A Pathetic democracy!!! (4 Viewers)

[Tom]

To be honest, and in all honesty I mean no offence but from a western viewpoint all the arab nations appear to be as bad as one another. I mean ake Iraq; apparently Saddam was all bad, so we go in there, save you from the tyranny, oppression etc, but instead of being constructive and hlping us rebuild the country you start blowing up our troops, and now decide to start a musclim vs muslim civil war.. I mean how dumb can you get.. what exactly is blowing yourself up going to achieve in any situation.. gah! Don't know why we bother to be honest..

 

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[Azzurri7]

To be honest, and in all honesty I mean no offence but from a western viewpoint all the arab nations appear to be as bad as one another. I mean ake Iraq; apparently Saddam was all bad, so we go in there, save you from the tyranny, oppression etc, but instead of being constructive and hlping us rebuild the country you start blowing up our troops, and now decide to start a musclim vs muslim civil war.. I mean how dumb can you get.. what exactly is blowing yourself up going to achieve in any situation.. gah! Don't know why we bother to be honest..

Somehow I have to Agree about the Iraq thing.

Though American British troops are not only there to save but for petrol aswell and to change the regime in the middle east and removing all these Dictators.

Where were arabs when Saddam was killing his men and his ppl? no one did give a Bullshit or two about this. But when Americans and British decided to come in and removing him but in exchange to take some petrol(Because as we all know, nothing is for free in this world, atleast not in Politics.) Asking them to withdraw when they actually want to rebuild everything and turn it into a new country as It deserve.

About the Muslim Vs Muslim civil war I actually expected this thing to come. And instead of calming things down and try to make peace everything is turning into bad and bad.

Tom, you say you don't know why would you bother, Infact you don't know how many Iraqies out there are thanful for the American and British and all these who did give some hand in putting Saddam and his troops down. There are lot, Believe me. Just don't let media take you into somewhere else.

 

[ReBeL]

Are the Palestinian people united on the proposals for an independent homeland? What I hear in the press (not saying I believe it) is that no agreement will ever be reached as long as Palestine must exist next to Isreal, the Palestinians want all of that land returned to them.

It's the media again, mate...

You won't ever find a country that have all its people united on one thing..

I won't tell you that all Palestinians are convinced of what they may get if they were provided with a CONVINCING land as a permanent solution for their case...

But you have to note that Israel has this type of people who want all Palestinians out of their land and they even want their country to contain Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Jordan, Palestine and Egypt...

My point again: If Palsetinians found that they may find a solution that they could be living under its conditions, they won't think twice about accepting it...

 

[ReBeL]

Of course i have thats what makes it Soooooo good.


@ ReBel and the rest of you in this thread sorry, to be talking bout cheese, while your in serious discussion mode. But it seriously is good shit.

Anyways, i'll end the Halloumi talk ........For now.

Don't take it serious, man...

I know you don't mean anything wrong with you cheese debate

 

[Gep]

Don't take it serious, man...

I know you don't mean anything wrong with you cheese debate

You da man!

 

[Hambon]

Well tom...i just want to clarify that i am not a Syrian... I am a libyan/american who was born and raised 20+ years in america and am currently working in Saudi arabia.....

Most of these arab leaders were brought to power by.....yes you guessed it amercia...and they were all failures....

Colonel Qadaffi- given information and resources to plan a coup after king idriss senousi left libya

Saddam Hussien: given vital info + weapons +support by the US to invade and attack iran....america backed him fully( that is why they are prosecuting him IN IRAQ and not in the war tribunal.....because if he was there he would bring up the documents that show that america told him to kill those thousands of shite and kurds...but now america just wants democracy,land,oil & power and saddam will not stand in there way. nor will facts that can topple the american govt.)

SaM Bin laden : funded by america during the russian /afghan war. given the latest technology of weapons to take out those damn commies.....later on they labeled him as a terrorist and blamed him from 911. when we all know that no damn Arab can fly a plane and coordinate that full scale attack like pro's ......come on people thats goverment shit....or to scale it down it was a way to get the worlds attention on how bad the arab world is and label them as terrorists so that George bush and his team of clowns can go smoke them out of thier holes....use terrorism as a reason for everything and take over iraq and its resources make a huge mess.....and yes still blame terrorism.......or al-qaida which doesnt even exist

King hussien and son: america deveated a plan to tell Hussein as a child that his pops was crazy so that he can take power as a young teen....he was seduced by material things such as women and power......america then raised him and created a second loyal state next to isreal

i could go on bout every leader out there and how politicians are just a bunch of corrupt liars and wannabees.....but i will save this forum from the CIA, MOSSAD, or Interpoll taping in...hehe





Terrorism" is a word used so often and so loosely that it has lost a clear meaning

Currently, the term "terrorism" is applied to the use of force most often on the basis of whether the speaker agrees with the goal of the violence. Hence the expression "One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter."

Alternatively, or sometimes even in conjunction with the foregoing, some people condemn any violence by a non-governmental entity -- whatever the target -- as terrorism, and approvingly label any action by a sovereign country's military forces -- again, whatever the target -- as "military strikes" or the like.

In determining whether an act is "terrorism" or not, it would be more useful to eliminate subjective evaluations of the goals of the violence, and instead, utilize two other factors -- the expected result of the violence, and the nature of the actor -- to then distinguish among four different types of acts involving the application of force:

this whole definition of terrorism has been played with by the media and labeled on turban wearing arabs.....who look "scary" and "very terrorist like"

come on guys.... you should really read more and expand your horizons....just dont view one side of the story .....explore ....

i know i have ever since i have come here and noticed that this place and people are more peacefull than all of amercia and most other countries....and i am not being biased....i am being real....

peace = salam

 

[Zé Tahir]

To be honest, and in all honesty I mean no offence but from a western viewpoint all the arab nations appear to be as bad as one another. I mean ake Iraq; apparently Saddam was all bad, so we go in there, save you from the tyranny, oppression etc, but instead of being constructive and hlping us rebuild the country you start blowing up our troops, and now decide to start a musclim vs muslim civil war.. I mean how dumb can you get.. what exactly is blowing yourself up going to achieve in any situation.. gah! Don't know why we bother to be honest..

This is about the most ignorant post I've seen. You seriously believe that crap about how Saddam was evil and so the Iraqi people had to be saved? Plz do not tell me that you do. This is the same Saddam that was supported by your people, the same one that was given the green light to enter Kuwait, by your people.

So what if Saddam was evil? It didn't bother anyone up until the US needed to shed attention from itself on its failiure to capture OBL. It was a perfect win-win situation for them. A, they get to go into Iraq and show its own people that they are fighting terror, B, no one would complain because "Saddam's evil", C, GAS!. How come no one is invading Sudan, N Korea, or even most recently, Belarus?

Please do not potray yourselves as compassionate humanitarians out to help the poor people of Iraq.

As for the civil war? Well that's what happens when you bring instability into an area.

I suggest you read the Iraqi point of view and not believe everything you see from across your leather sofa:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/newsnight/4896654.stm

 

[Tom]

Tom, you say you don't know why would you bother, Infact you don't know how many Iraqies out there are thanful for the American and British and all these who did give some hand in putting Saddam and his troops down. There are lot, Believe me. Just don't let media take you into somewhere else.

I know, I'm not stupid or anything, I just find it amazing how many arabs/muslims whatever you want to be classed as resort to violence almost as their first resort. It just appears to be incredibly backwards from my pov and I can see why we're worried about hamas being in control of palestine. Nothing but trouble can come of it, the Israelis will refuse negotiation, hamas will pretend it wants talks... bla bla bla and we're back to square one.

Just seems to be a complete lack of common sense in so many middle eastern countries its untrue. How so many people can be brainwashed into blowing themselves up.. is it me or surely the system is to blame there.. you don't see many christians, buddhists, jews etc blowing themselves up in the name of their religion. Its got to be in the education...

 

[Hambon]

oh yeah....america is not done yet....they are planning to take over the whole of the M.E ...syria,iran...etc.....

why fuck with iran?? North korea,india,pakistan...the whole god damn world gots nukes....why them....?? they need the technology to give energy to thier people....why would they want to nuke other countries when they know they will get nuked come on.....we know better ...

 

[ReBeL]

I actually still believe an agreement could take place. After-all It's not going to continue on this way.(Though It has been since 1948). But everything has an end.

Anyhow to sort this out IMO, I think both Israeli's and Palestinians should withdraw their weapons....(Something Palestinians might while Israeli's will never do..)
As long as they're both holding weapons It's hard to stop the tension that is growing everyday between them.

I don't want to get into the Hamas thing as I probably don't know or can't exactly know what's going on unlike the people living out there.

Well, I don't think we can live until this solution will be reached, but I think we should pave the way to the coming generations to let all the options open for them as we failed in all the possible ways these days...

Rebel...Talking about Westerners(democracy) I don't think It's really their fault as much as It's Arabs fault and the whole region. Why would you care whether westerns think this or that, the Fact is that even your neighbors are not willing to help you(which is why things is hard to Improve). All they do is keep praising the palestinian ppl while on the other hand each one of them is sitting on their chair having the famous coffee without giving "hand".

Anyhow I really hope things can be solved. Even "we" are fed up from this situation so I wouldn't want to ask Palestinians about this as I know how they're feeling.

Well, I don't have great expectations of the Western policy in the Middle East, but I don't like the way they are acting just like the liberators of the World, and those who make democracy their first priority while their main purpose is the Middle East's resources and nothing but those resources...

Palestinian people replied to those who want to publicize the democracy by electing a new government democratically, and they were shown the bad face of Western policy as a result...

You can't blame Arab countries too, because they are just colonies and they make nothing without asking their master in Washington D.C. and London...
If you kill the snake, you have to fight the head, not the stupid eggs...

 

[ReBeL]

To be honest Isreal has been leading the terrorism in the middle east for some time now....They just know how to get away with it. The thing you have to understand is that isreal as a state is a powerfull ally with amercia. Let us look at it this way. they are the steping stone for america here in the middle east. I really have nothing against the jewish people but the way the isreal government has been decieving the world through the media is just plain wrong and immoral. the reason hammas and the other groups started to perform "terrorist activity" was be cause they had no other choice but to retaleate the terror that isreal took upon the palistinean people. To cut it short. what isreal is doing to palistine is not really looking after them and trying to settle things down and try to be the better nation. they are infact provoking them and fueling a fire that is bound to create more hell in the region. Isreal like i said just knows how to cover it up through the media and there deceptive ways.....this topic is endless and i gots to hit the sack now.....one thing before i let you go.... Isreal's secret service "MOSSAD" motto is "deception is the Art of war" it is engraved on the wall when you walk in.......makes you think right...this whole drama caused by 30 isreals dying from retaletion by palistinieans who had hundreds and hundreds killed is quickly swept up and put under the carpet by them.....its a shame but its the world we live in to day....lies, lies and liars....

Very correct, Hameed...

btw rebel Mabrook on the pali flag

Thanks, man...

It really meant very much to me...

And it wouldn't happen without the help of some nice guys here like you and Ze Taher...

 

[Tom]

This is about the most ignorant post I've seen. You seriously believe that crap about how Saddam was evil and so the Iraqi people had to be saved? Plz do not tell me that you do. This is the same Saddam that was supported by your people, the same one that was given the green light to enter Kuwait, by your people.

So what if Saddam was evil? It didn't bother anyone up until the US needed to shed attention from itself on its failiure to capture OBL. It was a perfect win-win situation for them. A, they get to go into Iraq and show its own people that they are fighting terror, B, no one would complain because "Saddam's evil", C, GAS!. How come no one is invading Sudan, N Korea, or even most recently, Belarus?

Please do not potray yourselves as compassionate humanitarians out to help the poor people of Iraq.

As for the civil war? Well that's what happens when you bring instability into an area.

I suggest you read the Iraqi point of view and not believe everything you see from across your leather sofa:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/newsnight/4896654.stm

we hear enough about the bloody iraqi point of view right where we are actually. The bbc has excellent unbiased media coverage, enough for me to make my mind up anyway. Now I'm no expert but I seriously doubt we told Saddam he was a-ok to invade kuwait.. in which case why did we end up stopping him.

Nobody is invading sudan becuase as we speak we are trying to resolve it diplomatically, N. Korea I don't know the current state of affairs but I know we were going for diplomacy first there too.. plus the overstretching of resources would have been unbearable

I'll portray our soldiers as passionate humanitarians out to help as thats what they are. I love how you're willing to slate our democracies, our army, motives etc yet just one line on the ridiculpus civil war "well shit, thats what happens" - oh yeah, damn it happens everywhere, people running into temples strapped with bombs in the name of some religious sect. Its disgusting and downright ridiculous yet you dismiss it as ordinary. Maybe thats the problem. Failing to face up to the fact that the islamic way of life is clearly backwards, out of touch, and not a solid basis for living one's life!

Its all well and good criticising the way our leaders, bush and blair love em or loathe em (i'm no fan) act but as soon as anyone dares criticise the middle eastern ways you get your head blown off! Utter stupidity!!

 

[Hambon]

I know, I'm not stupid or anything, I just find it amazing how many arabs/muslims whatever you want to be classed as resort to violence almost as their first resort. It just appears to be incredibly backwards from my pov and I can see why we're worried about hamas being in control of palestine. Nothing but trouble can come of it, the Israelis will refuse negotiation, hamas will pretend it wants talks... bla bla bla and we're back to square one.

Just seems to be a complete lack of common sense in so many middle eastern countries its untrue. How so many people can be brainwashed into blowing themselves up.. is it me or surely the system is to blame there.. you don't see many christians, buddhists, jews etc blowing themselves up in the name of their religion. Its got to be in the education...

Tom...you think arabs love blowing up each other....are u forgeting that isreal has F-16's and nukes ....while palisteinine doesnt even have proper cars let alone sling shots....what else do you want them to do....you see them day in day out stoning the jews out of their country.....this whole blowing up thing that most of the world quickly uses to suppress us with doesnt cut it my friend........the media is a powerfull tool my friend......look into it.......i dont have the facts on me now...but i will get them clear 2moro....Almost 90 percent of amercian media...i mean tv,newspapers , magazines even fvcking flyers are owned by jews....makes u think right......controling what links the whole worlds knowledge is what they want to do....so that they can brain wash everyone to believe what they want....

really gots to sleep....peace out guys

 

[ReBeL]

one last note....

hamas has been democraticly elected by the palistinian people...i believe they will cease all attacks on isreal and wait to see how they react....also they are dealing isreal the same medicine the jews have been dealing them for years....one thing i commend them on is not recognizing Isreal as a state....it is only fair since they dont recognize Palestinine as a state either.....hammas has been good for the people they feed them,educate them,protect them and do so many other humanitary deeds.....it is about time that palestine is given the chance to grow and become an independent state that can bear arms and make deciscions like their neighbors who too are terrorssssssshhhhhhhhhh dont tell no body..... i am out

Again, your post is very accurate...

If anybody notes what Hamas did to the Palestinian people SOCIALLY, they will know that their money don't go to secret bank accounts in Tel Aviv like the corrupt past gang...

Just give the guys a chance...

 

[Hambon]

I want to come in here 2moro and read some replies to my post so that we can share our thoughts peacefully.....

 

[ReBeL]

Somehow I have to Agree about the Iraq thing.

Though American British troops are not only there to save but for petrol aswell and to change the regime in the middle east and removing all these Dictators.

Where were arabs when Saddam was killing his men and his ppl? no one did give a Bullshit or two about this. But when Americans and British decided to come in and removing him but in exchange to take some petrol(Because as we all know, nothing is for free in this world, atleast not in Politics.) Asking them to withdraw when they actually want to rebuild everything and turn it into a new country as It deserve.

About the Muslim Vs Muslim civil war I actually expected this thing to come. And instead of calming things down and try to make peace everything is turning into bad and bad.

Tom, you say you don't know why would you bother, Infact you don't know how many Iraqies out there are thanful for the American and British and all these who did give some hand in putting Saddam and his troops down. There are lot, Believe me. Just don't let media take you into somewhere else.

 

[Zé Tahir]

Rebel, I'm sportin the Palestinian flag now

 

[Tom]

Tom...you think arabs love blowing up each other....are u forgeting that isreal has F-16's and nukes ....while palisteinine doesnt even have proper cars let alone sling shots....what else do you want them to do....you see them day in day out stoning the jews out of their country.....this whole blowing up thing that most of the world quickly uses to suppress us with doesnt cut it my friend........the media is a powerfull tool my friend......look into it.......i dont have the facts on me now...but i will get them clear 2moro....Almost 90 percent of amercian media...i mean tv,newspapers , magazines even fvcking flyers are owned by jews....makes u think right......controling what links the whole worlds knowledge is what they want to do....so that they can brain wash everyone to believe what they want....

really gots to sleep....peace out guys

AMERICAN media? bothered. Don't read/listen to it. Next.

Yes, israel has F16's, nuclear technology.. so what, so do we! Doesn't mean we strap our pilots in and tell them to take as many lives as possible in the name of the lord!

 

[Azzurri7]

oh yeah....america is not done yet....they are planning to take over the whole of the M.E ...syria,iran...etc.....
..

I'm actually with taking over Syria...and the reasons are probably clear.

-The "Assad" Family should have an end. Not to forget how much the "Opposition" in Syria is growing.

-They should be allowed to have democracy just like any-other country, something they don't have since Hafez the father took the Chair.

-Punishing them for murdering Rafik Hariri on 14th of Feb 2005. Something Lebanese and the world will never forget. not to forget occupying Lebanon for almost 30years.

-They are one of the reasons Iraq thing will never end as they're supporting all the negative things that is going on....giving weapons sending men to fight etc...


Note: (Nothing against the Syrian ppl here, jus talking about their regime).

 

[Azzurri7]

You can't blame Arab countries too, because they are just colonies and they make nothing without asking their master in Washington D.C. and London...
If you kill the snake, you have to fight the head, not the stupid eggs...

Thats the whole point my friend. Arabs are never united.

Every single year they make this meeting between all the leaders in order to come up for solutions about what's going on in Palestine, all what you hear is that leaders are insulting each-others and at the end of the day all they care about is the Chair.