been a disappointment. Hopefully a Suarez next season could change that, when our deoendence on Vucinic decreases and his absences may not even affect us as much as we perceive it to. Because I'm not sure our CL hopes can rely on somebody so inconsistent getting important responsibilities 2 games per week.

 

[Alen]

Just a few posts from the past month up until now. I wonder how many players are benched because of Vucinic

Reading the past few pages, I noticed there are different posters criticizing Vucinic' bad performances like it could happen to any other player, from Bonucci to Marchisio to Matri. But there are always a few who are so defensive even against the deserved criticism he's occasionally gotten. Nzoric believes Vucinic's had 9 assists so far and Nick doesn't seem to add anything to the argument except "Mirkoooooooooooooooooo". Alen compares him to Buffon and thinks those who criticize him want their favorite players to play instead, and someone else believes he's the best player in the world when on form

Lol, what a silly way to twist my words. If you bothered a bit you'll find even my posts when Vucinic is criticized after an imo unsatisfying performance. Just like one can find such posts from you in DP's thread.
I was talking about the little company that finds every performance from Mirko bad and we all know that it has everything to do with Del Piero and Quag. So far you and Baggio make the list.

 

[Ahmed]

and what about the little (Balkan) company that continuously defends him no matter how he plays?

2 can play at that game, Alen.

 

[baggio]

Lol, what a silly way to twist my words. If you bothered a bit you'll find even my posts when Vucinic is criticized after an imo unsatisfying performance. Just like one can find such posts from you in DP's thread.
I was talking about the little company that finds every performance from Mirko bad and we all know that it has everything to do with Del Piero and Quag. So far you and Baggio make the list.

I don't hope for him to play bad because even if he does, he still starts . So obviously, after a point I want him to succeed for the team's sake. Don't take this the wrong way. I wish Vucinic stays next season, but id like him to be more consistent because right now his inconsistency hurts us more than his talent wins us games. I personally think guys like him Quag, Matri and even Ale if he remains will all have an important role to play next season but we may not be able to give either one of them the kind of bandwidth Vucinic has undeservingly had this season, if they don't perform.

 

[Alen]

Quag did that against Catania this season too

I don't even remember that Quag played against Catania, even less that he had an amazing performance

This is exactly what you're doing all the time, can't you see? For you Mirko's performance against Milan in Coppa was good while Quag's performance against Catania was amazing. Even Hoori would disagree with that.

---------- Post added 09.04.2012 at 14:21 ----------

and what about the little (Balkan) company that continuously defends him no matter how he plays?

2 can play at that game, Alen.

What about the Marchisio company or the Del Piero comapny that always defend them? Are they the "bad guys" or are the bad guys those who attack Marchisio and Del Piero no matter what?

 

[king Ale]

Lol, what a silly way to twist my words. If you bothered a bit you'll find even my posts when Vucinic is criticized after an imo unsatisfying performance. Just like one can find such posts from you in DP's thread.
I was talking about the little company that finds every performance from Mirko bad and we all know that it has everything to do with Del Piero and Quag. So far you and Baggio make the list.

...

I LOVE YOU MAN! The ONLY player playing. LOVELY, oh my dear God. GOAAAAAAAAAAAAAAALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL!

This game is all Vucinic'. This is my live thread. Goal of the freaking season.

Every time we attacked, Vucinic created goal opportunities but we sure as hell have to chicken out and defend this shaky lead.

Forget about the goal, he was amazing today. Great game, contributed to both attack and defend. He was the only man playing in our team towards the end of the game. Could have done better on a few occasions but I wouldn't complain. He was brilliant.

Does this game make his performances in most of the games this season look better? I'm sorry, no. No one ever doubted him on his good days, it was all about consistency and frequency of him performing well. It's your problem if you can't understand this simple thing. Juve need to look for better and more competent players if we are to do well in both the league and Europe.

I couldn't watch the entire second half but he had a very good game in the first half and it was surprising to me to see people complaining about his first half performance. Had a few wonderful passes and plays.

If I had a say in Juve transfers however, my priority would definitely be trying to replace him with a better player: Either Jovetic or Suarez.

I didn't twist your words. His good performances are always acknowledged by the fans. Problem is that they happen once in a long while. I have actually barely wanted him out of this team, this season. What I'm mostly talking about is getting better players for his role for the upcoming season, when Del Piero will not be even a part of the team. So perhaps it's better for you to for once bring in a good counterargument in this thread instead of conveniently accusing those who criticize him of bias while in fact the biased ones in this thread are you and a few others always defending him.

 

[baggio]

I don't even remember that Quag played against Catania, even less that he had an amazing performance

This is exactly what you're doing all the time, can't you see? For you Mirko's performance against Milan in Coppa was good while Quag's performance against Catania was amazing. Even Hoori would disagree with that.

Huh?? Dude, we won that match 3-1. Sorry but Quag started that game for a change and played the entirety of it. He even scored. Remember the Storari incident?? That game was one of the best striker performances in the season. So I really dunno what you're pointing fingers about. Please don't play on semantics, good or amazing, and go find my comments on Mirko after the Milan game, I called it s I saw it, and said he was the only one who could've won us the game the way he played it. You're creating a tangent and implying bias without seeing your own.

 

[Alen]

I didn't twist your words. His good performances are always acknowledged by the fans. Problem is that they happen once in a long while. I have actually barely wanted him out of this team, this season. What I'm mostly talking about is getting better players for his role for the upcoming season, when Del Piero will not be even a part of the team. So perhaps it's better for you to for once bring in a good counterargument in this thread instead of conveniently accusing those who criticize him of bias while in fact the biased ones in this thread are you and a few others always defending him.

Who would you like to play against Lazio, Vucinic or Del Piero? If you know that we'll beat Lazio 3:0 with a Vucinic hat-trick and you don't know how the match will end up if Del Piero plays ahead of Mirko, what will you choose, Juve with Mirko or Juve with Del Piero?

I will care about Vucinic as much as I now care about Krasic (since you bring the -ic argument), as much as a cared about the Croat Tudor being benched or sent on loan and as much as I care about last year's snow, if the team plays as well or better without him and if he's replaced by another player. This discussion will be objective only if you care about Juve with Del Piero as much as you care about a Juve without Del Piero and if you say that you really don't mind any attacker taking DP's place as long as it's better for the team.

---------- Post added 09.04.2012 at 14:40 ----------

Huh?? Dude, we won that match 3-1. Sorry but Quag started that game for a change and played the entirety of it. He even scored. Remember the Storari incident?? That game was one of the best striker performances in the season. So I really dunno what you're pointing fingers about. Please don't play on semantics, good or amazing, and go find my comments on Mirko after the Milan game, I called it s I saw it, and said he was the only one who could've won us the game the way he played it. You're creating a tangent and implying bias without seeing your own.

I only remember Pirlo having a monster match and you just reminded me that Quag scored a goal for 3:1. Sorry, but I honestly don't remember Quag's performance. I'm sure I would have if it was anything above average.

 

[king Ale]

Silly question, tbh.

That's void because I'm in fact talking about a Juve without Del Piero so I'm certainly not taking his good into account unlike what you've been trying to suggest in the last 10 pages.

 

[Alen]

Silly question, tbh.

That's void because I'm in fact talking about a Juve without Del Piero so I'm certainly not taking his good into account unlike what you've been trying to suggest in the last 10 pages.

Exactly, you're talking. You don't just mention it once how we must replace Mirko with a better player. You keep talking about it, as if you care what will happen to Juve post-Del Piero. You admitted yourself in this forum that you don't give a damn about the post-Del Piero Juve, so is it the next year that you're worried about? Or is the problem in this particular year and the fact that Del Piero is benched while someone else keeps playing.

Every fucking soul here acknowledges that noone in our attack has the quality to lead Juve to success in European stage and we must drastically improve up front. You're not criticized for that suggestion as much as you're criticized for what's behind keep suggesting that so early in the season and in a thread that isn't about the summer mercato.
At least by me.

 

[baggio]

I only remember Pirlo having a monster match and you just reminded me that Quag scored a goal for 3:1. Sorry, but I honestly don't remember Quag's performance. I'm sure I would have if it was anything above average.

Pirlo and Quag were the two best players on the pitch. I thought Pirlo was man of the match and Quag ran him close. If you don't remember Quag's performance, its fine, but just makes a case for your bias, with your memory serving you details of pretty much every Vucinic performance this season. And suffice to say that more than half of them have been below average. Sad, really.