Does God exist? (William Lane Craig vs Peter Atkins debate) (5 Viewers)

[Quetzalcoatl]

I wouldn't accept that, but I'm not gonna argue about it. It's your opinion.

I didn't realise we were arguing

 

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[Sheik Yerbouti]

I didn't realise we were arguing

Not with each other, no.

 

[Hængebøffer]

That depends on what you mean by "spiritual experience". But you can certainly choose to call a certain experience "spiritual".

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You're just missing the point.

No. Would you bring up the flying spaghetti monster too? The three biggest religions are pretty new.

 

[Raz]

Yes, but you do realize what I was trying to do there, right? That it doesn't matter how long a belief has lasted if that belief can be proven wrong.

I get the feeling that you are missing the point what a belief is if you want proof for it.

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

No. Would you bring up the flying spaghetti monster too? The three biggest religions are pretty new.

Soren, "new" based on what timeframe? If you're taking the lifetime of the earth, then sure, they are "new". But if you consider the timeline of religions, which is what I am considering, then they are certainly "old".

I get the feeling that you are missing the point what a belief is if you want proof for it.

So if I believe that you are a deranged serial killer, you find it reasonable that I seek no proof to support it, or you provide any to refute it?

 

[Raz]

You can do whatever you want.

I find it funny that you would go to such extreme example though.

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

You can do whatever you want.

I find it funny that you would go to such extreme example though.

It's no surprise then that you believe in non-sense.

 

[Hængebøffer]

Soren, "new" based on what timeframe? If you're taking the lifetime of the earth, then sure, they are "new". But if you consider the timeline of religions, which is what I am considering, then they are certainly "old".

I thought the premise for the discussion was the serious ones

 

[Raz]

What nonsense? I don't believe in any religion and haven't really made the leap of faith to believe in any god.

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

I thought the premise for the discussion was the serious ones

Let's be a little more open minded than that, shall we?

What nonsense? I don't believe in any religion and haven't really made the leap of faith to believe in any god.

Raz, with all due respect, of all the discussions I've had with you on the forum, if there's one thing that's stuck in my mind, it's that you believe in some non sense.

 

[Raz]

No problem, you look funny to me when discussing god too. Though I don't think you believe in nonsense, I just think you are limiting your world view a lot, by denying anything that isn't "proven" yet "experienced" every day by millions of people.

All in all ether half of the people of the world are delusional or both of them are wrong.

 

[Hust]

Forza God

 

[Quetzalcoatl]

God God vaffanculo

 

[Hængebøffer]

Let's be a little more open minded than that, shall we?

People are not open minded. Only to things that is "correct". God, religion etc. is a part of culture and culture is man made. Some man made things makes sense, some doesn't. Do you really believe that, let's say, Scientology makes more sense than Christianity?

 

[Raz]

Why forza? You think he's a typical italian?

 

[Azzurri7]

No problem, you look funny to me when discussing god too. Though I don't think you believe in nonsense, I just think you are limiting your world view a lot, by denying anything that isn't "proven" yet "experienced" every day by millions of people.

All in all ether half of the people of the world are delusional or both of them are wrong.

Doubting isn't denying. And just like he can't prove God doesn't exist you can't prove he does, so there are more room and space for doubt than for believing if you ask me.

 

[Hust]

Why forza? You think he's a typical italian?

I'm cheering for God and since he is anything and everything he will understand that.

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

No problem, you look funny to me when discussing god too. Though I don't think you believe in nonsense, I just think you are limiting your world view a lot, by denying anything that isn't "proven" yet "experienced" every day by millions of people.

All in all ether half of the people of the world are delusional or both of them are wrong.

Those limits are necessary because IF they are not in place, I become gullible to any world view that is coming my way. And gullibility is not a good thing to be.

People are not open minded. Only to things that is "correct". God, religion etc. is a part of culture and culture is man made. Some man made things makes sense, some doesn't. Do you really believe that, let's say, Scientology makes more sense than Christianity?

Yes, god and religion are man-made. And it's through those lens that I view Christianity, Scientology and every other religion. You said earlier than Scientology is a scam. I agree, and I don't believe that's just true for Scientology, but for pretty much every religion there is. The premise and promises of religion simply raises too many alarm bells of "SCAM!" in my mind that are simply too hard to ignore. But for some reason here, it's perfectly reasonable to claim Scientology is a scam, but Christianity and Islam aren't. I can't accept that double standard.

 

[Hængebøffer]

Those limits are necessary because IF they are not in place, I become gullible to any world view that is coming my way. And gullibility is not a good thing to be.



Yes, god and religion are man-made. And it's through those lens that I view Christianity, Scientology and every other religion. You said earlier than Scientology is a scam. I agree, and I don't believe that's just true for Scientology, but for pretty much every religion there is. The premise and promises of religion simply raises too many alarm bells of "SCAM!" in my mind that are simply too hard to ignore. But for some reason here, it's perfectly reasonable to claim Scientology is a scam, but Christianity and Islam aren't. I can't accept that double standard.

It's a scam as in it's for the rich people.

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

It's a scam as in it's for the rich people.

And religion is a scam for the powerful people.