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  1. Tomice

    Israeli-Palestinian conflict

    First there is nothing to forgive. Your point are valid and those are things I consistently weigh, unconsciously as well. I think in the balance of practicality and morality we are at an acceptable level if far from ideal. The army does not make the policy, without it we have no right to exist...
  2. Tomice

    Israeli-Palestinian conflict

    For you as an outsider this is just another round of hostilities between us an hamas. They shoot some missles, we shot back. For us this time is different, the pardigam has chenged. This was not about resistance to occupation, it was the face of evil coming to eradicate us. Cutting a pregnant...
  3. Tomice

    Israeli-Palestinian conflict

    First I never claimed moral high ground on the Palestinian issue. I have vastly superior moral high ground on Hamas and I know it first hand. Thinking they are freedom fighters the way they have done things is unfathomable to me. Secondly, I don't endores it, I acknowledge it. I'm part of a...
  4. Tomice

    Israeli-Palestinian conflict

    And I will never defend the settlement enterprise either. But as that UN guy said, it also didn't happen in a vaccum. And I'll guess we will have to disagree on what is the issue at the moment. I simply can't see you having a case there
  5. Tomice

    Israeli-Palestinian conflict

    But Hamas is the issue at the moment, hence your deflecting lol
  6. Tomice

    Israeli-Palestinian conflict

    Then they should have accepted the offeres they were offered no? Those that you so easily ignore in all your arguments like they didn't happen
  7. Tomice

    Israeli-Palestinian conflict

    There is no public support for a renewed offer, there hasn't been one the last decade. Unfourtently. Israelies have become disillusioned with the peace process. Rightly or not. Also there are internal politics in play that prevent Bibi from forming a coalition with the center-left block that...
  8. Tomice

    Israeli-Palestinian conflict

    Sure lol, You are the one deflecting. The only case you are building is a case for a terrorist organisation and an Iranian proxy with the explicit aim of a complete genocide. I never will dispute claims of ethnic cleansing, never have. Never said Israel didn't violate "international law". I...
  9. Tomice

    Israeli-Palestinian conflict

    Lol. Self awareness not found
  10. Tomice

    Israeli-Palestinian conflict

    Gaza is not occupied, the west Bank is. HRW has very low credibility regarding this issues https://web.archive.org/web/20230525125721/https://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/20/opinion/20bernstein.html?_r=1&em
  11. Tomice

    Israeli-Palestinian conflict

    It's not. You are deducing wrongly. Or im not making myself clear. First I'm not asking anyone to back us, if they want to or we can convince them to, I'll take it, foolish to do otherwise. It's a legitimate manuver that the other side uses just as well. I do belive whoever of us another...
  12. Tomice

    Israeli-Palestinian conflict

    I understand your meaning and I agree. Im sure your intention is good but Im not angry or mad. I said it at the start, Im just sad and I truly wish we wouldn't have goten to this point. But the train left the station that Saturday. Maybe this will be a wakeup call for both to end the endless...
  13. Tomice

    Israeli-Palestinian conflict

    I'll avoid using platitudes
  14. Tomice

    Israeli-Palestinian conflict

    What is this international community you talk about? The UN? Where the arab block and it's dependants African countries dominate the votes? Where the human right council includes UAE, Sudan, Qatar, Cuba and others? The same UN who passed more resolutions against Israel then against the whole...
  15. Tomice

    Israeli-Palestinian conflict

    Oh great European master, thank you for letting us exist. If you can't back up your argument with any facts or stats I see no point in debating further. All you offer as counterpoint is patronising attitude typical of western europeans. You do you man
  16. Tomice

    Israeli-Palestinian conflict

    Agree. We had shity leadership for the last 15 years or so. I'm hopefull that will change in the near future.
  17. Tomice

    Israeli-Palestinian conflict

    I never said we dont need anyone, I said we have other options if suddenly the US and the west abandon us. Regarding energy, which is my field of work I will just say you are wrong. We have huge reserve of natural gas and in house capabilities and resources to build nucler power plants if we...
  18. Tomice

    Israeli-Palestinian conflict

    What resources are we soaking up? We get nothing for free. it is a bit of a jewish trope no?
  19. Tomice

    Israeli-Palestinian conflict

    It's your version of the truth, with all due respect. If your starting point is that Israel doesn't want peace then that explain the rest of your narrative. We will not agree on that. Fact is they were offered fair peace offers several times and rejected them. How long will you ask a girl out...
  20. Tomice

    Israeli-Palestinian conflict

    You are in an echo chamber. Everything you wrote has nothing to do with anything I said. You can dehumanize and be dehumanised yourself, it's not mutually exclusive.