Game of Thrones [TV, not the book, no spoilers!] (14 Viewers)

[Trequartista]

Man, the differences between our countries really shows in this thread

I'm just looking at the story from a realpolitik standpoint. Bolton knew that Robb was losing the war and by releasing Jaime and killing Robb, he managed to secure the best deal for himself and his house.

What he did was surely immoral and disgusting but it was the pragmatic thing to do in order to protect his own interests.

 

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[radekas]

moratti did a pragmatic thing by destroying Juventus but it doesn't excuse him

 

[Trequartista]

moratti did a pragmatic thing by destroying Juventus but it doesn't excuse him

Where did I say that what Roose did was good/right? I said that it served his own interests and he did it, which is the harsh reality of the world of Games of Thrones.

 

[V]

These are all people who broke their oath to the Iron Throne to follow Robb in the first place. Frey even mentions his oath to the King in the second season when Catlyn Stark comes to him to work out the details of this marriage with Robb. She says something about the oath Frey took to her father, his liege and lord of Riverrun and Frey reminds her that he also swore an oath to the King.

When it comes to real power, oaths go out the window. Frey has now positioned himself as the Kings man in the Riverlands and Bolton has done the same in the North, it would seem. The Starks and the Tully's are being pushed out and the vacuum is going to be filled by the Boltons and the Freys.

All that stands, I'm just saying Robb wasn't a fool. Sure with hindsight he was, but he couldn't know a betrayal of such magnitude would happen. Frey, if he had an ounce of honor, would declare himself for the Lannisters and wouldn't invite him to his house to workout an alliance.

Robb acted like Robert, he declared a war and fought a war the way it was meant to be fought. No schemes and betrayals.

Robert won the throne fair and square, Robb didn't, but he lost it in an awful way, with no honor for the winning side.

 

[Vinny Del Pogba]

I'm just looking at the story from a realpolitik standpoint. Bolton knew that Robb was losing the war and by releasing Jaime and killing Robb, he managed to secure the best deal for himself and his house.

What he did was surely immoral and disgusting but it was the pragmatic thing to do in order to protect his own interests.

Exactly right.

And you can't look at anyone in this show as a white knight / black knight, (except for Ser Barristan the Bold, of course, lol) Everyone has blood on their hands. Some more than others. Even Arrya murdered a stable boy in season one during her escape from King's Landing.

 

[Hængebøffer]

Danearys isn't without treachery, remember in season one Ser Jorrah plotted to have her killed for King Robert so that he could be pardoned and allowed to return to Westeros. He didn't go through with it, he stopped it at the last moment. But he also has not yet told her of his treachery.

I'm talking about her.

 

[radekas]

All that stands, I'm just saying Robb wasn't a fool. Sure with hindsight he was, but he couldn't know a betrayal of such magnitude would happen. Frey, if he had an ounce of honor, would declare himself for the Lannisters and wouldn't invite him to his house to workout an alliance.

Robb acted like Robert, he declared a war and fought a war the way it was meant to be fought. No schemes and betrayals.

Robert won the throne fair and square, Robb didn't, but he lost it in an awful way, with no honor for the winning side.

The Robert war was ended in a similar way. Remember what Jaime told a few episodes ago? His father came to protect King's Landing. He entered the city and started to slaughter Thangaryan forces. It's what Tywin does. This man is a more intelligent Joffrey. A disgusting shit with no respect to anything but himself.

 

[Vinny Del Pogba]

All that stands, I'm just saying Robb wasn't a fool. Sure with hindsight he was, but he couldn't know a betrayal of such magnitude would happen. Frey, if he had an ounce of honor, would declare himself for the Lannisters and wouldn't invite him to his house to workout an alliance.

Robb acted like Robert, he declared a war and fought a war the way it was meant to be fought. No schemes and betrayals.

Robert won the throne fair and square, Robb didn't, but he lost it in an awful way, with no honor for the winning side.

Even King Robert had the Targaryen children slaughtered after he won the throne. But that's what he had to do to secure his own royal line. This wasn't much different.

And Frey couldn't just declare for the Iron Throne of the Lannisters, he was in open rebellion against the throne the moment he allowed Robb Stark and his troops to cross the river. He had to work out this deal to make up for his treason. Tywin wouldn't let him off so easily, he wanted something in return. And Frey could give him The King in the North.

- - - Updated - - -

I'm talking about her.

Yea, I know. I just don't think she will be able to win the throne and rule the realm without getting some blood on her hands as well.

 

[Hængebøffer]

I'm just looking at the story from a realpolitik standpoint. Bolton knew that Robb was losing the war and by releasing Jaime and killing Robb, he managed to secure the best deal for himself and his house.

What he did was surely immoral and disgusting but it was the pragmatic thing to do in order to protect his own interests.

I'm not challenging the pragmatic way here. I'm against how it's done. In this case it's all muhahahahaha
On the other hand, Jamie - a person who tried to kill an innocent child because he fucked his sister, but now he's telling how he saved a lot of people and suddenly has empathy... Come on.

I think I know your reply and it will only confirm the differences

 

[Trequartista]

I'm not challenging the pragmatic way here. I'm against how it's done. In this case it's all muhahahahaha
On the other hand, Jamie - a person who tried to kill an innocent child because he fucked his sister, but now he's telling how he saved a lot of people and suddenly has empathy... Come on.

I think I know your reply and it will only confirm the differences

Well, Jaime seems a bit more human than Roose Bolton who flays anyone he doesn't like

 

[Hængebøffer]

- - - Updated - - -
Yea, I know. I just don't think she will be able to win the throne and rule the realm without getting some blood on her hands as well.

Which I'm fine with, I just find it stupid how cynical everyone seems to get, when they have to take these decisions.

 

[Hængebøffer]

Well, Jaime seems a bit more human than Roose Bolton who flays anyone he doesn't like

I'm pretty sure Frey jizzed his pants during the killings.

 

[Vinny Del Pogba]

I'm not challenging the pragmatic way here. I'm against how it's done. In this case it's all muhahahahaha
On the other hand, Jamie - a person who tried to kill an innocent child because he fucked his sister, but now he's telling how he saved a lot of people and suddenly has empathy... Come on.

I think I know your reply and it will only confirm the differences

If Jamie doesn't kill Bran then it's very likely both him and his sister might have been executed for what they did. And possibly Joffrey, Tommin and the little girl they had.

Even little Bran was partly at fault. He promised his mother he wouldn't do any mroe climbing. lol

 

[Klin]

Next episode needs some Stannis.

 

[Hængebøffer]

If Jamie doesn't kill Bran then it's very likely both him and his sister might have been executed for what they did. And possibly Joffrey, Tommin and the little girl they had.

After what I read the article - Tywin's gonna kill them all.

 

[Klin]

"Usurper Robb Stark" - check.

"Usurper Joffrey Baratheon" - _____

"Usurper Balon Greyjoy" - _____

 

[radekas]

If Jamie doesn't kill Bran then it's very likely both him and his sister might have been executed for what they did. And possibly Joffrey, Tommin and the little girl they had.

Even little Bran was partly at fault. He promised his mother he wouldn't do any mroe climbing. lol

That would be fine reasoning to excuse Jaime IF he had shown any kind of remorse or guild. However he pushed Bran without a single second of hesitation and never cared about the kid or what he did. That makes him an evil scum like most of the Lannisters.

 

[Trequartista]

I think I know your reply and it will only confirm the differences

So, what are the difference between our countries?

 

[radekas]

one is in Europe the other isn't

 

[Hængebøffer]

So, what are the difference between our countries?

How you seem to accept the way people get to the top and how I don't.