[Europa League] JUVENTUS vs Lech Poznan (Sept. 16th 2010)) (1 Viewer)

[Zidaninho]

I still don't understand. Juve couldn't comprehensively demolish a side that has a team wage total of Buffon...

 

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[Red]

If that is the case, Red, why the hell if we grab Aquilani with an option to buy for 16m???? Just to add another body to the midfield options???

No idea.

Anyway, Delneri may prove me wrong, but my gut feeling is that he will always choose to play at least one of Melo and Sissoko.

 

[Adluc1]

...There isn't a point in playing an aggressive attacking game with central midfielders like Sissoko and Melo. It would probably be more prudent, as ridiculous as it sounds, for this club to just sit back against Lech and hope they do some foolish things while attacking us. Since it's apparent we cannot create anything unless Del Piero has a free kick or he's running at the defense, all the energy lost in trying to complete simple passes is not worth it...

This touches on a point I've been wanting to bring up. I don't think Del Neri's 4-4-2 is going to work with this team given the players available. The central midfielders require different attributes, mainly consistency and tactical solidity (Sissoko?!), and the back line requires compactness and teamwork. Given our fullbacks, this is never going to happen.

It's widely regarded that the days of 4-4-2 are over given the dynamism of more complicated modern formations. A good coach can play a variety of formations depending on which one highlights the strengths and masks the weaknesses of the team at his disposal. Del Neri seems to want to shovel the team into his one and only system regardless of whether the player's attributes fit it or not. Worrying days ahead.

 

[Bjerknes]

This touches on a point I've been wanting to bring up. I don't think Del Neri's 4-4-2 is going to work with this team given the players available. The central midfielders require different attributes, mainly consistency and tactical solidity (Sissoko?!), and the back line requires compactness and teamwork. Given our fullbacks, this is never going to happen.

It's widely regarded that the days of 4-4-2 are over given the dynamism of more complicated modern formations. A good coach can play a variety of formations depending on which one highlights the strengths and masks the weaknesses of the team at his disposal. Del Neri seems to want to shovel the team into his one and only system regardless of whether the player's attributes fit it or not. Worrying days ahead.

Agreed completely. And with the straight 4-4-2, you need BOTH CM's to be able to move the ball to some degree for the system to be truly effective. They become too isolated naturally because of the width the wingers provide. So indeed, it's not going to work with Melo and Sissoko out there. Not a chance.

 

[Adluc1]

Agreed completely. And with the straight 4-4-2, you need BOTH CM's to be able to move the ball to some degree for the system to be truly effective. They become too isolated naturally because of the width the wingers provide. So indeed, it's not going to work with Melo and Sissoko out there. Not a chance.

Exactly. The biggest weakness of the 4-4-2 (which is why it's outdated) is the counter attack. When the team presses up using the wingers and CMs as support, a quick break will catch the team with its pants down each and every time, ESPECIALLY when you have a defence like Juve's. Del Neri has to figure out this defence needs protection that a 4-4-2 with these players cannot provide.

 

[Zidaninho]

Chelsea does quite well with a 4-4-2...

Oh but wait, they have a world class lineup...

 

[Adluc1]

Chelsea does quite well with a 4-4-2...

Oh but wait, they have a world class lineup...

Lol!

It can be effective, but you really need the right players to pull it off. Possibly more so than a number of other formations.

 

[Zidaninho]

Lol!

It can be effective, but you really need the right players to pull it off. Possibly more so than a number of other formations.

to the contrary - 4-4-2 is the easiest formation, which is why most teams in the world use it

 

[Adluc1]

to the contrary - 4-4-2 is the easiest formation, which is why most teams in the world use it

Hmmm, I'm not so sure about that. It's definitely the most tried and tested historically, but with the development of more fluid formations in the modern game, such as the 5-3-2 and its various incarnations, the 4-4-2s weaknesses are constantly exposed.

There is a reason why you rarely see the 4-4-2 anymore in elite international competitions, such as the recent World Cup.

 

[Bjerknes]

to the contrary - 4-4-2 is the easiest formation, which is why most teams in the world use it

It is the most simplistic formation, you're right about that. But that doesn't mean you should use it no matter what. And to the contrary again, the simplistic nature of it could mean it is predictable, which most of the time it is. The most successful teams that run with it are those that have pace, quality wingers and overall good ball distribution. If you don't have one of those facets, you really knock its effectiveness down a few notches, IMO.

Hmmm, I'm not so sure about that. It's definitely the most tried and tested historically, but with the development of more fluid formations in the modern game, such as the 5-3-2 and its various incarnations, the 4-4-2s weaknesses are constantly exposed.

There is a reason why you rarely see the 4-4-2 anymore in elite international competitions, such as the recent World Cup.

Bayern and Manure use the straight 4-4-2, but they have quality wingers and decent passers in midfield, so it works well for them. Others clubs, not so much.

 

[Salvo]

We just need to move on and get a good result against Udinese, our defense is really hampering us. It was criminal to watch Chiellini try and stop 3 players while just standing there.

 

[Zidaninho]

All Juve needs is one good result to hold onto and move forward - this will be their catalyst.

The last two games could have been this catalyst but they failed twice at the final hurdle.

 

[tpain]

Exactly. The biggest weakness of the 4-4-2 (which is why it's outdated) is the counter attack. When the team presses up using the wingers and CMs as support, a quick break will catch the team with its pants down each and every time, ESPECIALLY when you have a defence like Juve's. Del Neri has to figure out this defence needs protection that a 4-4-2 with these players cannot provide.

yes u r right my friend. We shouldnt have sold tiago. He is the onli midfielder that can pass well.

 

[tpain]

o and people. please stop dreaming about de ceglie being good one day. He has a total looser mentality....everytime we concede a goal....it is always part of his error and he doesnt bounce back or reply with a good performance at all.

We should stop buying italian fullbacks because they are shit.....ever since zambrotta's time.

 

[Adluc1]

We certainly do need a good result. Despite propping up the table, Udinese haven't looked bad, particularly the speed at which they break. I'll save it for the Udinese vs Juve thread!

 

[Adluc1]

o and people. please stop dreaming about de ceglie being good one day. He has a total looser mentality....everytime we concede a goal....it is always part of his error and he doesnt bounce back or reply with a good performance at all.

We should stop buying italian fullbacks because they are shit.....ever since zambrotta's time.

I had hope for DC at one point. I was clearly deluded.

 

[tpain]

We certainly do need a good result. Despite propping up the table, Udinese haven't looked bad, particularly the speed at which they break. I'll save it for the Udinese vs Juve thread!

i dont see us winning this one......we will probably concede. and despite the fact that we had scored 6 goals in last 3 games, scoring goals is still a problem.

the last 6 goals were mostly based on lucky or individual brilliance. I have yet to see a goal that was created and finished by our strikers. Crosses are not connecting well and Iaquinta is a total joke despite his height and jumping ability. We should have just sold him and get adebayor.

I really hate to say this, but Juventus need to stop being so italian-affliated because currently, italian new-age players are one of the worst crap players italy has ever produced. the only few good ones are Chiellini (hope it stays that way), Cassano (who didnt even feature in the world cup) and Balotelli (who isnt a real italian).

 

[Zidaninho]

I had hope for DC at one point. I was clearly deluded.

I did too. I think it might have been when he put in a cross one game. Now it's obvious that even Molinaro is an upgrade on him.

 

[tpain]

I did too. I think it might have been when he put in a cross one game. Now it's obvious that even Molinaro is an upgrade on him.

yea man.....i think the reason why anyone was thinking de ceglie gon b good is because molinaro was so bad that we believe no players can be any worst than him.

But De Ceglie proved us wrong. what a joke.....Juventus Italian youngsters ftw rofl......

Look at the usual culprits in our recent games, DC, Marchisio, Del Piero(invisible usually), Iaq(useless running), Quag(trying to score youube goals), what do they have in common? O! they are all italians.

 

[cimenk]

A really disappointing result but rather than being so negative, i try to keep get the positive from this result.. Our players attitude that can come from behind in the last 2 matches is better than last season, we can score lot of goals, DC is injured so he won't played in Sunday against Udinese that have Sanchez as RW, The problem in defense exist and appear since season start so Marotta better realize this thing and start scouting on defender especially fullbacks then try to sign the players in January, Also i hope this game make DN realize he can't play Melo alongside Momo, it must either one of them..