Mario Balotelli (142 Viewers)

Ocelot

Midnight Marauder
Jul 13, 2013
18,943
Global Warming
Climate Change
Climate Disruption

Which one is it?
Is the name really so important?
It was originally named global warming due to its most prominent effect - the rise in global temperatures. Then morons started saying after every unusually cold day that global warming was bullshit, and tbh dumming it down to just the warming is wrong and an oversimplification anyways, thus the term climate change. Climate disruption is something I first saw in this thread and have never heard anywhere before, but then again I don't live in an englishspeaking country.

And still, I don't get why the name is such a big issue.
 

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Hust

Senior Member
Hustini
May 29, 2005
93,359
Is the name really so important?
It was originally named global warming due to its most prominent effect - the rise in global temperatures. Then morons started saying after every unusually cold day that global warming was bullshit, and tbh dumming it down to just the warming is wrong and an oversimplification anyways, thus the term climate change. Climate disruption is something I first saw in this thread and have never heard anywhere before, but then again I don't live in an englishspeaking country.

And still, I don't get why the name is such a big issue.
Balotelli. Sign him.
 

Zacheryah

Senior Member
Aug 29, 2010
42,251
And you should really watch out for what words you're using when you're discussing this. You are neither starving nor in need of military action.

And if there is one thing that most definitely isn't the cure to Africa's problems it is more guns.
About private militia's, i found "lord of war" with nicolas cage a pretty good example. Just replace the role of cage by the west in general.
I've read all that and it will never happen. The currency thing sounds good in theory, but it really doesn't matter as some sort of exchange rate mechanism is necessary and the continent will keep on being exploited. Look at it this way: It's in no ones interest (at least no one relevant) to fix Africa. International firms want to keep maximizing profit, the established capitalist class in Africa want to further enrich themselves, the EU and US will keep up the protectionism which will make it impossible to sell African products on those markets.

The only one who cares are the people who are already suffering - and no one really gives a shit about them.
Pretty much sums up the rather cynical viewpoint i have of africa aswel. It allways strikes me people talk about uniting, whilst nearly every country has several rebel groups deviding the place. In the most brutal ways usually.

The way we "aid" africa, is even worse. We send money or food. Thats idiotic. The money goes into the pockets of corrupt officials and the established capitalist class, or to private militia's. Giving them food, means you destroy the market for the local farmers.
Mandela for example, was a great man. Unfortunatly, nearly everyone that rose with him, is corrupt as fuck. South africa (and entire africa basically) deserves better).

Meanwhile, we keep giving money, and make ourselves feel good.No. We should look in how we could actually improve africa. DO NOT send them stuff they can produce themselves. DO not send money that can be used to buy arms.
Send them technology and materials wich can be used to boost the local economy. Build schools, build powerplants, build wastewater threatment, send materials that enhance the agriculture.
Look at their economy. What can they specialise in ? Help them with knowledge and technology so that the can do these things.

But you know what ? We wont. Because its so damn easy, to abuse. Dumb electronic waste at their coasts and have adults and children get the different metals out of them. Why care about heavy metal posioning when you can turn a bigger profit right ?



evolution exists only in Pokemon
I really hope you arent serious about this.

- - - Updated - - -

Belgium and their creatine rage :lol:
Actually, that idiot came from the UK ;)
 
Jul 1, 2010
26,336
Yeah, and not believing in climate change at this point is almost as ignorant as dismissing evolution.
Not at all. Global temperatures haven't risen since 1998, which means that CO2 is not the main driver of climate, which is not a surprise since it never has been throughout history.

It is well established that if you increase CO2 emissions, you will get some warming due to the greenhouse gas effect. However, the warming our increasing CO2 emissions are causing is nowhere near what the IPCC and the media claim, as proven by the fact that emissions have continued to rise since 1998 while global temperatures have stalled.

The main drivers of climate are the sun (sunspots, intensification of the sun), maritime currents like El Niño, etc.

As the number of sunspots appears to diminish, we'll probably experience a cooling period for the next 30 years.

The ignorance is to believe such nonsense as propagandized by the mainstream without looking at the actual data. The mainstream belief that the majority of the warming since the 1950s was caused by man is absolute drivel.
 

Zacheryah

Senior Member
Aug 29, 2010
42,251
seriously, i dont care if its true or not.

however, i refuse to believe that my great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-greatx1000000000 grandfather/mother looked like this

I'm not blaming you, a university course of Biology could do wonders for you

Many people without the neccecary knowledge, dont understand things, and reject them, untill they obtain that knowledge
Not at all. Global temperatures haven't risen since 1998, which means that CO2 is not the main driver of climate, which is not a surprise since it never has been throughout history.

It is well established that if you increase CO2 emissions, you will get some warming due to the greenhouse gas effect. However, the warming our increasing CO2 emissions are causing is nowhere near what the IPCC and the media claim, as proven by the fact that emissions have continued to rise since 1998 while global temperatures have stalled.

The main drivers of climate are the sun (sunspots, intensification of the sun), maritime currents like El Niño, etc.

As the number of sunspots appears to diminish, we'll probably experience a cooling period for the next 30 years.

The ignorance is to believe such nonsense as propagandized by the mainstream without looking at the actual data. The mainstream belief that the majority of the warming since the 1950s was caused by man is absolute drivel.
Its a dangerous thing you mention there tbh. Because its not that easy.

First of all, CO2 is a pretty strong greenhouse gas. Not as strong as methane, but pretty strong on its own.
Emissions per year are a wrong measurement, you need to look at assimilation.

Each year, a certain amount of CO2 is produced by burning fossil enerergy, on top of other CO2 producing reactions such as daytime respiration for Eukaryotes and prokaryotes.
Each year, a certain amount of CO2 is assimilated by eukaryotes and a variety of bacteria, for growth and energyproduction.

As long as all the produced CO2 is assimilated, there is not a problem. However, since the start of the industrial revolution, there has been excess.
Because of excess, this CO2 is allowed to build up,wich increases the athmosphetic concentration. This can be seen in the followign image:



What we learn from this image, is that the increased emissions per year, are speeding up the concentration increase.


Now, global temperature is not a good measurement in this case. Global warming is something to be extrapolated over centuries. A timeperiod as short as 16 years is far to small, because of the great many buffers the earth has. However, as you mention, solar activity has a direct impact, and this gives the very dangerous wrong implementation of the facts you just made.

The ice caps, buffer water temperature, and they directly influence the jet streams, wich is the true factor for climate. El Nino is a phenomenon caused by jet streams. And in the recent decades its occuring more often.
Thanks to the gigantic capacity of water to retain temperature, a period as short as 2 decades, could show a relative halt in increasing temperature. It will be counteracted by a speedup of the melting of icecaps and slight changes in jet streams. But slight changes, can have greater results.



As can be seen here, a clear speed up of the melting, in the same time period where you said that the temperature stopped rising.


But are the enviromentalists right ? Nope. They mostly try to shock people with extreme scenario's, usually not academically underbuild.
Are the "anti enviromental lobby" right ? Nope. They are the ones who use blatant propaganda, and ignore the issue because of profit maximalisation.

Who is right ? the academics.
Academic studies have a clear list of the consequences for each 0.5 degree celcuis rise of global temperature.
They have made the models that link global warming to greenhouse gas effect, the buffers , and the importance of ice caps.
Before the ice caps melt, we'll see mostly nothing. Perhaps some bad harvests and rainseasons. Most cynical model shows the caps to have melted at 2040.

But why is all this so very important ? Because it only goes one way. And this is very critical.
We can do what we do, and accumulate greenhouse gasses in the athmosphere and have the place warm up. But we cannot reverse this. There is no way we can get rid of these greenhouse gasses. There is no way we can revert global warming.
the most disturbing, is that there is a point of no return. This point means if the temperature rises above that given point, it will keep accelerating and there is nothing we can do anymore.

Sources : University courses of "sustainable technology" and "enviromental remediation", and lectures of various profs at the kekule cyclus of 2012 and 2014 at University of Antwerp.
 

ALC

Ohaulick
Oct 28, 2010
46,035
Zizinho dropping knowledge on you niggas all over the place. And no zizi, your great-great-great x 1000 grandmother/father didn't look like that. You came from a different planet.
 

GordoDeCentral

Diez
Moderator
Apr 14, 2005
69,443
I'm not blaming you, a university course of Biology could do wonders for you

Many people without the neccecary knowledge, dont understand things, and reject them, untill they obtain that knowledge


Its a dangerous thing you mention there tbh. Because its not that easy.

First of all, CO2 is a pretty strong greenhouse gas. Not as strong as methane, but pretty strong on its own.
Emissions per year are a wrong measurement, you need to look at assimilation.

Each year, a certain amount of CO2 is produced by burning fossil enerergy, on top of other CO2 producing reactions such as daytime respiration for Eukaryotes and prokaryotes.
Each year, a certain amount of CO2 is assimilated by eukaryotes and a variety of bacteria, for growth and energyproduction.

As long as all the produced CO2 is assimilated, there is not a problem. However, since the start of the industrial revolution, there has been excess.
Because of excess, this CO2 is allowed to build up,wich increases the athmosphetic concentration. This can be seen in the followign image:



What we learn from this image, is that the increased emissions per year, are speeding up the concentration increase.


Now, global temperature is not a good measurement in this case. Global warming is something to be extrapolated over centuries. A timeperiod as short as 16 years is far to small, because of the great many buffers the earth has. However, as you mention, solar activity has a direct impact, and this gives the very dangerous wrong implementation of the facts you just made.

The ice caps, buffer water temperature, and they directly influence the jet streams, wich is the true factor for climate. El Nino is a phenomenon caused by jet streams. And in the recent decades its occuring more often.
Thanks to the gigantic capacity of water to retain temperature, a period as short as 2 decades, could show a relative halt in increasing temperature. It will be counteracted by a speedup of the melting of icecaps and slight changes in jet streams. But slight changes, can have greater results.



As can be seen here, a clear speed up of the melting, in the same time period where you said that the temperature stopped rising.


But are the enviromentalists right ? Nope. They mostly try to shock people with extreme scenario's, usually not academically underbuild.
Are the "anti enviromental lobby" right ? Nope. They are the ones who use blatant propaganda, and ignore the issue because of profit maximalisation.

Who is right ? the academics.
Academic studies have a clear list of the consequences for each 0.5 degree celcuis rise of global temperature.
They have made the models that link global warming to greenhouse gas effect, the buffers , and the importance of ice caps.
Before the ice caps melt, we'll see mostly nothing. Perhaps some bad harvests and rainseasons. Most cynical model shows the caps to have melted at 2040.

But why is all this so very important ? Because it only goes one way. And this is very critical.
We can do what we do, and accumulate greenhouse gasses in the athmosphere and have the place warm up. But we cannot reverse this. There is no way we can get rid of these greenhouse gasses. There is no way we can revert global warming.
the most disturbing, is that there is a point of no return. This point means if the temperature rises above that given point, it will keep accelerating and there is nothing we can do anymore.

Sources : University courses of "sustainable technology" and "enviromental remediation", and lectures of various profs at the kekule cyclus of 2012 and 2014 at University of Antwerp.


:tup: thanks brother
 

Zacheryah

Senior Member
Aug 29, 2010
42,251
Earlyer this year in May, first "doomsday" reports came up, that the melting of the antartic icecaps would have gone past its return point.
Aka they will melt, we cannot reverse it even entire humanity and its emissions suddenly vanished.


Probably a rapport that calculates with worst case scenario's everywhere, but good for enviromentalists nontheless.

Because the issue, is middle ground. The more effort goes into the lobby against the enviroment, the more fuel enviromentalists need to counter it, so that the public opinion is around the middle of that, wich is exactly where academics are.
 

zizinho

Senior Member
Apr 14, 2013
51,816
I'm not blaming you, a university course of Biology could do wonders for you

Many people without the neccecary knowledge, dont understand things, and reject them, untill they obtain that knowledge.
OK, youre a smart person, you have been on these courses, convince me. with facts. not with theories...

- - - Updated - - -

Zizinho dropping knowledge on you $#@!s all over the place. And no zizi, your great-great-great x 1000 grandmother/father didn't look like that. You came from a different planet.
 

Ocelot

Midnight Marauder
Jul 13, 2013
18,943
I'm not blaming you, a university course of Biology could do wonders for you

Many people without the neccecary knowledge, dont understand things, and reject them, untill they obtain that knowledge


Its a dangerous thing you mention there tbh. Because its not that easy.

First of all, CO2 is a pretty strong greenhouse gas. Not as strong as methane, but pretty strong on its own.
Emissions per year are a wrong measurement, you need to look at assimilation.

Each year, a certain amount of CO2 is produced by burning fossil enerergy, on top of other CO2 producing reactions such as daytime respiration for Eukaryotes and prokaryotes.
Each year, a certain amount of CO2 is assimilated by eukaryotes and a variety of bacteria, for growth and energyproduction.

As long as all the produced CO2 is assimilated, there is not a problem. However, since the start of the industrial revolution, there has been excess.
Because of excess, this CO2 is allowed to build up,wich increases the athmosphetic concentration. This can be seen in the followign image:



What we learn from this image, is that the increased emissions per year, are speeding up the concentration increase.


Now, global temperature is not a good measurement in this case. Global warming is something to be extrapolated over centuries. A timeperiod as short as 16 years is far to small, because of the great many buffers the earth has. However, as you mention, solar activity has a direct impact, and this gives the very dangerous wrong implementation of the facts you just made.

The ice caps, buffer water temperature, and they directly influence the jet streams, wich is the true factor for climate. El Nino is a phenomenon caused by jet streams. And in the recent decades its occuring more often.
Thanks to the gigantic capacity of water to retain temperature, a period as short as 2 decades, could show a relative halt in increasing temperature. It will be counteracted by a speedup of the melting of icecaps and slight changes in jet streams. But slight changes, can have greater results.



As can be seen here, a clear speed up of the melting, in the same time period where you said that the temperature stopped rising.


But are the enviromentalists right ? Nope. They mostly try to shock people with extreme scenario's, usually not academically underbuild.
Are the "anti enviromental lobby" right ? Nope. They are the ones who use blatant propaganda, and ignore the issue because of profit maximalisation.

Who is right ? the academics.
Academic studies have a clear list of the consequences for each 0.5 degree celcuis rise of global temperature.
They have made the models that link global warming to greenhouse gas effect, the buffers , and the importance of ice caps.
Before the ice caps melt, we'll see mostly nothing. Perhaps some bad harvests and rainseasons. Most cynical model shows the caps to have melted at 2040.

But why is all this so very important ? Because it only goes one way. And this is very critical.
We can do what we do, and accumulate greenhouse gasses in the athmosphere and have the place warm up. But we cannot reverse this. There is no way we can get rid of these greenhouse gasses. There is no way we can revert global warming.
the most disturbing, is that there is a point of no return. This point means if the temperature rises above that given point, it will keep accelerating and there is nothing we can do anymore.

Sources : University courses of "sustainable technology" and "enviromental remediation", and lectures of various profs at the kekule cyclus of 2012 and 2014 at University of Antwerp.
:tup:


OK, youre a smart person, you have been on these courses, convince me. with facts. not with theories...
Being a theory is as certain as any scientific explanation can ever become, per definition
A scientific theory is a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world that is acquired through the scientific method, and repeatedly confirmed through observation and experimentation.
The trouble and confusion here often stems from the term theory, as a we normally use it in our everyday language, meaning something else entirely, and actually having more in common with a scientific hypothesis, a sort-of "prestage" to a theory.

In science, a statement of a possible explanation for some natural phenomenon. A hypothesis is tested by drawing conclusions from it; if observation and experimentation show a conclusion to be false, the hypothesis must be false
Even if we were to invent a time machine, travel back in time and observe evolution as it happens, it still would not be "more" than a theory. Plate tectonics, for example, is "just" a theory as well.
 

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