Kiev crisis / Euromaidan (3 Viewers)
- Thread starter Zé Tahir
- Start date
Did Zach just say that Russia, legitly, took back Crimea? Jesus 
Russia took the Krim itself with barely bloodshed. Afterwards, typically Russian, they send troops without a badge to go help the conflict turn bloody. As a way of retalliation.
You'd know this if you checked my posts but yeah, you need to be that asshole that cuts out a piece, and brand a person with it right
Asking "a person who lives there", is like asking "someone in ghaza". Can be a palestinian person, can also be some israely military person. Completely different opinion.
Russia took back the Krim, wich they had given to Ukraine. When Ukraine decided to fall for our EU bs to lure them out of soviet influence, Russia decided it didnt want to lose that important naval base, and had a vote of annexation/referendum. Not legit ? Whats the difference with Scotland if they'd voted to break away from the UK with the referendum ?
THing is, despite Russia doing some kicking after the foul, it pales in comparison to what happens in the ghaza.
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The EU(wel, the US actually, the EU is a puppet) has zero interest in making life better for Ukraine. They want to get a stragegic advantage. You'd gain nothing if you'd join the EU. On the other hand, Gazprom has significant cheaper oil delivery (wich ukraine rarely pays in full or on time). If Russia would just stop delivering oil, it would be alot worse then any imaginary benefit from joining the EU.
Man I really like your posts on football-related topics. Maybe you are correct about Israeli-Palestinian stuff, I don't know much about that conflict, because it's too much information distortion today, but you really don't know much about Ukraine, I don't blame you, but still. Why do you think we believe that EU would make our life better? Why EU should do it? EU it's no more than idea, direction, civilization choice if you will. I hate EU as bureaucracy organization and think that in current format it would die in the nearest future. Sooner or later there will be united Europe, but as more effective, completely another level kind of system and structure. And what strategic advantage would they get? For what?
Again you are wrong. Ukraine up to recently paid the biggest price for Russian gas in Europe. You might not know, but now we buy Russian gas from Poland and Slovakia, reverse (so we buy Russian gas not on Ukrainian-Russian border, but on Ukrainian-Slovakian border, same gas, different price). Because, it's cheaper.
Again, I'll repeat, so you won't think that I am some kind of naive fairy-tale believer. I don't believe that EU would come here and deal with our problems (why should they, it's our problems), I don't think that EU (UN, NATO, whatever) should sent troops here to help us etc. All the problems we have here are caused mostly because of the corrupted society and especial political elite (if you can use this word for these scumbags), but I suppose every country has the same problem more or less.
But I hate hypocrisy, Ukraine gave up 3rd biggest nuclear potential in exchange of guarantees of integrity. USA, UK and Russia(he-he) were supposed to ensure it. If EU decides to sell us for Russian gas and oil or just because they afraid to mess with Russia, than ok, it's rational, I can take it. World sucks. But just say it, we sell you, we don't give a shit about you, some of us don't keep our promises etc. But please, never ever tell me that it's better for us to stay with Russia. I suppose you don't know what is to bury your friends, one of them was noncombatant, just lived in Donetsk and tried to talk with people, he got shot. My other friend (he now works in my company and lives in Kharkiv) spent two weeks "na podvale" – it means that they keep you in the basement, without food and almost without water, they beat you every day, he lost 8 or 9 tooth and almost got raped (or maybe got raped, but how can you ask your friend about it, it's fucking hard), people who was in the basement whit him got raped, beaten-up and/or raped. And you know why he got there? Because he never supported local Shakhtar team and supported Dynamo Kiev and one of his neighbor told on him.
Don't get me wrong there are a lot of scums on Ukrainian side also, but it's war. You just can't do anything about it, at some point you have two choices: to run away or to fight.
Again you are wrong. Ukraine up to recently paid the biggest price for Russian gas in Europe. You might not know, but now we buy Russian gas from Poland and Slovakia, reverse (so we buy Russian gas not on Ukrainian-Russian border, but on Ukrainian-Slovakian border, same gas, different price). Because, it's cheaper.
Again, I'll repeat, so you won't think that I am some kind of naive fairy-tale believer. I don't believe that EU would come here and deal with our problems (why should they, it's our problems), I don't think that EU (UN, NATO, whatever) should sent troops here to help us etc. All the problems we have here are caused mostly because of the corrupted society and especial political elite (if you can use this word for these scumbags), but I suppose every country has the same problem more or less.
But I hate hypocrisy, Ukraine gave up 3rd biggest nuclear potential in exchange of guarantees of integrity. USA, UK and Russia(he-he) were supposed to ensure it. If EU decides to sell us for Russian gas and oil or just because they afraid to mess with Russia, than ok, it's rational, I can take it. World sucks. But just say it, we sell you, we don't give a shit about you, some of us don't keep our promises etc. But please, never ever tell me that it's better for us to stay with Russia. I suppose you don't know what is to bury your friends, one of them was noncombatant, just lived in Donetsk and tried to talk with people, he got shot. My other friend (he now works in my company and lives in Kharkiv) spent two weeks "na podvale" – it means that they keep you in the basement, without food and almost without water, they beat you every day, he lost 8 or 9 tooth and almost got raped (or maybe got raped, but how can you ask your friend about it, it's fucking hard), people who was in the basement whit him got raped, beaten-up and/or raped. And you know why he got there? Because he never supported local Shakhtar team and supported Dynamo Kiev and one of his neighbor told on him.
Don't get me wrong there are a lot of scums on Ukrainian side also, but it's war. You just can't do anything about it, at some point you have two choices: to run away or to fight.
@Kopanja, good stuff there bud, i went ahead and moved the 2 posts to the ukraine thread, you guys can continue here[/QUOTE]
Ok, got it. This stuff it's really not that great.
It's just fucking broken lives of millions, because one person decided to keep his "naval base" (bullshit excuse, because Black Sea is controlled by that who controls Bosfor/Dardanele).
Funny story: when Russia invaded Georgia in 08 people here in Ukraine mostly were on Russian side, because of the Russian media mostly. I've never believed that, not because I'm so fucking smart, but because I'm half-georgian and I've already heard a story about georgian(moldavian, ukrainian, insert your country) fascists. My father is a refugee from the first georgian-russian war (or War in Abkhazia if you will, my family left Suhumi and still cannot come back) and war rhetoric hasn't change much since then. My friends laughed, when I told them that we or Belarus-Kazakhstan are next. It's like the exact situation when you are not happy when you were wright.
God, I'm drunk, will go to sleep.
Ok, got it. This stuff it's really not that great.
It's just fucking broken lives of millions, because one person decided to keep his "naval base" (bullshit excuse, because Black Sea is controlled by that who controls Bosfor/Dardanele).
Funny story: when Russia invaded Georgia in 08 people here in Ukraine mostly were on Russian side, because of the Russian media mostly. I've never believed that, not because I'm so fucking smart, but because I'm half-georgian and I've already heard a story about georgian(moldavian, ukrainian, insert your country) fascists. My father is a refugee from the first georgian-russian war (or War in Abkhazia if you will, my family left Suhumi and still cannot come back) and war rhetoric hasn't change much since then. My friends laughed, when I told them that we or Belarus-Kazakhstan are next. It's like the exact situation when you are not happy when you were wright.
God, I'm drunk, will go to sleep.
Very informative 
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One of the major things i disliked about the Ukraine situation, is how the EU is putting false hope in people in a bad situation allready.
i'm a bit surprised about the gas delivery. i tought ukraine had some big discount, or thats when i've read a few times, is that a thing from the past, or never actually true at all ?
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One of the major things i disliked about the Ukraine situation, is how the EU is putting false hope in people in a bad situation allready.
i'm a bit surprised about the gas delivery. i tought ukraine had some big discount, or thats when i've read a few times, is that a thing from the past, or never actually true at all ?
Ok, got it. This stuff it's really not that great.
It's just fucking broken lives of millions, because one person decided to keep his "naval base" (bullshit excuse, because Black Sea is controlled by that who controls Bosfor/Dardanele).
Funny story: when Russia invaded Georgia in 08 people here in Ukraine mostly were on Russian side, because of the Russian media mostly. I've never believed that, not because I'm so fucking smart, but because I'm half-georgian and I've already heard a story about georgian(moldavian, ukrainian, insert your country) fascists. My father is a refugee from the first georgian-russian war (or War in Abkhazia if you will, my family left Suhumi and still cannot come back) and war rhetoric hasn't change much since then. My friends laughed, when I told them that we or Belarus-Kazakhstan are next. It's like the exact situation when you are not happy when you were wright.
God, I'm drunk, will go to sleep.[/QUOTE]
Sorry i didn't express myself well, i meant it was and good informative post. It definitely sucks to be the battleground of geopolitical proxy wars.
It's just fucking broken lives of millions, because one person decided to keep his "naval base" (bullshit excuse, because Black Sea is controlled by that who controls Bosfor/Dardanele).
Funny story: when Russia invaded Georgia in 08 people here in Ukraine mostly were on Russian side, because of the Russian media mostly. I've never believed that, not because I'm so fucking smart, but because I'm half-georgian and I've already heard a story about georgian(moldavian, ukrainian, insert your country) fascists. My father is a refugee from the first georgian-russian war (or War in Abkhazia if you will, my family left Suhumi and still cannot come back) and war rhetoric hasn't change much since then. My friends laughed, when I told them that we or Belarus-Kazakhstan are next. It's like the exact situation when you are not happy when you were wright.
God, I'm drunk, will go to sleep.[/QUOTE]
Sorry i didn't express myself well, i meant it was and good informative post. It definitely sucks to be the battleground of geopolitical proxy wars.