The Holocaust (23 Viewers)

[Seven]

We are suggested to control it at the same time. Then again, religion does tend to contradict itself on a regular basis. I've always found that very funny. It's such a weak theory that it even contradicts itself. I mean, that's bad. That's really really bad.

 

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[Martin]

Ah yes, that is true. To make a statement but contradict it in your signature is a rookie mistake

 

[Zé Tahir]

I doubt that, but at least you've refuted Seven's point that you would never try to make him not criticize Islam

Guys, we have carte blanche arty:

You know Ze I wish we'd be on the same side of an argument more often, it's fun to share a laugh :wink:

We both love Juve, isn't that enough?

Ah yes, that is true. To make a statement but contradict it in your signature is a rookie mistake

Look who's talking

 

[Seven]

You also both like cookies and pussy.

 

[Martin]

We both love Juve, isn't that enough?

Are you saying you don't mind when I laugh at you? Because there are times..

Look who's talking

What are you talking about? Do I write "I'm right" in my posts?

 

[Fred]

Much respect to Martin,as he has never resorted to name calling EVER when it comes to religious debates.

Much respect. I hate it when people say that we attack Seven and Bes because we don't like our belief system questioned. Yet Martin almost never gets insulted in these discussions and he holds them more than Seven and Bes, Alen to a lesser extent has joined these arguments too, and i don't remember anyone insulting him either. A lot of religous people turn discussions into insults when their belief system is questioned, i'll admit that. But that's mostly the ignorant, close minded ones.


In a nutshell, Seven is just as intolerant, biased, close minded and arrogant as the religious people he so much loathes.

 

[Alen]

the number of female converts are far more than the males.

This isn't surprising at all.
The women usually convert into islam due to love, marriage. They fall in love with a muslim guy and in order to get married many of them turn muslim.
Men who convert to Islam do it for another reason. They do it only because they really accept Islam as their religion. Because they were convinced it's the right religion.
I can't prove it, of course, but i'm 100% sure that huge majority of those women who convert to Islam don't feel muslim at all.

If the muslim women knew that they'd had absolutely no problem if they marry a non-muslim guy and change religion, they'd have done it too.

 

[Zé Tahir]

Are you saying you don't mind when I laugh at you? Because there are times..

You laugh at me?

What are you talking about? Do I write "I'm right" in my posts?

And I never said "eliminate your Islamophobia"

 

[Fred]

This isn't surprising at all.
The women usually convert into islam due to love, marriage. They fall in love with a muslim guy and in order to get married many of them turn muslim.
Men who convert to Islam do it for another reason. They do it only because they really accept Islam as their religion. Because they were convinced it's the right religion.
I can't prove it, of course, but i'm 100% sure that huge majority of those women who convert to Islam don't feel muslim at all.

If the muslim women knew that they'd had absolutely no problem if they marry a non-muslim guy and change religion, they'd have done it too.

No, actually a Muslim man can marry a Christian or a Jew woman. So woman do not have to convert in order to marry a muslim man. Nor is their any obligation on the males part to make that woman convert.

And that really is too much of a simplistic argument to make to justify that stat.

 

[Eddy]

Yeah, lots of cases like that in Dubai, but it's also with muslim women changing to Christianity too.

 

[Enron]

Yeah the ghostbusters have far more credibilty.

That reminds me of the beach camping trip I had last weekend. One of my boys is marrying into a jewish family. Probably Zionists, but nice people nonetheless.

Apparently they are smashing the cup, but he refuses the chair ride. Anyway she said a funny jewish joke, and a friend of mine said something about WII. As the families aren't too friendly. Our buddy's last name is Kohler, so he was like the wedding will be like a combination of the bombing of Dresden and Auschwitz or something sleazy like that.

So I said, with that many Jews and Germans getting together you know it's going to be a "gas".

 

[Alen]

No, actually a Muslim man can marry a Christian or a Jew woman. So woman do not have to convert in order to marry a muslim man. Nor is their any obligation on the males part to make that woman convert.

And that really is too much of a simplistic argument to make to justify that stat.

Would you marry a non-Muslim girl?
Lets just say that you fall in love with a non-muslim girl. You love her, she loves you.
Will you marry her if she won't convert? But i want an honest answer.

 

[Zé Tahir]

This isn't surprising at all.
The women usually convert into islam due to love, marriage. They fall in love with a muslim guy and in order to get married many of them turn muslim.
Men who convert to Islam do it for another reason. They do it only because they really accept Islam as their religion. Because they were convinced it's the right religion.
I can't prove it, of course, but i'm 100% sure that huge majority of those women who convert to Islam don't feel muslim at all.

If the muslim women knew that they'd had absolutely no problem if they marry a non-muslim guy and change religion, they'd have done it too.

What a ridiculous outlandish statement Alen. You're no better than crazy Muslim clergymen running around declaring other Muslims as infidels.

How the hell do you know how they feel? These aren't Muslim women from the third world that you can just label oppressed and then conclude that they've been forced to convert mind you. These are women born and raised in the West; a product of your 'free, tolerant, and secularist' society.

How can someone possible be forced to marry a Muslim man in their own backyard? Will they be beheaded if they don't? Will these women be ridiculed by their families if they don't? On the contrary, their conversion leads to problems with their families and their friends.

 

[Red]

That reminds me of the beach camping trip I had last weekend. One of my boys is marrying into a jewish family. Probably Zionists, but nice people nonetheless.

Apparently they are smashing the cup, but he refuses the chair ride. Anyway she said a funny jewish joke, and a friend of mine said something about WII. As the families aren't too friendly. Our buddy's last name is Kohler, so he was like the wedding will be like a combination of the bombing of Dresden and Auschwitz or something sleazy like that.

So I said, with that many Jews and Germans getting together you know it's going to be a "gas".

I'm disgusted.

 

[Alen]

No, i know this for sure. I know many non-muslim women who became muslim and i know why did all of them (without an exception) do it.
I know many muslim men and muslim girls. I know how all of them feel about islam.

You could call it a coincidence and you might be right. Although the number is big enough for me to conclude that it isn't a coincidence.

Love (for a man) comes before religion for most of the women. We, men, on the other hand are more stupid, more conceited, more vain.

 

[Fred]

Would you marry a non-Muslim girl?
Lets just say that you fall in love with a non-muslim girl. You love her, she loves you.
Will you marry her if she won't convert? But i want an honest answer.

You see i wouldn't even marry a non Libyan muslim girl if you're asking about me

 

[Fred]

No, i know this for sure. I know many non-muslim women who became muslim and i know why did all of them (without an exception) do it.
I know many muslim men and muslim girls. I know how all of them feel about islam.

You could call it a coincidence and you might be right. Although the number is big enough for me to conclude that it isn't a coincidence.

Love (for a man) comes before religion for most of the women. We, men, on the other hand are more stupid, more conceited, more vain.

Whatever the number of people you know, its still a rash generalization to make.

 

[Martin]

Much respect. I hate it when people say that we attack Seven and Bes because we don't like our belief system questioned. Yet Martin almost never gets insulted in these discussions and he holds them more than Seven and Bes, Alen to a lesser extent has joined these arguments too, and i don't remember anyone insulting him either. A lot of religous people turn discussions into insults when their belief system is questioned, i'll admit that. But that's mostly the ignorant, close minded ones.

There is a problem here. Religious people like to set things up so that the slightest criticism of their beliefs is already "offensive". They define it as something that cannot be discussed openly, debated, subjected to the same analysis as other issues.

Now, if that's the attitude you bright forth, then any comment that isn't positive becomes an offense. In other words, a plea saying "please don't offend me" is impossible to meet, because that precludes discussion.

Now you may say oh you're generalizing and it's just people who are sensitive about their religion who make such unreasonable demands. There are lots of religious people who don't mind looking critically at their beliefs. Yes, but these people sit quietly and say nothing. They do not stand up and say "it's okay to criticize my religion". Why, because that would be offending those sensitive people who can't take it. So in fact having these oversensitive people around prevents the conversation that could be had with the so called moderates.

 

[Fred]

There is a problem here. Religious people like to set things up so that the slightest criticism of their beliefs is already "offensive". They define it as something that cannot be discussed openly, debated, subjected to the same analysis as other issues.

Now, if that's the attitude you bright forth, then any comment that isn't positive becomes an offense. In other words, a plea saying "please don't offend me" is impossible to meet, because that precludes discussion.

Now you may say oh you're generalizing and it's just people who are sensitive about their religion who make such unreasonable demands. There are lots of religious people who don't mind looking critically at their beliefs. Yes, but these people sit quietly and say nothing. They do not stand up and say "it's okay to criticize my religion". Why, because that would be offending those sensitive people who can't take it. So in fact having these oversensitive people around prevents the conversation that could be had with the so called moderates.

So how come you've rarely had people offended by your arguments around here?

 

[Lawnchair Bes]

You see i wouldn't even marry a non Libyan muslim girl if you're asking about me

the top three women i have gotten best along with because we had the most in common, no particular order

-chinese from origin, born in canada
-persian recent immigrant (atheist) (what i imagine hoori to be like )
-candian, with english origins