The Lebanese political crisis!!! (18 Viewers)

[snoop6]

Ok, Azzurri...

Seeing that you say that all the responsibility is on the Palestinians in Lebanon, could you please tell me what they can do to look better to you??

1- The people in camps were not armed after the resistants have left Lebanon in 80s, and you know what the christian gangs and Amal party did to them exploiting their armless situation. Don't tell me that they should throw their arms and give them to the Lebanese army, because all of us know that that army is a big joke that can't protect itself... We all saw how they received the Israeli army in their camp during the latest war, and they didn't do anything except making tea for the occupiers... If they throw their arms, they will suffer more massacres because of the hatred between the christians to them since they moved to Lebanon...(Don't tell me that Lebanese christians hate palestinians there because of things done by those Palestinians. Maybe, it increased the tension, but the first reason was that just because the palestinian population whan moving to Lebanon affected the christian percentage in the country and they are still scared that if the Palestinians will stay there, they will be a minority and lose their positions in the state...

2- If you want them to go back to Palestine, how can that happen??

-Peacefully, we tried the peaceful approach, and Israel is not ready at all to discuss the file of the refugees...

-Using resistance: we all know how no Palestinian can shoot a bullet from the Lebanese borders, and I understand that because Lebanese in the south have suffered enough...

3- If you want them to get the lebanese nationality, neither them nor Lebanese will agree because that will delete their dream of coming back to their homecountry & will affect the sectorial percentages in that country...

4- I know that many of them are immigrating to North & South America & Australia, so it will be good for all the parties to facilitate that...

5- In the end, you know that the normal Palestinian person doesn't have greeds in the Lebanese lands itself, but he has no another place to go, and he has to protect himself from those who want a small chance to get his head in his camp...

Seriously, If a country welcomes your refugees, who gave you the fuckin right to kill their people huh?

I will agree with the guys here about the Palestinians in Lebanon, they did every ugliness that could be done. Lebanese have the ultimate right to kick them out of Lebanon, or feel some hatred towards them..

Rebel, sometimes you have to accept the facts, don't ever become a blind, you will lose respect.. there are also some Palestinians in Syria that makes troubles too, of course not as much as what's going on in Lebanon, thanx to the powerful/controlling regime here (not that I am supporting them..), I had asked the same questions too, what the fuck are they trying to do in a country that they don't even belong..

 

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[ReBeL]

If you live outside Lebanon, you have no right to say that Hizballah are doing the right thing! When Hizballah allow the country to be destroyed, you have no right to talk because its us who live in the country who have to live with the consequences. It's very easy to support a raging bull in a glasshouse as long as youre not in that glasshouse. You have no right to say that the protests are justified when it is us who have to live in absolute horror 24/7. If Saniora and Harriri are gonna bring foreign Investment into the country and create more jobs for me and others then sorry for being selfish but it's pretty obvious where my support will go!

I totally understand that, mate...

I think anybody in this world has his own priorities, and that's the problem of the region...

Anyway, speaking about visa refusal, I once studied hardly for CPA exam, and this exam can't be attended in any place except USA, so I asked for a visa...

They directly refused it, and I asked about the reason, and it was nothing but because of the birthplace of my father...

And they want me to go on in my life as if nothing happened...

 

[Boudz]

I totally understand that, mate...

I think anybody in this world has his own priorities, and that's the problem of the region...

Anyway, speaking about visa refusal, I once studied hardly for CPA exam, and this exam can't be attended in any place except USA, so I asked for a visa...

They directly refused it, and I asked about the reason, and it was nothing but because of the birthplace of my father...

And they want me to go on in my life as if nothing happened...

That really sucks! How do they expect a Palestinian to become stronger and be able to be successful? Sometimes it seems to be a whole conspiracy. But when an Arab country does the same $hit, thats what really pisses me off.

 

[Slagathor]

I totally understand that, mate...

I think anybody in this world has his own priorities, and that's the problem of the region...

Anyway, speaking about visa refusal, I once studied hardly for CPA exam, and this exam can't be attended in any place except USA, so I asked for a visa...

They directly refused it, and I asked about the reason, and it was nothing but because of the birthplace of my father...

And they want me to go on in my life as if nothing happened...

Yeah racism is fun that way. I remember walking the streets in Southern Italy, some car drove by and people shouted at me something along the lines of "Fucking Russian, go home". People on the street were all looking at me like they were thinking the same but just didn't want to say it :undecide: "There's the Russian, get him"

If I wanted people to stop looking at me with disgust I had to walk the streets wearing a Dutch national team "Van Basten" jersey.

Hey, maybe you could paint your face white next time you want a visa?

 

[ReBeL]

Seriously, If a country welcomes your refugees, who gave you the fuckin right to kill their people huh?

I will agree with the guys here about the Palestinians in Lebanon, they did every ugliness that could be done. Lebanese have the ultimate right to kick them out of Lebanon, or feel some hatred towards them..

Rebel, sometimes you have to accept the facts, don't ever become a blind, you will lose respect.. there are also some Palestinians in Syria that makes troubles too, of course not as much as what's going on in Lebanon, thanx to the powerful/controlling regime here (not that I am supporting them..), I had asked the same questions too, what the fuck are they trying to do in a country that they don't even belong..

I understand that, snoop...

And I don't say that we are a group of angels because simply if we were people without any idiots, we would have found a solution for our country's problem...

My point is:

You have to give the normal Palestinian person an indicator to let him know his destiny in whatever country.. He can't be a refugee or a half-cetizen for thousands of years to come...

Either throw him out of the country or give him the whole damn citizenship...

Don't treat him like somebody inferior just because of the origin of his ancestors...I agree that some palestinians did things harmful to the neighbour countries, but what's the fault of the majority of innocent people who just want nothing but to live their life....

 

[ReBeL]

Yeah racism is fun that way. I remember walking the streets in Southern Italy, some car drove by and people shouted at me something along the lines of "Fucking Russian, go home". People on the street were all looking at me like they were thinking the same but just didn't want to say it :undecide: "There's the Russian, get him"

If I wanted people to stop looking at me with disgust I had to walk the streets wearing a Dutch national team "Van Basten" jersey.

Hey, maybe you could paint your face white next time you want a visa?

That is a nice suggestion, Erik, but the problem is that I'm a blonde guy already, so what can I do more??

 

[Slagathor]

That is a nice suggestion, Erik, but the problem is that I'm a blonde guy already, so what can I do more??

Oh really? Well that's just outrageous then

 

[JCK]

I totally understand that, mate...

I think anybody in this world has his own priorities, and that's the problem of the region...

Anyway, speaking about visa refusal, I once studied hardly for CPA exam, and this exam can't be attended in any place except USA, so I asked for a visa...

They directly refused it, and I asked about the reason, and it was nothing but because of the birthplace of my father...

And they want me to go on in my life as if nothing happened...

You can sit for the CPA in Canada though

Here's some food for thought

http://www.alseyassah.com/alseyassah/First_12.asp

And the translation

>SANA: Syrian National News Agency Inquires About Pierre Gemayel's
>Assassination 55 mins Before it Occurs!!
>
>Al Seyassah daily learned from authoritative sources in Beirut, that
>one of the editors of the Syrian National News Agency (SANA) placed
>a phone call to a pro-Syrian Lebanese newspaper at 3:05 pm on
>Tuesday. The caller inquired about the details of the assassination
>of Lebanese Minister for Industry Pierre Gemayel, raising eyebrows
>at the Lebanese newpaper. The timing of phone call was 55 minutes
>before the assassination was carried out.
>
>Ten minutes after the call was place, the Syrian editor placed
>another phone call in order to apologize for a misunderstanding.

 

[Boudz]

i heard about that, wow!!

 

[Rami]

Excellent point! And the fact that he's using Nasrallah as a propoganda tool and every Shia believe his bullshit and are singing "GENERAL!!" is also hilarious.

Sorry if I sound selfish, but all I want from this government is the peace of mind that I have a steady job that can help me build for my future and that maybe one day when i start a family i can take care of them. I know these are selfish aspirations and are unheard of but excuse me if I'm sick of politicians having an influence on the way my life goes.

And don't get me started with Arabs. Their leaders are the most hypocritical liars and sleazeballs to ever exist. They talk about how they care for the Palestinian cause and their people. Fvck that shit, I'm a Palestinian, I've graduated from one of the best universities in the region and nothing diffrentiates me from the people i graduated with except that my passport is a little different. I got a very good job offer in Saudi with a great starting salary. I was very excited to start my career. You would think a "fellow" arab with a good degree should have no problem finding a job EHHHHH!!!! WRONG!!!! My visa was rejected 3 FVCKING times because i'm Palestinian, while my very good friend who has the lebanese passport was granted a visa to the very same company. Apparently I'm not allowed to enter Kuwait, Qatar, Jordan, and Egypt!!!! And they talk about Arab solidarity.

Oh just to add, my mother is Lebanese and I'm not allowed to get the Lebanese passport.

I'm sick and tired of running my life by the political agenda of the a$$hole who was chosen to represent me.

And one more thing:
If you live outside Lebanon, you have no right to say that Hizballah are doing the right thing! When Hizballah allow the country to be destroyed, you have no right to talk because its us who live in the country who have to live with the consequences. It's very easy to support a raging bull in a glasshouse as long as youre not in that glasshouse. You have no right to say that the protests are justified when it is us who have to live in absolute horror 24/7. If Saniora and Harriri are gonna bring foreign Investment into the country and create more jobs for me and others then sorry for being selfish but it's pretty obvious where my support will go!

Ya thats a shame really. I have a Palestinian friend that dreams about getting a masters in "encryption sciences" but he is denied because he is palestinian. And the kid is a genious!!

About the Arab leaders...what arab leaders? You mean "Aznab al-ba8ar"???

 

[Rami]

If this thread shows anything, it shows how effective the "divide and conqouer" strategy is....Lebaneese, Palestinians, and Syrians have more things in common than not. Even more than A west coast Saudi and East coast Saudi....

All I see here is fighthing because of imaginary lines...sorry guys, thats my stance since the beggining and not gonna change it...

 

[Igal]

TBH, I wouldn't mind that, Infact I'd love It, though many would now call me a traitor, but thats the only way to see Lebanon rising from their econimical situation and many other things.

Just take a look at Jordan and Egypt, they're financially supported by Israel, not to also mention that nor Syria or Iran can ever mess around with the likes of these countries due to their relationship with Israel.

I'm 100% with the peace agreement with Israel, not from economical view only, but also to rebuild a relation between us and them. A relation that can help both countries forget their past and focus on the present and future.

Many now would say, how could you say that when they killed children, women etc etc, my answer is simple, they actually did kill our people few months ago, they also did hit our building where I was living, but thats thanks to Hezbollah. Another thing is that why shouldn't we make peace agreement? hell, France and Germany were more than enemies during World War, take a look at them now.

I wouldn't also mind peace agreement with Syria, but thats only when Bashar and his CO will be brought down, just like Saddam.

I hear ya and I'm so totally with ya, so much agree with that statement! :toast:

 

[ThePLaya]

This Thread really Bull sh***t... i can see only contradictions... excuse me ?

 

[Azzurri7]

Seeing that you say that all the responsibility is on the Palestinians in Lebanon, could you please tell me what they can do to look better to you??

I don't put all the responsibility on the Palestinians in our country, but surely they take part of It.

Things they can do to look better to our community and not only to me:

1- Give up their weapons....(And remmber I'm even asking Hezbollah to give up their weapons why wouldn't I ask strangers to do that??)

2- Respect the law and rules of our country just like Armenians do.

3- Respect our army...Incase you also didn't know about this, 6Lebanese soldiers have been killed by Palestinian refugees since 1year n half now.

4- The majority of them do work with the Syrian secret service, this should be also stopped.

and so on...If they atleast can do 3 out of the 4 I mentioned, I'd be more than welcome as a Lebanese to accept them in my country.

1- The people in camps were not armed after the resistants have left Lebanon in 80s, and you know what the christian gangs and Amal party did to them exploiting their armless situation. Don't tell me that they should throw their arms and give them to the Lebanese army, because all of us know that that army is a big joke that can't protect itself... We all saw how they received the Israeli army in their camp during the latest war, and they didn't do anything except making tea for the occupiers... If they throw their arms, they will suffer more massacres because of the hatred between the christians to them since they moved to Lebanon...(Don't tell me that Lebanese christians hate palestinians there because of things done by those Palestinians. Maybe, it increased the tension, but the first reason was that just because the palestinian population whan moving to Lebanon affected the christian percentage in the country and they are still scared that if the Palestinians will stay there, they will be a minority and lose their positions in the state...

So palestinians should keep their arms just in-order to protect themselves from Amal and Christians?? Please Reb, Civil war has been over and since 1990 no militia did attack another militia or party. I don't think Christians nor Amal would be really Idiots to cause another battle/war in Lebanon. we've had enough.

And about recieving Israeli's in the south and giving them Tea, I don't really see what's your problem with that? As far as I know It was the Lebanese soldier who gave him the cup of tea not palestinian.

And lets stop with the "Lebanese Army" is a joke...Do you expect them to change 360 in a night??? Syrian secret service did damage our army, and It'll take us time to rebuild a strong one. Everything can be done in a time, It's not like you become footballer when you're just born. Lets give them a chance ffs can we?

2- If you want them to go back to Palestine, how can that happen??

Right now It can't happen, probably in the future, all I want from them as a Lebanese to behave and respect the land they're living in. Is it too much?

C'mon Rebel, you pretty much know how I was defending the Palestinians in the other thread Vs what Israeli were doing...from killing, raping to stealing and etc...
I didn't accept this thing to happen in a country that I have no roots to, how can I accept this to happen to my country??

I have nothing against Palestinians in general, Infact I do have couple of friends, and I think what I'm asking is pretty normal.

3- If you want them to get the lebanese nationality, neither them nor Lebanese will agree because that will delete their dream of coming back to their homecountry & will affect the sectorial percentages in that country...

There's no way they can get the Lebanese nationality, they're already 500.000 atleast in 10452 km2, I'd rather replace welcome 500.000 Lebanese who are living abroad...not to also forget that these ppl do really want to return to their country, and I know It as I do also know several palestinians in Beirut.

5- In the end, you know that the normal Palestinian person doesn't have greeds in the Lebanese lands itself, but he has no another place to go, and he has to protect himself from those who want a small chance to get his head in his camp...

I repeat I doubt anyone wanting a Palestinian head, this would cause another civil war, something we Lebanese are not looking for.

However, I appreciate the way you replied to me this time, unlike your first post where you did attack me personally.

 

[Azzurri7]

This Thread really Bull sh***t... i can see only contradictions... excuse me ?

This thread is clean so far. Please.

 

[ReBeL]

I think I got your points, Rab, and I guess most of them are valid...

About the problems made by Palestinians in Lebanon, I'm so sorry to read that, but I'm not surprised knowing that we have some of those reputation-destroyers also in the Palestinian lands... Those don't represent the whole population at all, and they don't do anything for the good of the people, but for their individualistic selfish needs...

Anyway, pardon me for being aggressive somehow in my first post, but I was annoyed with the generalization for all the Palestinians in Lebanon...

Thanks...

 

[Azzurri7]

int:

 

[Layce Erayce]

Andy, I'm not a Lebanese and I didn't comment on the domestic issues of Lebanon because of that, but denying the others right to be Lebanese just because you have a different opinion with them is just a wrong thing IMO...

Lebanon is known for its very varied group of people, and you can see that in this forum. As rhizoid said, Hezbollah are not an isolated group in Lebanon, at least currently. They are allied with Michelle Oun (Christian), Nabeeh Barri (Shiia), Omar Karami (Sunni), Suleiman Franjeyyeh (Christian) & Talal Arslan (Durzi)...

So, they have something in common with many groups in Lebanon regardless the religion of each fraction...

ReBeL, what is wrong with developing stronger economic/political ties with Israel? I'm assuming its just virulent hatred against Israel?

 

[Slagathor]

If this thread shows anything, it shows how effective the "divide and conqouer" strategy is....Lebaneese, Palestinians, and Syrians have more things in common than not. Even more than A west coast Saudi and East coast Saudi....

All I see here is fighthing because of imaginary lines...sorry guys, thats my stance since the beggining and not gonna change it...

All divides are psychological, that's not new. There is no difference between a white man and a black man other than the type of sunscreen they have to buy.

Doesn't mean these 'fake' differences can be overcome so easily.

Especially not when, such as in the Middle East, there are no foundations for improvement. Europe didn't unite and leave war behind until wealth reached all layers of society. And Europe is a continent whose peoples are so deeply intertwined that for every difference between population groups you could point out two similarities.

When it comes down to it, people are only willing to drop their arms and stop fighting once they have too much to lose. The key to peace is wealth. Not education, not freedom, not human rights and it sure as hell isn't dialogue.

It's wealth. Money.

And that, is the sorrow of mankind.

 

[ReBeL]

ReBeL, what is wrong with developing stronger economic/political ties with Israel? I'm assuming its just virulent hatred against Israel?

I gave examples in other posts in this thread for how the countries who signed some agreements with Israel, got nothing for their economy or their people...