Massimiliano Allegri (223 Viewers)

[Patrizi]

You said that they were the only ones you'd choose out of the ones mentioned. Not "some of the ones id choose".

These are your words, not mine. No one is putting them in your mouth, you're just twisting them. What's your reason for not including Pep in your list of would-be replacements for Allegri alongside Zidane and Ancelotti? You clearly don't consider him "ambitious" enough.

Haha. Nope. I'm not twisting anything. Your comprehension is just a little wonky. Read my words.
I said I'd choose those two from the list. I said 80% I don't find ambitious.
I'd consider Pep a very ambitious signing. But I wouldn't choose him. I don't like him.

This is your saddest attempt at some kind of gotcha. And a pretty pathetic attempt to run away from your incorrect statements.

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There are three groups of members posting in this thread.

The first group, for various reasons, but mostly because they sincerely believe that Allegri's ideas and modus operandi are harming this club, started criticizing Max, clashed with the second group, and now they are taking their opinions to extremity. Now no matter what Allegri does, he is wrong, and they have even come to the point where they wish we do bad just so Allegri is fired. One member even answered me that he'd prefer us not to win the scudetto if it means that Max will stay.

The second group, for various reasons, but mostly because they appreciate what Max has done in the past and they sincerely believe that he's getting the best out of this group of Juve players, has defended Allegri from the attacks of the first group. Provoked by group no.1, they too have gone to extremity and they deliberately give Max superpowers, just to provoke group no.1. But they have come to the point where they will defend Allegri even when he's wrong.

The third group is sick of both groups, and they don't really care about Allegri. They just want Juve to do well, irrespective of who is managing the team. They appreciate what Allegri is doing with the current set of players, but they are aware and worried that his anti-football won't take us far in the future.

And then there is s4tch, who is boring all three groups to death.

I do enjoy calling out bullshit when I see it. I'm in that group.

 

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[maxi]

They appreciate what Allegri is doing with the current set of players, but they are aware and worried that his anti-football won't take us far in the future.

That's literally what we believe though? I've been banging on about this from the start. This should be your group 1. You'll be hard pressed to find anyone here who actually wants us to lose, even if group 3 make false accusations of such against Allegri critics.

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Haha. Nope. I'm not twisting anything. Your comprehension is just a little wonky. Read my words.
I said I'd choose those two from the list. I said 80% I don't find ambitious.
I'd consider Pep a very ambitious signing. But I wouldn't choose him. I don't like him.

This is your saddest attempt at some kind of gotcha. And a pretty pathetic attempt to run away from your incorrect statements.

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I do enjoy calling out bullshit when I see it. I'm in that group.

Pep is a proven winner across multiple different countries and across a breadth of different competitions. The point is you'd rather keep a comparatively inferior Allegri over someone with that resume.

Even still, whether or not you include Pep in your 80%, and regardless of factoring in trophies won, I would consider most others on that list to be far more ambitious than someone who's content with 2nd place in Sere Ass.

 

[Rockets]

There are three groups of members posting in this thread.

The first group, for various reasons, but mostly because they sincerely believe that Allegri's ideas and modus operandi are harming this club, started criticizing Max, clashed with the second group, and now they are taking their opinions to extremity. Now no matter what Allegri does, he is wrong, and they have even come to the point where they wish we do bad just so Allegri is fired. One member even answered me that he'd prefer us not to win the scudetto if it means that Max will stay.

The second group, for various reasons, but mostly because they appreciate what Max has done in the past and they sincerely believe that he's getting the best out of this group of Juve players, has defended Allegri from the attacks of the first group. Provoked by group no.1, they too have gone to extremity and they deliberately give Max superpowers, just to provoke group no.1. But they have come to the point where they will defend Allegri even when he's wrong.

The third group is sick of both groups, and they don't really care about Allegri. They just want Juve to do well, irrespective of who is managing the team. They appreciate what Allegri is doing with the current set of players, but they are aware and worried that his anti-football won't take us far in the future.

And then there is s4tch, who is boring all three groups to death.

It's not that complicated.

There is only one group of member posting in this thread: those who make less money than Allegri.

 

[Alen]

It's not that complicated.

There is only one group of member posting in this thread: those who make less money than Allegri.

Lol. True.

 

[Bjerknes]

There are three groups of members posting in this thread.

The first group, for various reasons, but mostly because they sincerely believe that Allegri's ideas and modus operandi are harming this club, started criticizing Max, clashed with the second group, and now they are taking their opinions to extremity. Now no matter what Allegri does, he is wrong, and they have even come to the point where they wish we do bad just so Allegri is fired. One member even answered me that he'd prefer us not to win the scudetto if it means that Max will stay.

The second group, for various reasons, but mostly because they appreciate what Max has done in the past and they sincerely believe that he's getting the best out of this group of Juve players, has defended Allegri from the attacks of the first group. Provoked by group no.1, they too have gone to extremity and they deliberately give Max superpowers, just to provoke group no.1. But they have come to the point where they will defend Allegri even when he's wrong.

The third group is sick of both groups, and they don't really care about Allegri. They just want Juve to do well, irrespective of who is managing the team. They appreciate what Allegri is doing with the current set of players, but they are aware and worried that his anti-football won't take us far in the future.

And then there is s4tch, who is boring all three groups to death.

This is not exactly true. Criticizing Allegri has always been faux pas on this board, and when some didn’t want Allegri back they were attacked personally. That’s what started all of this. And the current set of players isn’t even that bad.

 

[juve123]

Allegri:"Sometimes I make a joke when they ask me how to be a coach, answering I don’t know or don't have the answer .So you could imagine that I don’t even know how to manage Juventus.”

 

[DutchJuventino]

This is not exactly true. Criticizing Allegri has always been faux pas on this board, and when some didn’t want Allegri back they were attacked personally. That’s what started all of this. And the current set of players isn’t even that bad.

I agree, but we don't have an amazing squad either. If we look at all star players by top Serie A clubs you would've something like this
1. Inter:
Lautaro, Barella and Bastoni, rest of the starting players are also pretty great.

2. Milan: Leao, Maignan and Theo Hernandez, rest of the players are great (Giroud for example) or average.

3. Juventus:
Vlahovic and Chiesa, we have for sure worse average than AC Milan. Some great players still like our goalie and Bremer. Some real talents, but they are not matured enough to call them great, the potential is there.

4. Roma:
Dybala and Lukaku, bang average rest of squad except Pellegrini.

5. Napoli:
Oshimen, mostly overperformed last season, they've a similar squad to Roma imo.

The second spot and still playing for the scudetto is a good sign, but our squad is still not there. We have almost no dept in creative players. I am not a massive Allegri fan nor a hater, but I think his biggest problem was the shift in players last seasons. So much players left and bought, he is not good in creating a team from 11 players. He isat his best when he starts with a good foundation and optimalize the players, playstyle et cetera. We saw it in his coaching career several times. He had with Milan a really good squad that was based on a good foundation and he made them Serie A winners. Same happened when Antonio Conte left him a very good squad an we reached two CL-finals.

Last seasons he had the mission to create a squad from a bunch of random players. Something he never did really succesfully. I think he is slowly getting there, we can't expect him to win scudetto over Inter, but we can surely expect to fight until the end for the first spot. We don't play very attractive football but the foundation is coming together and the results are not below expectations imo. We should not fire him when this tendency of becoming a better squad still is developing, especially with our financial situation.

Nowadays coaches who don't play attractive football are criticized earlier than attractive playing coaches, so Allegri will always be a under a magnifiying glass. But to be honest I don't think he is THAT defensive. We scored a lot of goals in those seasons when we reached CL-finals.

 

[juve123]

Allegri:“Inter has a team built to win the scudetto, Juve have a different journey.We don’t need to have the obsession to win the scudetto in our own heads, otherwise it’ll be a mess.”

 

[Alen]

he is not good in creating a team from 11 players. He isat his best when he starts with a good foundation and optimalize the players, playstyle et cetera. We saw it in his coaching career several times. He had with Milan a really good squad that was based on a good foundation and he made them Serie A winners. Same happened when Antonio Conte left him a very good squad an we reached two CL-finals.

But what about the 2017 team that made the CL final? In 2015 we had Tevez, Pirlo, Vidal, Pogba, Evra, Morata etc. They were all gone in 2017. Allegri lost the backbone of that 2015 team and made the CL finals two years later with an almost completely different team. Only Buffon, Barzagli and Bonucci started both these finals. If 2015 was "Conte's team", the 2017 one was definitely Allegri's.

 

[maxi]

Allegri:"Sometimes I make a joke when they ask me how to be a coach, answering I don’t know or don't have the answer .So you could imagine that I don’t even know how to manage Juventus.”

Well that explains a lot

 

[KB824]

What I wanted to see from him this year is a willingness to adapt to the players that he has, instead of the other way around.

That is what he is doing. Having faith in all of our young kids, and letting them play and express themselves. For those of us who have been begging this club to have faith in our youth, that is exactly what is taking shape here.

Now, I am still 100% on board with getting a new coach, if one is available. But as of this moment, I see no legitimate reason to let him go.

 

[Lion]

let's not act like allegri is champion of giving young players chances. reason he did this season is lack of options and not that he went hmmm this player will impress me more than the veterans

if pogba and fagioli were not idiots you would never see nonge or nicolussi play.

if kean and chiesa didn't get injured you would have never seen yildiz play and he would be a star next season for another team like soule.

the reason he kids are doing well is lack of money + injuries

 

[singus]

What I wanted to see from him this year is a willingness to adapt to the players that he has, instead of the other way around.

That is what he is doing. Having faith in all of our young kids, and letting them play and express themselves. For those of us who have been begging this club to have faith in our youth, that is exactly what is taking shape here.

Now, I am still 100% on board with getting a new coach, if one is available. But as of this moment, I see no legitimate reason to let him go.

Curious what this means. Lets say a coach was NOT doing this, what would that look like? How would we know?

 

[Al Birdie]

No we're not. But people in here tend to ignore middle ground at all costs.

Allegri simply ended his first stint badly and started his second in the same way. Now he's obviously redeeming himself. It's difficult to ignore those...

Maybe not you, plenty of people has this loaded and ready.
Allegri was out of ideas by his 1st stint and it was good time for both Juve and Allegri to go their separate ways. It was a good decision. Now hiring loser like Sarri... That was inexcusable.

Speaking about his 2nd stint- so far he has achieved square root of fuck all. Last 2 seasons with a dick in his hands. This season we scraped quite a few lucky wins and even the most die hard Allegri fans don't expect this trend to continue. So in my eyes he is far from redeeming himself.

 

[KB824]

Curious what this means. Lets say a coach was NOT doing this, what would that look like? How would we know?

Zeman for one.

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let's not act like allegri is champion of giving young players chances. reason he did this season is lack of options and not that he went hmmm this player will impress me more than the veterans

if pogba and fagioli were not idiots you would never see nonge or nicolussi play.

if kean and chiesa didn't get injured you would have never seen yildiz play and he would be a star next season for another team like soule.

the reason he kids are doing well is lack of money + injuries

It's one thing to play the kids out of necessity.

It's another thing entirely to actually let these kids be themselves out there, and not try to fit a rigid system.

I think anyone can see that this team plays much more fluidly when the kids are playing

 

[Lion]

Zeman for one.

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It's one thing to play the kids out of necessity.

It's another thing entirely to actually let these kids be themselves out there, and not try to fit a rigid system.

I think anyone can see that this team plays much more fluidly when the kids are playing

inshallah u will see them play rigid once they are fully indoctrinated

 

[Dino_mk]

let's not act like allegri is champion of giving young players chances. reason he did this season is lack of options and not that he went hmmm this player will impress me more than the veterans

if pogba and fagioli were not idiots you would never see nonge or nicolussi play.

if kean and chiesa didn't get injured you would have never seen yildiz play and he would be a star next season for another team like soule.

the reason he kids are doing well is lack of money + injuries

Spot on!
Same thing happened last year when injury crisis hit Juve and no veterans where available, only then he introduced Mireti, Fagioli, Iling Junior etc.

 

[KB824]

Spot on!
Same thing happened last year when injury crisis hit Juve and no veterans where available, only then he introduced Mireti, Fagioli, Iling Junior etc.

And we are starting to see the fruits of that now with 2 of the three, and if Fagioli didn't get in trouble, all 3.

This year we are seeing Yildiz, Cambiaso, and potentially more young guys.

So whatever the reason, the evidence is pointing to further growth from these players

 

[Dino_mk]

And we are starting to see the fruits of that now with 2 of the three, and if Fagioli didn't get in trouble, all 3.

This year we are seeing Yildiz, Cambiaso, and potentially more young guys.

So whatever the reason , the evidence is pointing to further growth from these players

That's the problem, it shouldn't be "whatever the reason".
Reason why young guys grow, develop and play for the team should be the quality of their coach, his abiliti to bring them to the first team and not his dare need for players because first team players are injured.

 

[Patrizi]

A lot of this comes from above Allegri.

This time, Allegri's job is to incorporate young talented players into the squad.

We're building from scratch.

I look forward to seeing Giuntoli's Juve.