Libya 2011 Demonstrations (3 Viewers)
- Thread starter ReBeL
- Start date
A pretty poor showing for the UK, France, US and whoever else joined in the bullyboy effort aimed at strengthening western control of an oil rich state by putting into power several rival factions, some of whom have definite links to al-qaeda, who will now likely spend more time killing each other than repairing the damage caused by this Western supported civil war...still, rather than let passion propel this into a rant of sorts, of my scorn towards the continuing to spread neo imperialist foolhardy wargames, I have a question to ask, of anyone who has a concrete idea of what happens to Gaddafi's financial interests.
During the last 6 months the Colonel apparently lost control of his company LAFICO...which holds a 7.5% stake in Juventus football club. However, i also read that one of Gaddafi's sons spoke with a chap from the financial times, David Owen, and suggested that the investment in Juventus would be safeguarded.
So...what happens to that 7.5% of Juventus??? Who now owns/administers LAFICO??Who decides what happens to the shares??
Any input would be greatly appreciated.
During the last 6 months the Colonel apparently lost control of his company LAFICO...which holds a 7.5% stake in Juventus football club. However, i also read that one of Gaddafi's sons spoke with a chap from the financial times, David Owen, and suggested that the investment in Juventus would be safeguarded.
So...what happens to that 7.5% of Juventus??? Who now owns/administers LAFICO??Who decides what happens to the shares??
Any input would be greatly appreciated.
Exor bought the stake back from whom??? Gaddafi's assets were frozen and placed in waiting for the new government to be formed who would surely then have the option of keeping the shares, selling them to a third party (with the approval of Juventus) or selling them back to the club...do you know of confirmation that they were sold back? that would be strange given the constantly changing nature of the forming govenment...the situation in Libya is clearly hugely more complicated than you or i put it, IZ. And the US and UK in particular have very little recent form for improving the general standard oif living for the countries they 'liberate', and steady form for making life worse for many. Thats just my view, and you have your view. Then again if you live there, or have spent a lengthy period of time there, your opinion has more weight. Obviously...anyway, im uninterested in getting involved heavily with political debate, and would really like to find out what has happened to those shares. 7.5% seems like a large share, 2nd biggest after exor?
I don't necessarily agree or disagree, but you do know that the video was recorded in front of the Rixos hotel which is still completely under control by Gedaffi forces?
Yesterday NATO intercepted Scud missiles that were aimed at Misrata, in an area full of civilians. That is just yesterday that they were responsible for saving hundreds of lives.
I don't mean this in a bad way, its just the truth. Do you actually know anything about Libya? Do you know anything about the Gedaffi era before the revolution started? Do you know what happened in Libya in the period between 15th Feb when the revolution started and 19 March when the NATO intervened?
I just want to know what i'm dealing with here. Because a lot of people have no idea about Libya or its circumstances but are following the issue because they're anti west and anti nato.
Yesterday NATO intercepted Scud missiles that were aimed at Misrata, in an area full of civilians. That is just yesterday that they were responsible for saving hundreds of lives.
I don't mean this in a bad way, its just the truth. Do you actually know anything about Libya? Do you know anything about the Gedaffi era before the revolution started? Do you know what happened in Libya in the period between 15th Feb when the revolution started and 19 March when the NATO intervened?
I just want to know what i'm dealing with here. Because a lot of people have no idea about Libya or its circumstances but are following the issue because they're anti west and anti nato.
you bet wrong. But yes, I know only as much as reading the guardian, indepedent and al jazeera regularly informs me. I am a little better informed with the syrian and egyptian situations as I have syrian and egyptian friends here in Melbourne, whose families have lived in those regions most of their lives. I am aware that you are from the middle east...have you spent any time in Libya? If so, I would gladly welcome some education on the matter. I am extremely malleable, and open to factual improvement in my opinions on countries I have never visited, let alone lived in. For example, I was carried along on a wave of revolutionary zeal when the egyptian crisis began, having held a rather critical view of mubarak for many moons. However, spouting my stance to my egyptian lady friend, was met with shock and horror and anger. It was incredibly refreshing and illuminating to get a different set of facts straight from the horses mouth...so please, if you have first hand knowledge of Libya, first hand knowledge of the rebel factions, then share and educate.
The battle for Bab el Aziziya has started. This is going to be the toughest battle in Tripoli. Bab el Aziziya is where the presidential compound is located. It is protected by three layers of "Kharasan Mosala7"(Rebel, can you translate this?). It is also surrounded by tanks and snipers that are now protecting the compound. There is a big possibility that Gedaffi and his sons are in it.
Mate, I'm Libyan through and through 
If you look at UN reports, Libya is second last in terms of freedom of speech, freedom of press etc. Second only to North Korea. Gedaffi has been responsible for the killing of thousands of Libyans even before the revolution. Attempting to create political parties, or any form of opposition to Gedaffi is punished by hanging. In the 70's and 80's Libyan State TV used to air live, public hangings of opposition figures in Tripoli and Benghazi. In fact, we have a member here on these forums whose uncle was hanged live on TV, his only crime and the only accusation leveled against him was that he participated in activities which opposed Gedaffi while in the United States, he didn't die immediately when he was hanged, so one of Gedaffi's loyalists, hanged on his feet and pulled so that he broke his neck. This of course was on Live TV. Of course he was never put on trial.
The biggest crime Gedaffi has committed was the Abu Slim prison massacre in 1996. Abu Slim is a prison that is used to jail political prisoners, most of them are educated people and intellectuals, and of course the majority were never put on trial. In 1996 prisoners protested against the terrible and inhumane circumstances of the prison, they were rounded up in the front yard and were riddled with machine gun bullets, 1300 prisoners died in 3 and a half hours. We have tens of thousands of political prisoners in Libya, who are never put on trial. I personally have a few close relatives that are in jail, and have been in jail for over 10 years, and still have not been put on trial.
In 15 February 2011, the relatives of the victims of Abu Slim massacre, went out on an organized protest asking the government to admit to the crime and to give the bodies of the victims to their families. They were met with live ammunition, courtesy of the Libyan government. 16 February more people came out, not only the victims families, they were met with live ammunition too and there were many deaths. On the 17th of February, thousands came out in the cities of Benghazi, Misrata, Zintan, Tobrok and el Baytha. This time the government was even more ready for them, they used anti aircraft weapons, 14.5mm anti tank weapons to disperse the protesters, in Benghazi alone over 300 died that day. Saif el Islam, Gedaffi's son came out on TV and threatened that he will turn Libya into a blood bath if this continued. This is when the Libyans understood, that the only way this regime would be toppled is by force. So in 18th February, the Libyan rebels started raiding weapon storages, and the conflict became an armed conflict.
Benghazi was liberated in the 22nd of February, many attempts to regain it were unsuccessful. So in March, Gedaffi started using another option, bombardment by air and by sea. Hundred were dying all over Libya, while Gedaffi the mad dog was bombing his own people. Worse thing is, even on live tv, he didn't deny any of this(like the Syrian president would), instead he warned that he will hunt down the opposition and cleanse Libya of them. In mid March, thousands of Gedaffi's forces marched on to Benghazi with heavy weapons, if they got Benghazi back, there was absolutely no doubt that a huge massacre would happen ala the Srebrenica massacre in Bosnia. That is when the international community intervened, if the coalition forces had been late only a day or two more, there would have been no doubt that a huge massacre would have happened in Benghazi.
If you look at UN reports, Libya is second last in terms of freedom of speech, freedom of press etc. Second only to North Korea. Gedaffi has been responsible for the killing of thousands of Libyans even before the revolution. Attempting to create political parties, or any form of opposition to Gedaffi is punished by hanging. In the 70's and 80's Libyan State TV used to air live, public hangings of opposition figures in Tripoli and Benghazi. In fact, we have a member here on these forums whose uncle was hanged live on TV, his only crime and the only accusation leveled against him was that he participated in activities which opposed Gedaffi while in the United States, he didn't die immediately when he was hanged, so one of Gedaffi's loyalists, hanged on his feet and pulled so that he broke his neck. This of course was on Live TV. Of course he was never put on trial.
The biggest crime Gedaffi has committed was the Abu Slim prison massacre in 1996. Abu Slim is a prison that is used to jail political prisoners, most of them are educated people and intellectuals, and of course the majority were never put on trial. In 1996 prisoners protested against the terrible and inhumane circumstances of the prison, they were rounded up in the front yard and were riddled with machine gun bullets, 1300 prisoners died in 3 and a half hours. We have tens of thousands of political prisoners in Libya, who are never put on trial. I personally have a few close relatives that are in jail, and have been in jail for over 10 years, and still have not been put on trial.
In 15 February 2011, the relatives of the victims of Abu Slim massacre, went out on an organized protest asking the government to admit to the crime and to give the bodies of the victims to their families. They were met with live ammunition, courtesy of the Libyan government. 16 February more people came out, not only the victims families, they were met with live ammunition too and there were many deaths. On the 17th of February, thousands came out in the cities of Benghazi, Misrata, Zintan, Tobrok and el Baytha. This time the government was even more ready for them, they used anti aircraft weapons, 14.5mm anti tank weapons to disperse the protesters, in Benghazi alone over 300 died that day. Saif el Islam, Gedaffi's son came out on TV and threatened that he will turn Libya into a blood bath if this continued. This is when the Libyans understood, that the only way this regime would be toppled is by force. So in 18th February, the Libyan rebels started raiding weapon storages, and the conflict became an armed conflict.
Benghazi was liberated in the 22nd of February, many attempts to regain it were unsuccessful. So in March, Gedaffi started using another option, bombardment by air and by sea. Hundred were dying all over Libya, while Gedaffi the mad dog was bombing his own people. Worse thing is, even on live tv, he didn't deny any of this(like the Syrian president would), instead he warned that he will hunt down the opposition and cleanse Libya of them. In mid March, thousands of Gedaffi's forces marched on to Benghazi with heavy weapons, if they got Benghazi back, there was absolutely no doubt that a huge massacre would happen ala the Srebrenica massacre in Bosnia. That is when the international community intervened, if the coalition forces had been late only a day or two more, there would have been no doubt that a huge massacre would have happened in Benghazi.
The more i read about Saif and about Mohd Gedaffi escaping it gets my blood boiling. The Transitional National Council handled this in a very naive way. I appreciate the fact that they're trying to instill law and order and don't want to look like they're going on revenge killings. But it was very stupid to just allow Mohd Gedaffi stay in his house, and if Saif was ever under their custody(which i now strongly doubt) and ran away that just makes it look worse. I think we should take a leaf out of America's book on this one, we're fighting for the liberation of Libya, and Gedaffi's sons are the biggest obstacle, don't show them any remorse, don't show them any pity. Go in there fast and strong, Navy Seal style, you ask them to surrender once, they refuse, just storm into the place, blow the whole fucking place up if you have to, no more mr nice guy, it hasn't really worked well for us, and we've been made to look very silly by Saif and Mohd.