Coronavirus (COVID-19 Outbreak) (119 Viewers)
- Thread starter Bjerknes
- Start date
Some valid points from Rogan and Baker on HCQ. @Post Ironic @GordoDeCentral
Don't watch it @swag I know Joe is too lame for you.
This infectious disease pharmacist has a good thread here breaking down the various studies on which HCL has failed to show any meaningful effect on Covid. From invitro, to animal testing, to human tests with placebo controls.
https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1288871272261328902.html
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https://www.infectioncontroltoday.com/view/new-study-hydroxychloroquine-works-in-monkeys-not-humans
Another interesting look at why early invitro studies for HCL showed a good effect at blocking Covid. They were studying Vero E6 cell line from kidney cells in the green monkey and the enzyme helper for the virus to gain entry is Cathepsin L which HCL blocks. In the human lung cell line, Calu-3, the helper enzyme is TMPRSS2 which HCL does not block at all, allowing cellular entry of the virus.
Here’s the actual study:
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-020-2575-3
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https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1288871272261328902.html
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https://www.infectioncontroltoday.com/view/new-study-hydroxychloroquine-works-in-monkeys-not-humans
Another interesting look at why early invitro studies for HCL showed a good effect at blocking Covid. They were studying Vero E6 cell line from kidney cells in the green monkey and the enzyme helper for the virus to gain entry is Cathepsin L which HCL blocks. In the human lung cell line, Calu-3, the helper enzyme is TMPRSS2 which HCL does not block at all, allowing cellular entry of the virus.
Here’s the actual study:
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-020-2575-3
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Something else that bothers me is the fact that millions of people around the world are taking HCQ in small doses on a regular basis for malaria and autoimmune diseases but suddenly it became a dangerous drug. This seems suspicious.
I'm 50/50 if it works or not. It may not work alone in the beginning without zinc, it may work for some people and others not, it may not work at all. I personally wouldn't count on it unless it is 100% proven that it works and I would use something like quercetin instead to penetrate the virus membrane and then take zinc. At least quercetin is safe.
I'm 50/50 if it works or not. It may not work alone in the beginning without zinc, it may work for some people and others not, it may not work at all. I personally wouldn't count on it unless it is 100% proven that it works and I would use something like quercetin instead to penetrate the virus membrane and then take zinc. At least quercetin is safe.
I think the danger thing is way overstated, and I believe in the one thing I linked above the guy said much the same. though I suppose it’s mostly when taken Alongside Az that it really becomes a danger for arrhythmia and qt prolongation. And with Az is the initial Didier Raoult “study” with its “gross methodological shortcomings.”
I’m of the opinion that until we have proper double blind, placebo controlled studies showing it is an effective treatment option, it shouldn’t be used outside those studies. Right now those sort of studies have all shown it to be ineffective, in mild and moderate cases, in post-exposure prophylaxis, and in hospitalized cases.
Hopefully at some point, if these sort of studies continue to show it has little effect, we start getting more info on trials of other drugs that look promising.
I’m of the opinion that until we have proper double blind, placebo controlled studies showing it is an effective treatment option, it shouldn’t be used outside those studies. Right now those sort of studies have all shown it to be ineffective, in mild and moderate cases, in post-exposure prophylaxis, and in hospitalized cases.
Hopefully at some point, if these sort of studies continue to show it has little effect, we start getting more info on trials of other drugs that look promising.
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Well, despite its comedic death metal culture, Sweden doesn't quite have the same Eastern skinhead problem Germany has.
I know the Swedish chav exists (e.g., kids in Kivic, Haninge), but Germany has an entire former country full of them.
Sorta.
I just can't. Wasted too much time down that rabbit hole before. I know what I am going to see. And I can only consume so many car crashes.
I should know what he's saying, because he commands an army of head-nodders. But he's not my cup of tea.
Make no mistake: every drug you take comes with side-effects. If what you're taking isn't addressing the core reason you're taking it, you're just inviting nothing but side-effects.
I know the Swedish chav exists (e.g., kids in Kivic, Haninge), but Germany has an entire former country full of them.
Sorta.
I just can't. Wasted too much time down that rabbit hole before. I know what I am going to see. And I can only consume so many car crashes.
I should know what he's saying, because he commands an army of head-nodders. But he's not my cup of tea.
Make no mistake: every drug you take comes with side-effects. If what you're taking isn't addressing the core reason you're taking it, you're just inviting nothing but side-effects.
For some reason i don't get mention notifications, i don't like Rogans program, but it does introduce ideas and concepts to a segment of people who otherwise would never hear em.
Check this out:
https://hcqtrial.com/
Check this out:
https://hcqtrial.com/
So the Australian state Victoria has been in lockdown for around a month yet cases are still rising with 700 positives today. Seems like a hot mess for me as an outsider. Victoria's hospitals are likely to reach capacity within weeks if the infection rates don't fall down.
Either lockdowns don't really work if the rules are too soft or there is something terribly wrong over there.
Either lockdowns don't really work if the rules are too soft or there is something terribly wrong over there.
whoa
britbongs get 50% discount on all fastfood
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/get-a-discount-with-the-eat-out-to-help-out-scheme
britbongs get 50% discount on all fastfood
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/get-a-discount-with-the-eat-out-to-help-out-scheme
That’s one way to make sure it’s not a hoax
https://www.kxan.com/news/coronavir...ers-party-1-dead-and-another-on-life-support/
https://www.kxan.com/news/coronavir...ers-party-1-dead-and-another-on-life-support/
Soft lockdowns like what was done here in my province (British Columbia, Canada, ~5.1 million population, no stay at home orders, no full shutdown, social gatherings limited by recommendation instead of law, schools reopened in late May) only work if the majority of people feel a sense of social responsibility. It seems it has mostly worked here. We only have 39 dead/million during the entire pandemic (including probable cases). They’ve managed to reduce hospitalizations to 8 people total now, and new cases 20-30 most days, and so far all contact traceable since phase 3 reopening. Could still see a huge surge, but it’s gone pretty well so far.
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Victoria entered stage 4 lockdown on Sunday night. This will last for at least 6 weeks.
Most non-essential businesses closed, schools and universities closed, public transport still open but only for essential workers, people only allowed out within 5km radius of their homes, curfew from 8PM - 5AM. This is a New Zealand style lockdown and I reckon within 3-4 weeks you will see the numbers drop down dramatically. Fines have also been ramped up for those breaking lockdown/stay at home orders. About time.
They said 1 in every 4 people who were meant to be at isolating in their homes (positive with COVID) were not at home when authorities went door knocking. These assholes were almost certainly spreading it around the city. 700 cases a day in a population of about 5.5M or so is horrendous, on a per capita basis it’s almost as bad as Mexico.
No idea how over here in NSW we have managed to hold out the second wave (so far) only recording roughly between 10-15 cases a day for now. After the outbreak in early July at the pub, I seriously feared for the worse over here.
Our contract tracing team deserves a medal if they get us through these next rocky few weeks and months.
Most non-essential businesses closed, schools and universities closed, public transport still open but only for essential workers, people only allowed out within 5km radius of their homes, curfew from 8PM - 5AM. This is a New Zealand style lockdown and I reckon within 3-4 weeks you will see the numbers drop down dramatically. Fines have also been ramped up for those breaking lockdown/stay at home orders. About time.
They said 1 in every 4 people who were meant to be at isolating in their homes (positive with COVID) were not at home when authorities went door knocking. These assholes were almost certainly spreading it around the city. 700 cases a day in a population of about 5.5M or so is horrendous, on a per capita basis it’s almost as bad as Mexico.
No idea how over here in NSW we have managed to hold out the second wave (so far) only recording roughly between 10-15 cases a day for now. After the outbreak in early July at the pub, I seriously feared for the worse over here.
Our contract tracing team deserves a medal if they get us through these next rocky few weeks and months.
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This is in essence why I don't believe in lockdowns in most cases. The more you try to actually rule people's lives, the more they'll restrain and do the exact opposite of what you want them to do. You can't force people to isolate, only ask them kindly to stay at home, make it a morale case and also work on unity. If you can't get those aspects right than a lockdown will most likely to be a failure
It took months in Italy, literally months for cases to plummet. Also in Italy it wasn't as widespread as the most cases were often noted in Lombardia.
It took months in Italy, literally months for cases to plummet. Also in Italy it wasn't as widespread as the most cases were often noted in Lombardia.
I've read blame pointed towards Victoria's dependency on a lot of private security forces being used for hotel and other quarantine enforcement:
https://www.theage.com.au/national/...t-of-the-bag-in-victoria-20200703-p558og.html
https://theconversation.com/melbour...overseen-by-a-flawed-security-industry-142044
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-07...l-security-guards-recruited-whatsapp/12476574
Superspreading is a thing, and the first generation of infections from poorly recruited private security could really be a thing. But that doesn't claim for the failures required to prevent second, third and later generation infections.
Gotta catch up to the US in the obesity wars.
Funny thing about Brits... they use the term "scheme" all the time when it comes to financial incentives, oblivious to the connotations that the term has in America.
If you leave rules as polite suggestions, nobody will take you seriously and now the entire population is at risk because of your limp-wristed leadership.
Martial law is a thing and should only be employed under dire circumstances. But it exists for the same reason.
Relying on a fully aware, believing, compliant public without repercussions is a recipe for nobody to follow.
Just sayin'...
https://www.theage.com.au/national/...t-of-the-bag-in-victoria-20200703-p558og.html
https://theconversation.com/melbour...overseen-by-a-flawed-security-industry-142044
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-07...l-security-guards-recruited-whatsapp/12476574
Superspreading is a thing, and the first generation of infections from poorly recruited private security could really be a thing. But that doesn't claim for the failures required to prevent second, third and later generation infections.
Gotta catch up to the US in the obesity wars.
Funny thing about Brits... they use the term "scheme" all the time when it comes to financial incentives, oblivious to the connotations that the term has in America.
If you leave rules as polite suggestions, nobody will take you seriously and now the entire population is at risk because of your limp-wristed leadership.
Martial law is a thing and should only be employed under dire circumstances. But it exists for the same reason.
Relying on a fully aware, believing, compliant public without repercussions is a recipe for nobody to follow.
Just sayin'...
Massive fuckup from the Andrews government. Can’t believe they hired local, improperly trained security to deal with such a vital security situation.
Gladys B and the Libs are cunts, but she got our greatest public servant (police commissioner Fuller) to oversee our hotel quarantine, with federal cops and the army watching over it all and so far so good.
I hope you’re safe and well and things get better down there for you soon.