US Presidential Elections thread - the fate of the world to be decided (173 Viewers)

Who would you vote to be the next President of the United States?

  • John McCain

  • Barack Obama

  • undecided

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Bjerknes

Bjerknes

"Top Economist"
#2,341
Mar 16, 2004
111,702
#2,341
I'm the party loser tonight, watching this stuff while people play pong. But I'd rather watch this and get drunk than play that crap. Too many people don't really give a shit about various topics, and hence why this country is going to hell.
 

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Enron

Enron

Tickle Me
Moderator
#2,349
Oct 11, 2005
75,253
#2,349
LetsBrushYourTeeth said:
As much as I like Obama, he is wrong on the "energy crisis" and the 2nd Amendment. He needs to be more against the latter.
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Meh, let the rednecks have their guns. As for the energy crisis, don't expect much from either candidate. Neither wants that anti-them Exxon add running on every TV across the country.

If you're really interested Obama has a pretty in depth PDF on his website concerning the environment, energy and all that. Campaigns are all about appeasement, these guys have to appease everyone while trying to be "individuals". Tough job.
 
Bjerknes

Bjerknes

"Top Economist"
#2,350
Mar 16, 2004
111,702
#2,350
A lot of bullshit in his speech tonight, such as the, "everybody envies us" line. But this is the stuff that the idiots need to hear to give the vote. But like I said before, every President needs to say this crap, just like they need to speak in front of that Goddamn Jewish lobbying group that funds killing innocent people. This shit is all a facade, but I will still vote for Obama because he can do some good.
 
Bjerknes

Bjerknes

"Top Economist"
#2,351
Mar 16, 2004
111,702
#2,351
Enron said:
Meh, let the rednecks have their guns. As for the energy crisis, don't expect much from either candidate. Neither wants that anti-them Exxon add running on every TV across the country.

If you're really interested Obama has a pretty in depth PDF on his website concerning the environment, energy and all that. Campaigns are all about appeasement, these guys have to appease everyone while trying to be "individuals". Tough job.
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Cracking down on speculators is a joke, Enron.
 
Bjerknes

Bjerknes

"Top Economist"
#2,353
Mar 16, 2004
111,702
#2,353
If people blame speculators, then you have blame the whole free market economy. At the NYMEX it's a zero sum game. For every winner, there is a loser. Economics is precise with this shit.
 
Bjerknes

Bjerknes

"Top Economist"
#2,354
Mar 16, 2004
111,702
#2,354
Enron said:
So you aren't going to vote for Obama?
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Of course I am going to vote for him, because financial markets right now are not of my greatest concern. The general state of our finances are instead. But what he says about the crude markets is just stuff to get him elected IMHO.
 
Bjerknes

Bjerknes

"Top Economist"
#2,357
Mar 16, 2004
111,702
#2,357
Enron said:
I'm not watching the speech. So you've really left me with the talk of speculators and the economy.
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He just alluded to this stuff before, which I have called out. I find this stuff much like supporting a club. I'll be happy to give you a breakdown once I'm back at my place... Berb's keys dont work worth a shit. I think he jizzed on all of them :(
 
Bjerknes

Bjerknes

"Top Economist"
#2,359
Mar 16, 2004
111,702
#2,359
Enron said:
I'm not watching the speech. So you've really left me with the talk of speculators and the economy.
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It happens like this, Eazy. On the New York Mercantile Exchange, where crude futures are foremost traded, insider trading is LEGAL. This may strike you as something that is absolutely absurd, but once you dive into the dynamics of the exchange, it makes more sense.

Speculators on the NYMEX partake in a zero sum game. This means that for every winner, there is a loser. Market manipulation is impossible here because the person you are trading with has a margin account with NYMEX and is trying to trade for their benefit of his own party. If someone in cahoots trades with his partner, their net payout would be zero. If someone from a futures broker calls in an order to a broker on the pits of the crude exchange and asks to buy at 140 when the spot price is 142 with futures at 143, nobody on the counter party is going to accept that deal because it loses about 3 units on the contract. No other counter party is either dumb enough to accept a deal or dumb enough to try to work in cahoots with the counter party, as it would end up in a loss. That's the point of this market - for every winner there is a loser.

So the firms trying to manipulate the market in the NYMEX pits would ALWAYS break even in this manipulative scenario, as far as my understanding goes. I think Canardo could add insight to this, so he can chime in if he wants.

Now market manipulation on the ICE (Intercontinental Commodity Exchange) might be possible, considering whenever somebody buys a lot of contracts in something the price will rise. But if someone buys a lot of contracts in one asset, that will be known to the world. People will check out the volume of trades and figure out what is going on pretty quickly (actually not people, but computer programs). So the scheme will be dead pretty soon after it's implemented. They will pressure the market to go short just like they did against LTCM, which saw its downfall in around 2000.

So Obama "cracking down" on speculators is not exactly the problem. The problem is supply and demand across the globe which raises prices due to basic economics. The market moves on economic reports, supply levels, politics, and OPEC meetings. I personally believe all else is nonsense because the market would not work.
 
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