Libya 2011 Demonstrations (15 Viewers)

Fred

Senior Member
Oct 2, 2003
41,113
Arabs will always need guns :klin:


You're going to lock be in a house with no alcohol or smokes for my own good aren't you :D?
Nay, you're old enough to make your own choices. I'll show you, that you can have a good time without being wasted though :D

Saw a show yesterday where Michel Collon french journalist very known and respected where he said that they were evidencea report signed by the Ex chef of France secret sevices that Nato especially the US, France, and Belguim had contacts with Al Qayda's section in Lybia and he even confronted Isabelle Durand (Ecolo), Pieter De Crem who was shocked. I find it interesting.
Depends who you call el Qaeda. I see many Western sources equating "The Islamic Fighting Group" in Libya with "Al Qayda". While i do not endorse the former, it is nothing like Al Qaeda. Al Qaeda does not have a problem killing innocent people if they believe it serves a "a greater goal", The Islamic Fighting group is completely against killing innocent people, Al Qayda has a worldwide agenda, the IFG has a Libyan agenda. The IFG's agenda has always been that Gedaffi should be fought by military force and that a new country based on Sharia law should be instated in Libya., that is their main agenda. The only reason it is equated with Al Qayda is because Libyan IFG members fought side to side with Al Qaeda in the Soviet Afghan war. In all cases, the IFG was dissolved a few years ago.
 

Buy on AliExpress.com

Cheesio

**********
Jul 11, 2006
22,514
From an Interview with a news paper. Michel Collon was in Lybia during the war.

In your book on Libya, you talk about media lies, which means that reality is quite different from that presented by NATO. Can you clarify that?

Michel Collon: All NATO campaign is based on a disinformation campaign of public opinion. This was manipulated to obtain approval for this war and this confirms what we said in previous wars. Every war begins with a media lie and the goal is to deceive and lull the public. Here, we began by telling us his people bombed Qaddafi. In this case, of course, we must do something. But they were entirely made by information Al Jazeera first, Al Arabia, then. You still have to point out that Al Jazeera is the TV of Qatar and the Emir of Qatar is involved in the war. It is in the NATO alliance. Qatar has invested in Libya but it was not very satisfied. He wanted to actually get its hands on the gas from Libya. Qatar has the ambition to become a global gas giant, to stand up to Russia and, of course, on this point, it is supported by the United States and France. In addition, Libya's Gaddafi was planning to create a large industrial and financial hub in the Middle East, Qatar has the same project, therefore, by rivalry. Qatar insists on being the great Arab power in the economic and financial. What makes us say that it is an economic war on its part. So, as Al Jazeera is owned by the Emir of Qatar, it is clear that he was bringing to heel. Al Jazeera who had played a very noble and very brave in Palestine or Iraq, became a soldier and a remote tele NATO.

Several sources suggested that some images broadcast by Al Jazeera were turned in a setting made in the green square representing Qatar, Al Azizia, etc.. Do you have any information on this?

Yes, I heard that, I could not check. But apparently, according to early indications, there is even a confirmation of the head of the CNT as what we would actually staged false images of liberation to demoralize the troops, and it goes in the same direction. It did not stop to announce that Gaddafi and his son had died, or was on the run. The British Foreign Minister said he had come to Venezuela. This kind of info is classic in every war. This information is absolutely false to demoralize the enemy and to deceive international opinion. Believe that everything is over. So check on these images. We will do this with our team. But also, every war brings a lot of misinformation in the news. And the novelty is that indeed it is directed squarely images in the studio. I would just add to what I said at the beginning, the NATO campaign is based on the idea that Gaddafi-bombed his people. The Russian satellites have shown that nothing happened like that. All the witnesses said it was false, it was said that Gaddafi employed mercenaries. It is also said that Gaddafi had ordered his soldiers to mass rape and he provided them with containers of viagra for that. It is also a classic of disinformation in all wars: demonize the army that you resist the cover of slander on sexual crimes. It had also served in Bosnia. In fact, it must be said that all the NATO campaign was to mislead the public to have an excuse to bomb, because in fact it did not protect civilians, they wanted to overthrow the Libyan government, steal the oil, steal financial resources.

Most of the media "official" claim that it is the insurgents who toppled Gaddafi as NATO does an air cover. Other sources, against, argue that the special forces, French and British landed in Tripoli. What story can you confirm, you who have been on the ground?

In fact the insurgents or rebels, are not a significant popular force, which would have to overthrow the Libyan government. That's the difference with the Tunisian and Egyptian revolt when the people were unanimous to get rid of tyrants hated, and here there is a very minor insurrection which, if it had not been established, armed and supported by the NATO bombing, could never gain power and, in fact, has already been removed by the Libyan forces long ago. I speak in the military. These are actually the NATO bombing that made the decision, and the French special forces, British and other troops that framed, directed them, give them the information and, according to testimony, were part of the dirty work of Elimination of resistance and personalities.

So, apparently, the French and British forces were present on the ground?

This is what I wrote in my paper "Understanding the war in April." The Italian secret services, given that Italy is in a large commercial rivalry with France in Libya and were furious at the involvement of Sarkozy, have not hesitated to balance the fact that the French secret services were active in the field before the UN resolution and that they continued in violation of resolution 1973.

Some argue that these "rebels" were mostly mercenaries Saudi, Qatari and even Colombian drug traffickers. What is it really?

Indeed, it has a lot of indications that there is a privatization of war by the United States. Obama and his entourage including, Brzezinski and strategists like this, have learned from the Bush era. The United States can no longer, they have never won a war - except the one against the tiny island of Grenada - so they never won a war on the ground. So the method has been to Obama outsource the war. There is a kind of privatization. Qatari brigades are sent, are entrusted with the care UAE to set up a private army of mercenaries, in fact, that were on the ground in Libya and who were trained by instructors from the United States and other Western countries. This is the privatization of war that allows Obama to say that the army of the United States withdraws from Iraq but in fact it makes subcontracting. On drug traffickers, yes, I also had information, but I was not an eyewitness, that executives and Colombian mercenaries were on the one hand in training the army of the UAE which I have speaking and also in the field. You should know that there are actually very close collaboration between Israeli forces, the Colombian forces in Colombia and other countries. So, there is a sort of international mercenaries and subcontracting of the war.

You met people we had as mercenaries, it's what you tell in your next book. Who are they really?

This is one of the worst media lies of the Western media to justify the war. We were told from the beginning that Gaddafi was so isolated in fact it was only mercenaries to support him. Then we were introduced to blacks who were killed in eastern Libya in the first place and we were told that people were angry against these mercenaries and they were killed like that. In fact, it is known to all connoisseurs of Libya in the Benghazi region, there has long been an anti-black racism as well as racism against the Libyans in darker skin, that is to say Libyans in the South. And this racism therefore turned on the one hand, against the Libyans with black skin and, secondly, against Africans living in Libya for a long time and had to be Libyan nationality, or papers, a home, etc.. This is the structure of the Libyan economy. There are a lot of immigrants in hotels, restaurants, cleaning services and maintenance. A very large proportion of manual work is done by people from Black Africa who were also very happy because in Libya, they had a good situation and they easily got the papers, a house, a car, good salary, which is in stark contrast to the situation in their country of origin where they suffer from poverty and persecution in many cases, and the situation in Europe where they are chasing or they are locked in a kind of prison for immigrants . They were very grateful to Gaddafi precisely because he has always fought against anti-black racism. This is outrageous from the Western media is that we have given a confirmation of this theory, these rebels racist as what these Africans were mercenaries, we must kill them. And in reality, that way, it has supported people who practice ethnic cleansing. The irony is that this is the first black president of the United States who supported the movement who practice ethnic cleansing against blacks. Personally I have met Africans who came to Bab El Azizia, the presidential palace. And they came spontaneously form a kind of human shield. They loved Gaddafi, they were happy with what he had done for them. They came when NATO began bombing his palace. Me, I talked to these people, they were men of all ages, children, women. I'm sorry, when you are mercenaries we do not put these women and children deal with these bombings and military operations, so it's ridiculous. I was extremely shocked to see people with whom I spoke and were very friendly, highly motivated, hands tied behind their backs and were tortured and slaughtered like animals and left there on the ground. It must be said that the West supports weapon and excuse people who are terrorists and racists, it must be said.
 

IrishZebra

Western Imperialist
Jun 18, 2006
23,327
:lol: Tell that to the people butchered by the mad-dog and the people who died freeing Libya, crack-pot. Honestly, the stuff some of these cunts come up with, it's The Protocols of the Elders of Zion level shit
 

Cheesio

**********
Jul 11, 2006
22,514
During the siege of Tripoli, the journalist Thierry Meyssan forward a figure of 1,300 dead and 5,000 wounded, all civilians. Do you have specific information about this?

Here I have nothing more to say about the numbers. As you know, the numbers, it's always something very difficult to estimate and I do not have jurisdiction to give a figure. There is a study that was done recently and argued that NATO would have dropped 30,000 bombs. If we make an estimate not very high, which is two deaths per bomb, we arrive at a figure of 60,000 dead.

This misinformation has had an impact in Europe or on the contrary, the opinion is it enough informed about the reality of events, including through alternative media?

Unfortunately, yes. Disinformation was an absolutely devastating impact on European public opinion. There was virtually no protest, except very small. Unfortunately, even the antiwar movement, progressives in Europe think that this time, Obama and Sarkozy have led a good war. And I would add that, unfortunately, a very large proportion of people from Arab and Muslim living in Europe feel the same way because of the role of Al Jazeera as I just said. So yes, in terms of information battle, now the situation is pretty disastrous, lying largely prevailed.

In Iraq, the war was started on false grounds (weapons of mass destruction, Saddam-Al Qaeda connection ...). Later, the truth has emerged into the open and public opinion realized that she had been deceived. About Libya, how NATO will she handle the media situation in the post-Qadhafi?

Indeed, it was a repeat of the media lies about Iraq and, as I have said is that European opinion was, at least after a while, very skeptical and very knowledgeable about the media lie about weapons of mass destruction, and here it must be said that it worked. If you go down the street and you ask anybody, you have nine out of ten people will tell you: yes, it bombed its population. Now, how NATO will she handle the media situation in the post-Qadhafi? The problem is that we must first impose a debate where the public has a right to know, to check the quality of information given to it. And there, the group task as Investig'Action behind our site. We released a lot of articles and we will continue. We just left the little book I mentioned Libya, NATO and media lies and to be released in a week. It is very important that public opinion realizes that it was handled and because of this there are tens of thousands of Libyans who died and the country will experience the same hell as Iraq. So this is the first battle to be taken. I hope some honest journalists of the mainstream media will realize, though, that every war they are trapped and there is a duty to tell the public: yes, it was handled. It is a duty, because NATO clearly announces that they will go after Syria, Iran, Venezuela, I also think that Algeria is also in the sights. So the media lies, it has terrible consequences and it is our duty to force a debate on that. Of course, NATO has an interest in that there is no debate and what is happening in the following cases, and the whole question. Is it going to happen to force a debate and that the public know that she was deceived?

In March 2007, U.S. General Wesley Clark said in an interview that memo, which was shown at the Pentagon in 2001, explained how the U.S. administration was planning to take control of seven countries in five years: Iraq , Syria, Lebanon, Libya, Somalia, Sudan and Iran. What are the issues and objectives of such a campaign?

General Wesley Clark, it must be remembered, not anyone. It is man who bombed very brutally by the way, Yugoslavia in 1999. So it's not a leftist or a conspiracy theorist. He is a man of the device that knows what he's talking about. So when he said that seven more countries from Afghanistan would be invaded or controlled by the United States, this confirms the analysis we did in 2000-2001 of the policy of the United States and the people around Bush, the famous Project for the New American Century, which actually was a policy of control of the Middle East and the Muslim world, as explained elsewhere in the book that we published in a month and that s 'entitled Understanding the Muslim world with interview with Mohamed Hassan analyzes the strategic relationship between the United States, Europe and the Arab and Muslim world, the Middle East, Africa and also Asia. In fact, the takeover of these countries, it's part of a campaign to re-colonization of the world. The United States, is an economy in crisis, the international capitalist system is in crisis with a generally declining rate of profit, with, for the United States, the relocation of their factories, their industry and the fact that it is less and less value is created in the United States themselves, so it's an economic parasite that lives on the backs of the South. The United States has a big problem: Their economic power is steadily declining, economy in crisis, they failed state, their dollar is worth nothing, and the only way to halt this decline and remain number one, it is the military advantage is to take control of countries just to colonize as was done in time to loot their wealth. This is what will happen with Libya for oil, water, and very large financial reserves, in addition, there have been destroyed as much as possible in order to reconstruct as much as possible as you can see already now all the construction companies and others who rush like vultures to take greater profits from anything they have destroyed. So I think that the campaign to control all these countries, which will not stop after Libya, and it must be stressed, is a campaign of re-colonization of the world.

The intervention of France in Libya is an "investment in the future," said recently the French Minister of Foreign Affairs Alain Juppe in an interview with the daily Le Parisien. This implies that after the fall of Gaddafi, many contenders are vying for capture Libyan wealth. Who do you lead this new concert, Europeans or Americans?


When I spoke of battle between vultures, it is indeed an economic battle for contracts and, just Tripoli she was invaded, that already in the French press, Italian and others, there was information that they fought like rag about who would take the largest share of the spoils. So we share as Libya colonial powers divided the African Conference of Berlin in 1884-1885. That is to say that the strong take the chunks, the weaker the small pieces and those who chose the wrong horse, or arrived too late to receive nothing. France says: we we were in a point, we take 35%. It thus confirms that it was an economic war, a war for money.

The attack on Libya has several issues (political, economic, strategic), this does he not a first step to control of Africa since the first American concern is first to install the famous Africom?

As I indicated in the text "Understanding the war in Libya" at the beginning of the book I mentioned above. The war against Libya actually several issues, like all wars waged by the United States, because a war is a big investment, risk, and it does not conduct a war this size for a single small goal. The objectives of the war against Libya are oil, financial reserves and very important, in fact, it is to break the role of Libya as a financial alternative for Africa. Libya, Algeria, as elsewhere, from what we explained, acts as a financial alternative for a variety of African countries that are subject to blackmail by the multinationals of Europe and the United States who take the raw materials to the lowest price, refusing to invest in a real economy of transformation and service is growing in Africa, and in fact, alternative financing helped Africa regaining its independence, to stand on its own. It is clear that this is a war against Africa and, in fact since the economic battle for global resources is raging, the United States interested in military control. Considering that all belongs to them, the United States divided the world into a series of zones, they organize their forces and operations in all these areas. There 'was no basis for Africa because it was considered less interesting than others, but in recent years, the United States know that we are trying to find more oil in Africa, which is now fighting for raw materials and minerals and other of Africa, it is to prevent China to have normal economic relations with African countries, will provide raw material and energy, so they decided to militarize the problem and install a military force to prevent these countries have a self-development and prevent China to have trade relations with African countries. Africom is thus the major project, and what it should be noted is that five countries in Africa have, to my knowledge, refused to integrate into NATO and to work with her, and they are all already attacked or threatened by the United States. They are Libya, Sudan, Zimbabwe, Eritrea and Ivory Coast. All under sanction, attacked or assaulted soon.
 

Fred

Senior Member
Oct 2, 2003
41,113
Whole interview is bullshit to be honest. Funniest part is where they say the rebels aren't a significant popular force like the Tunisian and Egyptian one. No way is that true, first of all Gedaffi is worst than Mubarak and Ben Ali put together, second of all, about 98% of Libyans i know are completely for the revolution and absolutely against Gedaffi. As for the mercenaries, there isn't a shred of evidence that there were mercenaries fighting amongst the rebels. I can point you to tens maybe even hundreds of videos clearly showing both African and Eastern European mercenaries fighting for Gedaffi. The interview is 95% bullshit, so i can't talk about every point. The only thing he's right about, is that we couldnt have done it without NATO, well ya sure, most rebels were civilians before the revolution. You can't expect them to fight alone against a fully armed Gedaffi loyalist army.
 

Fred

Senior Member
Oct 2, 2003
41,113
:lol: Tell that to the people butchered by the mad-dog and the people who died freeing Libya, crack-pot. Honestly, the stuff some of these cunts come up with, it's The Protocols of the Elders of Zion level shit
Conspiracy theorists can be really amazing. I'll show this to my friends and relatives living in Tripoli during all this, i'm pretty sure they'd have a laugh or think it could be used as a script for some movie.
 

Fred

Senior Member
Oct 2, 2003
41,113
You know before the revolution even the Libyan diaspora such as myself was afraid to speak against Gedaffi, because anyone could be a spy/works for the government etc. Being against Gedaffi either gets you jail time or a public hanging, so you needed to be that paranoid of course. The university i used to be in had quite a few Libyans, we were very careful around one another naturally. Now when the 17th Feb revolution came around, i had no idea what the others opinions were, we never dared to speak about politics before. I was surprised(even though i shouldn't be) to find out that all(yes every and each one) students here were completely against Gedaffi, and 100% with the revolution. Hence when cultural day came around, we unanimously agreed to raise the independence flag and not the green flag, despite the Libyan consulate here threatening that if we did that, they'd register our names and send it to the government there. The cultural day was in March, so the former Libyan regime was still pretty much in control.


Man gone are the days when you see a Libyan and get scared shitless :D
 

Cheesio

**********
Jul 11, 2006
22,514
You know before the revolution even the Libyan diaspora such as myself was afraid to speak against Gedaffi, because anyone could be a spy/works for the government etc. Being against Gedaffi either gets you jail time or a public hanging, so you needed to be that paranoid of course. The university i used to be in had quite a few Libyans, we were very careful around one another naturally. Now when the 17th Feb revolution came around, i had no idea what the others opinions were, we never dared to speak about politics before. I was surprised(even though i shouldn't be) to find out that all(yes every and each one) students here were completely against Gedaffi, and 100% with the revolution. Hence when cultural day came around, we unanimously agreed to raise the independence flag and not the green flag, despite the Libyan consulate here threatening that if we did that, they'd register our names and send it to the government there. The cultural day was in March, so the former Libyan regime was still pretty much in control.


Man gone are the days when you see a Libyan and get scared shitless :D
:tup: I'm Happy for you and all the Libyans.
 

Cheesio

**********
Jul 11, 2006
22,514
"نحن لا نستسلم... ننتصر أو نموت.... وهذه ليست النهاية... بل سيكون عليكم أن تحاربوا الجيل القادم والاجيال التي تليه... اما أنا... فإن عمري سيكون أطول من عمر شانقي."

اليوم ذكرى استشهاد شيخ الشهداء عمر المختار (16/09/1931
 

Fred

Senior Member
Oct 2, 2003
41,113
:touched: :touched:

To our English readers, that was a famous quote by one of the most famous leaders of the Jihad against Italian colonialism, the man they call the "Lion of the Desert", Omar el Mukhtar. This was when the Italians offered him a comfortable retirement in return for him convincing his people to stop resisting the Italians. His other choice was to be hanged in public, he chose the latter. This is what he said to the Italians. "We do not surrender, we win or we die. This is not the end, you will still have to fight the next generation and the generations after them. As for me, my life will be longer than that of my hangman"

Yesterday was the 80th anniversary of the martyrdom of the Lion of the Desert!
 
OP

ReBeL

The Jackal
Jan 14, 2005
22,871
  • Thread Starter
  • Thread Starter #1,833
    Congrats, Fred. Aljazeera says now that your city is now free from Qadhafi's gangs. Isn't it?
     

    Fred

    Senior Member
    Oct 2, 2003
    41,113
    Nope, its not. I called a relative there, and they still didn't liberate Sebha. Currently they are fighting Gedaffi forces in "Wady el Shaty" which is where my hometown is, they have liberated 75% of it. After they liberate all the villages in Al Shati, they will head to Sebha.
     
    OP

    ReBeL

    The Jackal
    Jan 14, 2005
    22,871
  • Thread Starter
  • Thread Starter #1,835
    Nope, its not. I called a relative there, and they still didn't liberate Sebha. Currently they are fighting Gedaffi forces in "Wady el Shaty" which is where my hometown is, they have liberated 75% of it. After they liberate all the villages in Al Shati, they will head to Sebha.
    I was talking about Al-Shati, not Sebha.
     

    Fred

    Senior Member
    Oct 2, 2003
    41,113
    Oh ya, you're right about that. Most of El Shati is liberated

    Very few people even Libyans don't know Al-Shati, so i usually say i am from Sebha. :D As Sebha is the closest city to my hometown, and the place a lot of my closest relatives live. So i assumed that i told you i am from Sabha, and you meant Sabha was liberated. But ya, Al Shati is free of Gedaffi's gangs. It wasn't even a tough battle, in a few hours it was liberated. They even killed Abdullah Senussi's nephew(Senussi is from Al Shati too). Abdullah Senussi fled as soon as the rebels were close.
     
    OP

    ReBeL

    The Jackal
    Jan 14, 2005
    22,871
  • Thread Starter
  • Thread Starter #1,837
    Oh ya, you're right about that. Most of El Shati is liberated

    Very few people even Libyans don't know Al-Shati, so i usually say i am from Sebha. :D As Sebha is the closest city to my hometown, and the place a lot of my closest relatives live. So i assumed that i told you i am from Sabha, and you meant Sabha was liberated. But ya, Al Shati is free of Gedaffi's gangs. It wasn't even a tough battle, in a few hours it was liberated. They even killed Abdullah Senussi's nephew(Senussi is from Al Shati too). Abdullah Senussi fled as soon as the rebels were close.
    So nice. Sebha will follow soon enshallah
     

    ridzy

    New Member
    Sep 19, 2011
    1
    I think at this time that the innocent peoples of these lands -and ours also. Are getting tired of the poor leadership that don't govern for the masses but only for the elite. The little guys deserve to at least live in peace with some dignity. I hope theses uprisings bring peace to the land and not war and destruction. And so with us as well.
     

    Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 13)