[CL] JUVENTUS 1-3 Barcelona (June 6th, 2015) (59 Viewers)

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Hist

Founder of Hism
Jan 18, 2009
11,476
We have different opinions on these incidents and that's fine. But you acting all self-righteous about this and complaining about us complaining is rather ironic. It's perfectly fine for us to be upset about certain incidents we view as being factors in the outcome. If you read my discussion with Swag, I've said multiple times that I'm upset more so that not one of the three fouls on Pogba was called, and more so the re outside the box, one of which have Barca the counter for their second goal. We always know a penalty is going to have be pretty blatant for it to be awarded in a CL final. So that's not the end of the world, even if I think it was pretty cut and dry penalty from watching replays. Considering the ref called every little contact against Barca, the two thee fouls on Pogba should have been called.

I don't subscribe at all to UEFAlona crap or conspiracies. I do think the ref was poor and called the game in a way that favoured Barca by not allowing any physicality, but that was to be expected. What was not expected was Pogba being fouled 3 separate times and not a single one of them being called. So I'm upset about that 1 day after the final, as those 3 foul non-calls were factors in the way the game went.

Do I think we would have won if they aren't called? We may have, the chances were there, but in all likelihood Barca overwhelms us anyways and wins, I just don't like that the match turned as quickly as it did by allowing back to back fouls on Pigba that directly led to Suarez's goals.

I'm allowed to be upset about this for a couple days. Many others are too. Many others agree with me.

I don't really think we were robbed of a victory. I think poor refereeing made a likely win for Barca a guaranteed win for Barca. That's my right to think this. As it is your right to think differently. But for you and others to be complaining about us being upset about these incidents is equally absurd and you should leave us alone to deal with the loss and our interpretation of these incidents how we want to.


I seriously doubt any of us are going to be freaking out about this a week from now, let alone a month. So stop with self-righteous stuff about how your way is the only right way to react. It isn't. Barca deserved to win, the ref was poor and made that win more likely with a couple missed calls at a crucial juncture. One doesn't exclude the other. That's my take away from the match.

Anyways. I'm proud of this team, I'm prid of their performance, and proud that even after going down 2-1 we still pressed to score with Pogba putting a free header over an open net and Pereyra and Llorente bungling what should have been a brilliant chance in the box late on. They put in a gritty and determined performance and I'm excited to see what next year brings.
I do not disagree with this at all. My whole problem was with the "Robbed" part. I never said you shouldn't be upset about the defeat we all are. No holier than thou attitude involved at all.
 

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Hist

Founder of Hism
Jan 18, 2009
11,476
you should seriously get banned for 1. stating something no-one here ever said as facts and 2. for talking nonsense that does not matter in the context. i'll simplify it again for you and then i'll stop, since you are obviously a hopeless case. no matter who dominated the game, created more chances, had more possession or deserves to win more, at one point the game was tied at 1-1. at that point, both teams are up even and have equal chances of winning. also, at that point, the game could have been decided in our favor if the ref did whistle a penalty for us, that should have been whistled. are you following until now? read everything twice if you have trouble understanding. less than a minute after that penalty, that would likely give us the LEAD in the CL FINAL with 20-30 minutes to go, the ref didnt whistle a foul on Pogba who had won a ball and denied a clear counter, but gout fouled immediately. the result of that not called foul was a Barca counter attack that led to them leading the game. so, instead of us having a 2-1 lead, in less than a minute, Barca got a 2-1 lead, directly influenced by the referee. now, if you disagree with these obvious things, and decide to go with "they were better", "Gigi saved us so many times", "we didnt create anything", "you cant compare this with Ovrebo" etc. then i will have to call you a "not very smart person". so i'll say it again, stop before i lose this little respect i have left for you
I don't care for your respect and as far as this discussion goes I am still keeping it civil while you are acting like a kid throwing a tantrum.

Where did I say something no one ever said as fact? that other people on this forum think it was a soft call? Read back a couple of pages and you'll find it. I am not the one who claimed its an objective clear fact that its a penalty.

Or is it that "Robbed" implies that something was yours and was then stolen from you? This is how the language works. I don't know what to say to that other than if you know what being robbed means you would agree that it doesn't suit the context.

Moreover, regarding the second bold part. At 1-1 both teams do not have an equal chance of winning the game because leading up to that point the game was almost one sided and it is more likely that it will continue to be so. To be clear, I am not denying that there is a possibility we could have won the game have the penalty been given. I am denying that it decides the game in our favor given the difference in quality of performance. It increases our odds but doesnt decide our victory the same way not getting the Penalty and foul decrease our odds but do not decide our loss.

Having said that not getting a 2-1 lead is again far from getting robbed. This was a close call as evidenced by the wide disagreement between people about it. Its better to get it than not to ofcourse but I wouldn't go nuts over not receiving a soft call. If a Barca fan had said its clearly not a penalty he would be equally ridiculed. So take that out of your argument.

The foul was clearer and imo should have been given and that would have affected the course of the game (doesn't mean we would necessarily win). The ref made an error which made it 2-1 for them instead of 1-1; an outcome that was very likely given the performance level of each team upto that point. This is again a far cry from robbing us.

I am much more aligned with Kieselguhr Kid's view than yours.
 

zizinho

Senior Member
Apr 14, 2013
51,816
if these things you did say are really from others, then talk about it with them. why are you bringing stuff some other posters said pages ago into the discussion with me? what are you trying to prove that way anyway?

we were "robbed" by the simple fact that the ref didnt whistle 2 game deciding decisions in our favor when he should have done so (they were stolen from us), nothing to do with buying ref etc. also, the penalty wasnt a 50/50. the disagreement among people doesent mean its a close call. thats the same as saying you are wrong so many times with your posts that your opinion shouldnt count. so basing your opinion on others is wrong.

it either is a penalty or not - Pogba was taken down in the box when he was about to turn and shoot - clear penalty, if you disagree lets stop here.

and i never said we would win. but lets say we didnt get the penalty but got the other foul instead. Barca wouldnt get that counter and our chances would still be equal (yes equal, its 1-1 with 20 minutes to go in a CL final). Allegri would have a much better situation to try with Pereyra or Sturaro (or even Llorente) to change something tactically and try to win the game.

ill stop now as i see no point in this.

to conclude: penalty not given at 1-1, foul not given that lead to a 2-1 - robbery
 

Juventino[RUS]

Senior Member
Mar 9, 2006
29,039
We were not robbed?


Look at his right hand, he's doing everything to not let Pogba to stop that ball, He pulls him away, on the corners/set pieces its normal practice when players push each other, embrace each other, but not for the open play, it's a clear penalty, what was the point for Pogba to dive there or what he did according to you? He could easily convert this pass into the goal if not only Alves and his grab
 

radekas

( ͠° ͟ل͜ ͡°)
Aug 26, 2009
19,617
Juventino[RUS];4967949 said:
We were not robbed?


Look at his right hand, he's doing everything to not let Pogba to stop that ball, He pulls him away, on the corners/set pieces its normal practice when players push each other, embrace each other, but not for the open play, it's a clear penalty, what was the point for Pogba to dive there or what he did according to you? He could easily convert this pass into the goal if not only Alves and his grab
9 out of 10 times this is a clear penalty. If it was the other way around and barca was denied such a penalty we would be reading about big controversy in all of the media right now.
 

Xperd

'Toli Throater
Jun 1, 2012
33,654
We needed that luck with the peno call buy we dint get it.

But saying were robbed is disgraceful and childish behaviour.Like Hist said,some of you deserve to be supporting Roma or Inter instead for the amount of whining u people do.
We,Juventus have experienced similar scenarios to Barca in the league so please stop bringing out the hypocrisy and try to look at things rationally.
Any unbiased person would admit that Barca were the better team on the day.Like i said,if we had our piece of fortune,maybe we could've gone to ET.
Its disgusting to lose but it is what it is
And zizinho please stop.You're making zero sense,u're sounding like one of those silly goal.com fans
 

Juventino[RUS]

Senior Member
Mar 9, 2006
29,039
We needed that luck with the peno call buy we dint get it.

But saying were robbed is disgraceful and childish behaviour.Like Hist said,some of you deserve to be supporting Roma or Inter instead for the amount of whining u people do.
We,Juventus have experienced similar scenarios to Barca in the league so please stop bringing out the hypocrisy and try to look at things rationally.
Any unbiased person would admit that Barca were the better team on the day.Like i said,if we had our piece of fortune,maybe we could've gone to ET.
Its disgusting to lose but it is what it is
And zizinho please stop.You're making zero sense,u're sounding like one of those silly goal.com fans
Chelsea were robbed against Barcelona?
 

radekas

( ͠° ͟ل͜ ͡°)
Aug 26, 2009
19,617
We needed that luck with the peno call buy we dint get it.

But saying were robbed is disgraceful and childish behaviour.Like Hist said,some of you deserve to be supporting Roma or Inter instead for the amount of whining u people do.
We,Juventus have experienced similar scenarios to Barca in the league so please stop bringing out the hypocrisy and try to look at things rationally.
Any unbiased person would admit that Barca were the better team on the day.Like i said,if we had our piece of fortune,maybe we could've gone to ET.
Its disgusting to lose but it is what it is
And zizinho please stop.You're making zero sense,u're sounding like one of those silly goal.com fans
There's nothing shameful in saying that this situation has most likely decided the outcome of the game. It's the final of the most important club football tournament and such things should not happen on this level.
 

Juventino[RUS]

Senior Member
Mar 9, 2006
29,039
Chelsea definitely were.

We werent on the other hand.Thats far too extreme to even suggest that.
So, what the diffrence - not given penalty for clear handball or not given penalty for clear foul inside the box?

- - - Updated - - -

There's nothing shameful in saying that this situation has most likely decided the outcome of the game. It's the final of the most important club football tournament and such things should not happen on this level.
they wont understand, we were not robbed in 98, we are just acting very childish, the referee who doesn't have balls to give such a clear penalty is not childish, this is the most important thing
 

Xperd

'Toli Throater
Jun 1, 2012
33,654
Chelsea were denied 3-4 blatant penalties.

We on the other hand were denied a 50-50 call which could've gone either way.Like i said,we needed that piece of fortune at that moment in time.
 

Xperd

'Toli Throater
Jun 1, 2012
33,654
@radekas,my point is ref is the last person we shud be blaming for this loss.
And i dont think he 'changed the outcome' of the game like u put it.
It was not blatant like Ovrebo.
 

ADP1897

Senior Member
Apr 17, 2014
1,593
Man, the game is over, no point getting worked up about it. Now we rejoice because of what we've accomplished, use this as motivation, pray that we get Barcelona in the first knock out stage, knock em out, then draw madrid, knock em out, then chelsea, knock em out, then bayern final, knock em out.

I want to slay them all. In the meantime we prepare.
:tup:
You're the best man.

Not really. The whole game was in their favor apart from 15 minutes. Even our goal was against the run of play.

I don't mind if you cry about it 3 years into the future if your claim to be robbed was legitimate. I still hate calciopoli almost 10 years later. I also never said you should not be upset we lost; we all are. But the WE WERE ROBBED by UEFALONA attitude is just shameful.

Again "Robbed" implies 1) that we deserved to win and 2) The ref was conspiring against us.

Counter (1):
a) We didn't deserve to win as the run of play was clearly in their favor for the great majority of the game (which thanks to Gigi didn't see us humiliated).
b) Even if we got that soft penalty nothing guarantees we would have won. The run of play would probably continue in their favor.
c) We also lost by a 2 goal margin.
d) We didn't create goal scoring chances throughout the game.
e) We didn't even have meaningless possession let alone meaningful possession of the ball.

Counter (2):
a) The ref showed great patience with Vidal when many other refs that arent bought would have given him marching orders.
b) The ref correctly cancelled Neymar's goal when it could have been granted if the ref was bought.
c) The penalty claim was a hard to spot soft one.

No UEFALONA CONSPIRACY. This is nothing compared to the Obrevo game with Chelsea for instance or Italy Vs South Korea.

Enough Mopy Dick
Idk, about pogba penalty claims, but ppl blaming ref, and laughing at benitez :lol:
They're better side, and we're giving them a little hard time.
As Fresh said we lose today, and we should aiming for revenge tomorrow

we were def beaten by the better team.

ffs guys our main creative player last night was a past it 36 year old who failed to create a single goal scoring chance.

let that sink in. 36 year old. played entire match, and zero chances created. that should tell u all u need about lack of quality. our subs included a guy that scored once in 6 months, and a very nervous and raw 18 year old.
This :tup:
 

Post Ironic

Senior Member
Feb 9, 2013
42,073
We needed that luck with the peno call buy we dint get it.

But saying were robbed is disgraceful and childish behaviour.Like Hist said,some of you deserve to be supporting Roma or Inter instead for the amount of whining u people do.
We,Juventus have experienced similar scenarios to Barca in the league so please stop bringing out the hypocrisy and try to look at things rationally.
Any unbiased person would admit that Barca were the better team on the day.Like i said,if we had our piece of fortune,maybe we could've gone to ET.
Its disgusting to lose but it is what it is
And zizinho please stop.You're making zero sense,u're sounding like one of those silly goal.com fans
Oh c'mon.

It's less than 36 hours after the match. People deal with things in different ways.

I think the expression "we were robbed" is far too strong, even silly, even if in the 10-20 minutes after the match when emotions were high I said so and was much more upset... but the non-calls on 3 Pogba fouls all had a direct influence on the outcome of the match.

Barca was the better team and deserved the win, but as I said, the ref turned a likely win into a basically guaranteed win by swallowing his whistle on two straight fouls on Pogba. And yes, the penalty shout was a foul, it's just whether it was enough of a foul to warrant a penalty being given in a CL final. And isolated from the game and the way the ref was calling it, I'd say no it wasn't. There have only been 2 penalties given in the last 13 CL finals for a reason (and only the 1 for Dortmund actually was at a relevant point in the game). Refs don't want to decide such an important game with a penalty call. Fair enough. I actually agree with this.

What I don't agree with is saying that him swallowing his whistle on the subsequent clear trip on Pogba by Alves, that gave Barca possession for their counter to score the winning goal was a non-factor. It was a big factor. And it was contrary to how he had called the entire game whistling all contact against Barca players regardless of whether we won the ball or not. It wasn't in the box, he wasn't having to swallow his whistle worried about giving a penalty, it was a clear foul that should have been given, and his failure to give it allowed Barca to gain the ball and score less than 10 seconds later. That's objective. That's fact.

So me saying the ref played a factor in Barca's go-ahead goal, which directly influenced the outcome of the game shouldn't be a big deal, and really shouldn't be argued with and called whining. As I've said, we weren't robbed, but the ref made a couple poor calls that directly influenced the outcome. Yes, Barca likely would have won anyways, they were the better team, and had the game changers in attack, and our finishing had been poor all night... but I would have liked to see how the game played out with that foul called properly and it remaining 1-1 at that point where we were pressing.

Oh well. Shit happens. I'm basically over it now, and excited for next season.

But stop calling people childish, disgraceful, and deserving of Inter or Roma for being upset about this. That's really poor form imo.
 
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