Does God exist? (William Lane Craig vs Peter Atkins debate) (38 Viewers)

[GordoDeCentral]

My words aren't worth much I realize

exactly, it's logic within his 'context', in other words plain old belief

 

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[Zé Tahir]

that means every event is a miracle, i think you mean NOT in accordance with the laws of physics. In which case how do you explain the birth of Jesus, unless of course that too you think is hocus pocus.

Did you open the link? The section right talks about this.

I'll paste the brief version:

Mary — A Righteous Servant of God
The Holy Quran affirms the virgin birth of Jesus, and repudiates the notion that Mary was not pious and that her birth was illegitimate. The Quran narrates Mary's statement to an angel: "How can I have a child when no man has touched me and neither have I been unchaste?" (19:21)

Moreover, it is on account of her piety that Chapter 19 in the Quran is named after her, and all pious Muslims are likened to her.

A Very Rare Phenomenon
The virgin birth of Jesus was a miracle, no doubt. But according to the Ahmadiyya Muslim view, miracles always work in accordance with God's laws, no matter how limited our understanding of those laws are. Modern science has only just begun to study this rare phenomenon.

For example, In lower animals rare instances of virgin births have been well documented, representing a complete surprise to zoologists. There are even reports — albeit scattered — of fatherless human conceptions.

Of course, research continues and the mention of these phenomena is only given here to demonstrate that what was once considered impossible can indeed be plausible.

 

[Martin]

exactly, it's logic within his 'context', in other words plain old belief

good thing you're here to take some of the pressure off

 

[GordoDeCentral]

Did you open the link? The section right talks about this.

I'll paste the brief version:

that doesnt make any sense i dont care for lower animals as there are animals that can fly without the aide of any outisde means does it mean man do the same? it is scientifically IMPOSSIBLE for a woman to conceive on her own, ergo miracle is any events which occurs outside the set rules of nature/God/physics. You cant pick and choose anyhoos all i am trying to say is that this is nothing to do with the realm of tradictional science so you cant point finger and claim to be the one who's being logical and the other isnt. Everyone here, in matters of belief, can and will be logical whithin his own context.

 

[Zé Tahir]

that doesnt make any sense i dont care for lower animals as there are animals that can fly without the aide of any outisde means does it mean man do the same? it is scientifically IMPOSSIBLE for a woman to conceive on her own, ergo miracle is any events which occurs outside the set rules of nature/God/physics. You cant pick and choose anyhoos all i am trying to say is that this is nothing to do with the realm of tradictional science so you cant point finger and claim to be the one who's being logical and the other isnt. Everyone here, in matters of belief, can and will be logical whithin his own context.

Call it what you want but we're banking on the virgin birth being scientifically explained one day. We don't believe it's scientifically impossible as you say but since we're banking on it then call us liars when it's proven otherwise. There was a time not long ago that the speed of light was the universal speed limit and even though there is a ton of doubt surrounding the recent findings I don't think anyone ever expected this universal speed limit to ever come into doubt even in the slightest.

 

[swag]

Mary had a little lamb

 

[ALC]

Call it what you want but we're banking on the virgin birth being scientifically explained one day. We don't believe it's scientifically impossible as you say but since we're banking on it then call us liars when it's proven otherwise. There was a time not long ago that the speed of light was the universal speed limit and even though there is a ton of doubt surrounding the recent findings I don't think anyone ever expected this universal speed limit to ever come into doubt even in the slightest.

Not to be a dick or anything, but they found that to be an error.

http://www.csmonitor.com/Science/20...d-suggests-Einstein-was-right-after-all-video

 

[GordoDeCentral]

Call it what you want but we're banking on the virgin birth being scientifically explained one day. We don't believe it's scientifically impossible as you say but since we're banking on it then call us liars when it's proven otherwise. There was a time not long ago that the speed of light was the universal speed limit and even though there is a ton of doubt surrounding the recent findings I don't think anyone ever expected this universal speed limit to ever come into doubt even in the slightest.

not calling anyone a liar, you;re free to believe what you want. What i have a problem with is you saying your belief is rigidly supported by scientific evidence and the rest are "illogical"- that clearly and simply is not the case.

 

[Zé Tahir]

@ALC: I know, I was taking about the doubt.

not calling anyone a liar, you;re free to believe what you want. What i have a problem with is you saying your belief is rigidly supported by scientific evidence and the rest are "illogical"- that clearly and simply is not the case.

I'm trying to argue Islamictheology not logic itself but logic in relation to the verses of the Quran and the Hadith.

Mind you, I don't take anything orthodox beleive in and consider them non Muslim but this accusation is thrown at us, not anyone here, but woody asked how someone like me could believe in something "that".

 

[Fred]

I'm sorry Fred, but judging by your language and your hate for him, YOU are the shit stain. You disgust me.



Why not? How is he different from the founder of Ahmaddiya movement? They both proclaimed to be prophets of Allah, right?

Seriously? Did you see his views on the invasion of Iraq or not, i strongly suggest you watch videos of him talking about that issue. He's a sadistic arsehole and a stain on humanity, anyone who rationalizes the killing of innocent people and the destruction of a country under pretenses like "we're bringing western civilization to a backward country" deserves absolutely zero respect.

and just to make things clear, by saying he's not a shit stain due to the reasons i mentioned, are you agreeing with or condoning his opinions on western invasion in Arab countries?!

My hate for him? He justifies the killing of the Iraqi people, a fellow Arab country, from which i have so many friends, the vast majority of them who haven't been able to go back to their country because of the coalition forces illegal invasion. What the fuck do you think my feelings toward him will be?? Love and compassion?!

 

[AndreaCristiano]

Because fuck you.

Real mature are you 45 and living in your mothers basement

 

[AndreaCristiano]

that means every event is a miracle, i think you mean NOT in accordance with the laws of physics. In which case how do you explain the birth of Jesus, unless of course that too you think is hocus pocus.

It seems Ze Tehir 's God is limited to laws and time and reality as we know it. I do not understand how one can accept a deity creating something from nothing but he couldn't ressurect and still be alive. So which one is it?

 

[YasoR17]

Real mature are you 45 and living in your mothers basement

No I'm 60 and my mom is dead you asshole.

 

[AndreaCristiano]

No I'm 60 and my mom is dead you asshole.

if thats true then you should be ashamed of how you comport yourself like a child. Also even if your mother is dead there was no offense to your mother in my statement

 

[YasoR17]

Hmm, can't say I agree with you on that broski.

 

[X Æ A-12]

if thats true then you should be ashamed of how you comport yourself like a child. Also even if your mother is dead there was no offense to your mother in my statement

Are you saying he's lying about that?

 

[AndreaCristiano]

Hmm, can't say I agree with you on that broski.

how was my statement in anyway offensive to your mom? It was arely offensive to you? Its not like i cursed at you or said despicable things lol

---------- Post added 19.03.2012 at 20:03 ----------

Are you saying he's lying about that?

who knows with some of you guys on here lol

 

[YasoR17]

Rleax broski I never said it was offensive. Why you gotta be so defensive all the time? Chill for a minute. Just joking with you. You know I love you broski.

 

[AndreaCristiano]

Rleax broski I never said it was offensive. Why you gotta be so defensive all the time? Chill for a minute. Just joking with you. You know I love you broski.

Now your Zack Ryder lol so confused

 

[ZoSo]

Rleax broski I never said it was offensive. Why you gotta be so defensive all the time? Chill for a minute. Just joking with you. You know I love you broski.

You are the weirdest guy on the forum. Sometimes you say smart things then other times you just go full retard.