Gaetano D'Agostino (12 Viewers)
- Thread starter Fellas
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I agree that the team defends as o unit and thats why i am worried about Dago, being the our first line of defense.
I dont underrate Marchisio, on the contrary i believe that he can perform that role even better, as he is more competent defensively.
But he is not as dynamic as Sissoko, at least not yet.
And as we have seen this year, no one can replace his physicality.
Playing with one midfielder less then the rest of the teams, our flanks and center of the midfield not to be stronger than the average, otherwise it will be easily bullied around.
Camo - Diego - Dago/Marchisio can be a first line of defense, but its not that hard to go past them, esp past Diego, they need a
Strong dynamic and physical DM like - Sissoko To play behind them and close all the gaps. CZ doesnt have the stamina, Marchisio is not fierce enough and Camo def not made for that job. Neither is Dago. If we move Sissoko to a side, our team will be unbalanced, his side will be a solid side, but not as creative (as he cant pass like our CMs) And other side will be vulnerable.
I believe that Canna and Chiellini are capable enough of passing the ball, 3-9 feet in front of them to Camo or Marchisio.
And they can advance a few meters by the own and pass the ball to Diego.
He can create from there, from the middle of the field to their box.
Where he can find our capable forwards, who can easily find their way from there.
IMO this is how the 4-3-1-2 works. IF the holding DM can distribute the ball thats even better.
Esp if we play defensively and we want to keep possession, closer to our field.
But what happens if the one who is holding the ball, right in front of our CBs loses the ball? Who is going to catch him?? Canna ? LOL
Thats why i prefer Diego to do the distribution role and even if he is dispossessed, Sissoko will be behind him to recover that ball!
In previous 4-4-2 Dago or Alonso would be really valuable, as they would complement Sissoko's passing lapses. And Sissoko would offer the needed coverage.
However, as we have seen time and time again. If we dont defend as a team and let alone our defense to do their work. They simply cant cope...
Sad bad true... I will be very pleased if we can afford to have a dedicated creative midfielder (Diego), without losing much from our defensive coverage, which will be practically with one man lesser than it was now.
I dont think that we can afford two less and put one behind the other!
(welcomed, but too much to ask with that defense, IMO)
If Dago was more capable defensively, or if our back four were more competent, we could.
As to what i want, i think that our priority is to find a permanent replacement to Zebi. We should sell him or Grygera to an EPL team. And make an investment that will last at least 5-6 years. A player near 26 year old or less, at 8-10mil.
It doesnt necessarily have to buy Italian. I would follow Arsenal's example.
I have a few players in mind from the French and German league. Fast, young, able to perform a sliding tackle, a decent cross and Grygera's stamina!
Secco may not be able to pull that off and our board wouldnt afford/justify that.
My taste is irrelevant, so i will keep it real if you insist for a an example:
For our left flank, i believe that we should sell Moli asap or give/co own him to Genoa and use the money we got for their half, to bring Criscito back.
(their money back, the loan of Molinaro and 50% of his contract would be suffice to buy his half back)
And keep DC as the offensive option. IF he fails for any reason, sell him by x-mas and bring a Grosso. No problem, if Criscito is already here...
Therefore we would have a "young and Italian" defense
. 2 Italian CBs, one Italian keeper and LB should be Italian enough to afford/tolerate a straniero RB but with serie A exp. I dont dare to ask for Roma's, Fiorentina's or Inter's RB's
But we can go for Lazio's for ex. Or trying a la Mellberg and get Napoli's or Udinese's CB/RB. That would be double effective, we either earn one more solution in the RB, or the assurance of our future CB twin. Its a win win situation there and with Canna, Legro around, we can afford to risk that, or keep him as RB!
We offered 11mil pounds to Udine for Dago, with that money we can buy Santacroce, a fullback like A.Santos and bring back Criscito too.
The sales and salaries of Mellberg, Zebi/Grygera and Molinaro can pay for their salaries and any difference.
And we can still buy Dago if we sell Treze and or Almiron/Tiago/Poulsen.
And udine accept realistic conditions...
Usually i de prefer defenders able to defend first. But it is imperative for the 4-3-1-2 to become multi-dimensional, that the full-backs can be potential threats and force the opposition to keep their lines widened!
A front attack only, no matter how skilled Diego is and how resourceful Dago can be, cannot penetrate an over-crowed midfield.
If Zebi stays healthy and plays like he did in the last game and DC is given a chance, then we would be ok. But the chances of this to happen, are far less than Marchisio or even CZ, Tiago and Poulsen, all fail to play that deep play-maker role. IMO Marchisio is good enough for the job, he has good stamina, great tactical awareness and better defensive skills to stop the man who goes past Diego, than Dago. Tiago can also do that in theory, but he cant on the field!
CZ might not be fit enough to close the gaps fast. But Poulsen!! Poulsen is a good passer and he also knows how to defend! I believe we can try him there.
But then we have to chose which flank Sissoko should waste offensively.
That would probably be the left flank, as Camo will cover the right one. That would also need no need for Molinaro or Criscito there. As defensive coverage will be present. But we will have an urgent need of an offensive fullback there! Not Molinaro...
Our left would be completely dead...
Do you understand, now, why i insist that we need an upgrade there??
We just cant afford this, with these defenders.
And What happens if Camo gets injured and we have to move Sissoko to other side? We also have to keep an option there too.
80% chances are that Zebi will be injured again, as he always is when we need him. And what are we expecting from Grygera to do, in order to become a threat?
And if the fullback goes wide, how can we expect from Canna to run and track the open spaces at his age??
Our defense cant support such an option, either Ferrara will anticipate it, as i believe he already did.
Or we will learn with the hard way, conceding stupid goals, just like this year...
Selling Poulsen, putting Dago there and betting that this defense will hold by their own is a wild risk! Also betting that they can do the offensive part too, is just insane...
Not really, you are bold enough to hold your ground!
I dont underrate Marchisio, on the contrary i believe that he can perform that role even better, as he is more competent defensively.
But he is not as dynamic as Sissoko, at least not yet.
And as we have seen this year, no one can replace his physicality.
Playing with one midfielder less then the rest of the teams, our flanks and center of the midfield not to be stronger than the average, otherwise it will be easily bullied around.
Camo - Diego - Dago/Marchisio can be a first line of defense, but its not that hard to go past them, esp past Diego, they need a
Strong dynamic and physical DM like - Sissoko To play behind them and close all the gaps. CZ doesnt have the stamina, Marchisio is not fierce enough and Camo def not made for that job. Neither is Dago. If we move Sissoko to a side, our team will be unbalanced, his side will be a solid side, but not as creative (as he cant pass like our CMs) And other side will be vulnerable.
I believe that Canna and Chiellini are capable enough of passing the ball, 3-9 feet in front of them to Camo or Marchisio.
And they can advance a few meters by the own and pass the ball to Diego.
He can create from there, from the middle of the field to their box.
Where he can find our capable forwards, who can easily find their way from there.
IMO this is how the 4-3-1-2 works. IF the holding DM can distribute the ball thats even better.
Esp if we play defensively and we want to keep possession, closer to our field.
But what happens if the one who is holding the ball, right in front of our CBs loses the ball? Who is going to catch him?? Canna ? LOL
Thats why i prefer Diego to do the distribution role and even if he is dispossessed, Sissoko will be behind him to recover that ball!
In previous 4-4-2 Dago or Alonso would be really valuable, as they would complement Sissoko's passing lapses. And Sissoko would offer the needed coverage.
However, as we have seen time and time again. If we dont defend as a team and let alone our defense to do their work. They simply cant cope...
Sad bad true... I will be very pleased if we can afford to have a dedicated creative midfielder (Diego), without losing much from our defensive coverage, which will be practically with one man lesser than it was now.
I dont think that we can afford two less and put one behind the other!
(welcomed, but too much to ask with that defense, IMO)
If Dago was more capable defensively, or if our back four were more competent, we could.
As to what i want, i think that our priority is to find a permanent replacement to Zebi. We should sell him or Grygera to an EPL team. And make an investment that will last at least 5-6 years. A player near 26 year old or less, at 8-10mil.
It doesnt necessarily have to buy Italian. I would follow Arsenal's example.
I have a few players in mind from the French and German league. Fast, young, able to perform a sliding tackle, a decent cross and Grygera's stamina!
Secco may not be able to pull that off and our board wouldnt afford/justify that.
My taste is irrelevant, so i will keep it real if you insist for a an example:
For our left flank, i believe that we should sell Moli asap or give/co own him to Genoa and use the money we got for their half, to bring Criscito back.
(their money back, the loan of Molinaro and 50% of his contract would be suffice to buy his half back)
And keep DC as the offensive option. IF he fails for any reason, sell him by x-mas and bring a Grosso. No problem, if Criscito is already here...
Therefore we would have a "young and Italian" defense
. 2 Italian CBs, one Italian keeper and LB should be Italian enough to afford/tolerate a straniero RB but with serie A exp. I dont dare to ask for Roma's, Fiorentina's or Inter's RB'sBut we can go for Lazio's for ex. Or trying a la Mellberg and get Napoli's or Udinese's CB/RB. That would be double effective, we either earn one more solution in the RB, or the assurance of our future CB twin. Its a win win situation there and with Canna, Legro around, we can afford to risk that, or keep him as RB!
We offered 11mil pounds to Udine for Dago, with that money we can buy Santacroce, a fullback like A.Santos and bring back Criscito too.
The sales and salaries of Mellberg, Zebi/Grygera and Molinaro can pay for their salaries and any difference.
And we can still buy Dago if we sell Treze and or Almiron/Tiago/Poulsen.
And udine accept realistic conditions...
Usually i de prefer defenders able to defend first. But it is imperative for the 4-3-1-2 to become multi-dimensional, that the full-backs can be potential threats and force the opposition to keep their lines widened!
A front attack only, no matter how skilled Diego is and how resourceful Dago can be, cannot penetrate an over-crowed midfield.
If Zebi stays healthy and plays like he did in the last game and DC is given a chance, then we would be ok. But the chances of this to happen, are far less than Marchisio or even CZ, Tiago and Poulsen, all fail to play that deep play-maker role. IMO Marchisio is good enough for the job, he has good stamina, great tactical awareness and better defensive skills to stop the man who goes past Diego, than Dago. Tiago can also do that in theory, but he cant on the field!
CZ might not be fit enough to close the gaps fast. But Poulsen!! Poulsen is a good passer and he also knows how to defend! I believe we can try him there.
But then we have to chose which flank Sissoko should waste offensively.
That would probably be the left flank, as Camo will cover the right one. That would also need no need for Molinaro or Criscito there. As defensive coverage will be present. But we will have an urgent need of an offensive fullback there! Not Molinaro...
Our left would be completely dead...
Do you understand, now, why i insist that we need an upgrade there??
We just cant afford this, with these defenders.
And What happens if Camo gets injured and we have to move Sissoko to other side? We also have to keep an option there too.
80% chances are that Zebi will be injured again, as he always is when we need him. And what are we expecting from Grygera to do, in order to become a threat?
And if the fullback goes wide, how can we expect from Canna to run and track the open spaces at his age??
Our defense cant support such an option, either Ferrara will anticipate it, as i believe he already did.Or we will learn with the hard way, conceding stupid goals, just like this year...
Selling Poulsen, putting Dago there and betting that this defense will hold by their own is a wild risk! Also betting that they can do the offensive part too, is just insane...
Not really, you are bold enough to hold your ground!
I understand and respect the technical need for a deep play-maker.
But i dont agree with your priorities. I believe as long as the quality of the starters are there the roles and tactics cant be tweaked.
Dago's role in the particular formation we have chosen is in IMO irreplaceable!
But the need for a full squad of competent players, IMO, isnt!
Sorry, i thought that would help some, too lazy to read everything else.
Not just one, i also expect Diego to be there when you want him too.
But i also trust that Camo and Marchisio are good enough to carry the ball to him, esp if they are coupled with decent fullbacks and not the completely useless wing-backs, we currently have!!
I dont believe that Marchisio is too inconsistent i believe in his skills, potential and tactical awareness. Actually i believe one day he will become a better player than Dago and considering his defensive capabilities, a more complete one too!!
I agree about Sissoko but dont forget Camo too!! Or Tiago/Poulsen/CZ in his place. we wont have a crippled player like Marchionni there and we wont face the problems we did this year. With a competent RB, able to pass, support and cross. The nee for Dago is completely diminished!
I repeat here again, what happens when the opposition presses the center, man marks Diego and suffocates the center line with 2-3 DM/CMs and 2 wingers??
What are we going to do without the option to get some support from those wings (our fullbacks) ??
And above all, who is going to stop the AMF, who will steal the ball from Dago??
If Dago is the main man keeping the ball, the chances for this to happen are rather increased! What happens next??
There is always next year for our defense. But next year we will discover other needs and priorities. Replacing Treze with a super expensive forward for one...
Maybe a successor to DP too. (Rossi/Cassano) This year every line is complete and competitive, but the defense!! We cant have the same fullbacks for a 3rd consecutive year!!
Our defense collapsed far too many times to ignore. Cant you see why??
Because its far too easy to collapse, without the ultimate sacrifices from our midfield. With this new system, the midfielders will have other roles and they wont be able to support our defense like they did so far.
Our defense will be far more exposed!
I also played as defender (LB) and i felt the responsibility, i never saw in Moli.
I believe that if the defense isnt competent it shows!
And ours did, even the smaller teams smelled and realized how it easy it is to brake us. The better teams understand that and exploit our weakness.
If a line is not competitive at the highest levels, the team is not competitive either!!
Well, we cant really get to agree here about our priorities.
I m certain that if we are not competitive at every line and dont increase the quality of our starters. We wont be competitive enough to win a any serious title.
Upgrading from Marchisio/CZ to Dago is not that important to me.
Its not like he is world class and they are not!
But we can easily find decent fullbacks then the ones we have now!
And probably two for Dagos/ price. Upgrading from Moli to a Dago class LB, or from Grygera to a Dago class RB, is a far greater upgrade for the team, from upgrading from Camo/Marchisio to Dago...
And i also beleive that,
Marchisio can turn into a Dago with more realistic chances than the youngsters you mentioned...
DC has the potential to be very very useful instead, but in our RBs we dont have, neither quality or potential!
I dont believe that we cant compete with Inter with the acquisition of just one or even just a couple of players.
Their subs are better than our starters in many places. (esp fullbacks)
What i expect us to do, is build the core that might be able to compete with them in the future. Unfortunately, our five year plan was compromised, the bulk of our transfer budget wasted by Secco. And we are stack with some players we cant get rid of... We have sacrificed far to much from our future, for momentary gains.
But we never really had a chance to win a title and never really threatened to lose our minimal goals.
Dago would be just one more transfer in the same direction.
He will halt Marchisio's carrier, he will force him to be converted into a sub and we will be forced to use the same amount of incompetent fullbacks/players in our team.
Because we will have to sacrifice all our funds to get him.
Thus keeping the same quality percentage of starters in our team.
But with added depth in the midfield (same old story)
Dago wont able to win us the champion by himself, as neither Amauri couldnt too Marchisio cant either.
We need a TEAM to do that and a TEAM includes the defense too.
I am surprised how can a defender can underestimate the defender's role so much!
I would prefer Santacroce and Andre instead of Dago. Because we will at least ensure that in the future, two more positions are greatly enhanced/covered and our team as a whole becomes more competitive and has two weakness less.
A couple of similar additions every year and in a few year we will be able to field a full squad with competitive players in every line!
With practically minimal losses.
Santacroce+Andre+Marchisio can get us the 2# (and so will Dago, nothing more).
But in the future, the strategical advantages are significant!
This is what i always wanted from our five year plan.
Not titles, but a competitive team.
If we keep going like that, we will end up with none of those two...
Overpaying for a 28year old one season wonder, who is in my opinion is not a significant upgrade to Marchisio, esp for the future!
Is just a waste of the limited resources we could use to upgrade the mediocre starters, who are orphan of potential.
We have tried Dagos far too many times, in the cost of upgrading the rest of our starters! Too bad we learned nothing from this...
But i dont agree with your priorities. I believe as long as the quality of the starters are there the roles and tactics cant be tweaked.
Dago's role in the particular formation we have chosen is in IMO irreplaceable!
But the need for a full squad of competent players, IMO, isnt!
Sorry, i thought that would help some, too lazy to read everything else.
Not just one, i also expect Diego to be there when you want him too.
But i also trust that Camo and Marchisio are good enough to carry the ball to him, esp if they are coupled with decent fullbacks and not the completely useless wing-backs, we currently have!!
I dont believe that Marchisio is too inconsistent i believe in his skills, potential and tactical awareness. Actually i believe one day he will become a better player than Dago and considering his defensive capabilities, a more complete one too!!
I agree about Sissoko but dont forget Camo too!! Or Tiago/Poulsen/CZ in his place. we wont have a crippled player like Marchionni there and we wont face the problems we did this year. With a competent RB, able to pass, support and cross. The nee for Dago is completely diminished!
I repeat here again, what happens when the opposition presses the center, man marks Diego and suffocates the center line with 2-3 DM/CMs and 2 wingers??
What are we going to do without the option to get some support from those wings (our fullbacks) ??
And above all, who is going to stop the AMF, who will steal the ball from Dago??
If Dago is the main man keeping the ball, the chances for this to happen are rather increased! What happens next??
There is always next year for our defense. But next year we will discover other needs and priorities. Replacing Treze with a super expensive forward for one...
Maybe a successor to DP too. (Rossi/Cassano) This year every line is complete and competitive, but the defense!! We cant have the same fullbacks for a 3rd consecutive year!!
Our defense collapsed far too many times to ignore. Cant you see why??
Because its far too easy to collapse, without the ultimate sacrifices from our midfield. With this new system, the midfielders will have other roles and they wont be able to support our defense like they did so far.
Our defense will be far more exposed!
I also played as defender (LB) and i felt the responsibility, i never saw in Moli.
I believe that if the defense isnt competent it shows!
And ours did, even the smaller teams smelled and realized how it easy it is to brake us. The better teams understand that and exploit our weakness.
If a line is not competitive at the highest levels, the team is not competitive either!!
Well, we cant really get to agree here about our priorities.
I m certain that if we are not competitive at every line and dont increase the quality of our starters. We wont be competitive enough to win a any serious title.
Upgrading from Marchisio/CZ to Dago is not that important to me.
Its not like he is world class and they are not!
But we can easily find decent fullbacks then the ones we have now!
And probably two for Dagos/ price. Upgrading from Moli to a Dago class LB, or from Grygera to a Dago class RB, is a far greater upgrade for the team, from upgrading from Camo/Marchisio to Dago...
And i also beleive that,
Marchisio can turn into a Dago with more realistic chances than the youngsters you mentioned...
DC has the potential to be very very useful instead, but in our RBs we dont have, neither quality or potential!
I dont believe that we cant compete with Inter with the acquisition of just one or even just a couple of players.
Their subs are better than our starters in many places. (esp fullbacks)
What i expect us to do, is build the core that might be able to compete with them in the future. Unfortunately, our five year plan was compromised, the bulk of our transfer budget wasted by Secco. And we are stack with some players we cant get rid of... We have sacrificed far to much from our future, for momentary gains.
But we never really had a chance to win a title and never really threatened to lose our minimal goals.
Dago would be just one more transfer in the same direction.
He will halt Marchisio's carrier, he will force him to be converted into a sub and we will be forced to use the same amount of incompetent fullbacks/players in our team.
Because we will have to sacrifice all our funds to get him.
Thus keeping the same quality percentage of starters in our team.
But with added depth in the midfield (same old story)
Dago wont able to win us the champion by himself, as neither Amauri couldnt too Marchisio cant either.
We need a TEAM to do that and a TEAM includes the defense too.
I am surprised how can a defender can underestimate the defender's role so much!
I would prefer Santacroce and Andre instead of Dago. Because we will at least ensure that in the future, two more positions are greatly enhanced/covered and our team as a whole becomes more competitive and has two weakness less.
A couple of similar additions every year and in a few year we will be able to field a full squad with competitive players in every line!
With practically minimal losses.
Santacroce+Andre+Marchisio can get us the 2# (and so will Dago, nothing more).
But in the future, the strategical advantages are significant!
This is what i always wanted from our five year plan.
Not titles, but a competitive team.
If we keep going like that, we will end up with none of those two...
Overpaying for a 28year old one season wonder, who is in my opinion is not a significant upgrade to Marchisio, esp for the future!
Is just a waste of the limited resources we could use to upgrade the mediocre starters, who are orphan of potential.
We have tried Dagos far too many times, in the cost of upgrading the rest of our starters! Too bad we learned nothing from this...
![Juventino[RUS]](https://www.juventuz.com/data/avatars/m/5/5409.jpg?1650619365){kind=avatar}
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Well Corriere dello Sport (are they no more reliable than Gazzetta and Tuttosport?) has this as todays headline:-
Juve-D’Agostino: The Deal
Club and player ready to sign a five-year contract
The article refers tp the possibility of Pasquato being involved with cash and player exchange.
Time now for Secco to stop buggering about and conclude this deal so that Grosso arrives and a new RB is sought.
Juve-D’Agostino: The Deal
Club and player ready to sign a five-year contract
The article refers tp the possibility of Pasquato being involved with cash and player exchange.
Time now for Secco to stop buggering about and conclude this deal so that Grosso arrives and a new RB is sought.
Has anyone any more news about this i read something similar on tuttojuve.com but i dont know if they or corriere dello sport are reliable or not.
http://www.tuttojuve.com/?action=read&idnotizia=6484
http://www.tuttojuve.com/?action=read&idnotizia=6484
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