Summer Mercato Thread 2020-21 (58 Viewers)

Bianconero81

Ageing Veteran
Contributor
Jan 26, 2009
28,316
Chain Smoking Cancer staying beyond next season is a disgusting thought. We should have never hired him in the first place.

Sideways moves don't only occur when signing players but coaches too. In the case of Chain Smoking Cancer replacing Allegri, it wasn't even a sideways move - it was a blatant downgrade!

Hiring a 60 year old stubborn mule who lacks flexibility should have never been a go to option.
 
Apr 16, 2017
7,559
Chain Smoking Cancer staying beyond next season is a disgusting thought. We should have never hired him in the first place.

Sideways moves don't only occur when signing players but coaches too. In the case of Chain Smoking Cancer replacing Allegri, it wasn't even a sideways move - it was a blatant downgrade!

Hiring a 60 year old stubborn mule who lacks flexibility should have never been a go to option.
Well here we are. Deal with it
 

Bianconero81

Ageing Veteran
Contributor
Jan 26, 2009
28,316
Well here we are. Deal with it
Do you see me not dealing with it? One is allowed to express an opinion - it's a forum after all.

I just hope we don't extend his contract.

- - - Updated - - -

We should target quality players, regardless of system. We didn't give Allegri players to fit a particular system, and he did exceptionally well for us, his final season apart.

I don't see why we should be gifting this incompetent upstart players to fit his system, only to be stuck with them once he moves on.
 
Apr 16, 2017
7,559
Do you see me not dealing with it? One is allowed to express an opinion - it's a forum after all.

I just hope we don't extend his contract.

- - - Updated - - -

We should target quality players, regardless of system. We didn't give Allegri players to fit a particular system, and he did exceptionally well for us, his final season apart.

I don't see why we should be gifting this incompetent upstart players to fit his system, only to be stuck with them once he moves on.
It was a mistake not giving Allegri the players he wanted, and we shouldnt continue doing so with Sarri. Otherwise how are you gonna judge the man? I feel bad for Allegri the management destroyed his team. Instead of improving the team management made it worse. The team in final vs Barca had no major weaknesses, we were unlucky MSN and Xavi/Iniesta were having an excellent season.
 

Bianconero81

Ageing Veteran
Contributor
Jan 26, 2009
28,316
Lets just say I'm not too impressed thus far, but he's new to the role and during a once in a century global event, so we'll see how things are two or three summers from now.
You're willing to give him 3 summers? :shocked: :scared: You're a very generous man.

I am not an admirer of the triumvirate of ultimate fuckery (Czech Cyst, Tumorous Tootsie and CSC aka Chain Smoking Canceh).

- - - Updated - - -

I would go for Zaniolo and Tonali.
Keep Matuidi,Bentancur and Pjanic

Sell Alex Sandro
Keep De Sciglio as Back up

 
Jun 17, 2011
18,216
You're willing to give him 3 summers? :shocked: :scared: You're a very generous man.

I am not an admirer of the triumvirate of ultimate fuckery (Czech Cyst, Tumorous Tootsie and CSC aka Chain Smoking Canceh).

- - - Updated - - -




I was going to say "one or two", but I thought about it and it might not be fair considering the economic fallout that's going to hit from the pandemic. The guy seems to get these obsessions with players though, first was Lukaku and now I guess he has moved onto Arthur.

:lol: Your ability to think of nicknames is unmatched.
 

s4tch

¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Contributor
Mar 23, 2015
11,973
Imo vidal is the best mid that ever played for us, not only for his skill set but especially for his mentality in this day and age.
Hear me out, i think a big problem in football nowadays is players ego, it is extremely hard to get everyone to play for the team, i think the only team that's so big that it is an ego killer of sorts is real madrid, no player is bigger than real Madrid, juventus is the same for italian players. Gone are the days where Ferguson or moggi would put the fear of God in the players hearts, why do you think conte goes for the giaccherinis of this world.
If you look at the winners over the last ten years:
Barca: core that play together forever, and maybe only neymar comes up as the toxic type to fuck a team up, and we almost beat that team.
Real madrid: ego killer
And the rest: chelsea, bayern, liverpool, inter epitomized team work those seasons

I found this anecdote which i think is a propos


i love these fairy tales in sport and football is of course a team effort, but ironically real's recent success story was co-written by the biggest ego in football, and they needed plenty of luck too.

i guess you can't find the recipe for cl success, because there isn't a universal one unfortunately.

our '15 team was a complete team effort, on pirlo's last chance. still, we missed chiellini and got unlucky in the 2nd half with that penalty incident at 1-1 and the following counter with barca's winner. we rarely speak about luck as a deciding factor. inda were lucky not to go get eliminated in the group stage (they were gonna be 3rd in their group like literally 10 minutes before the last group stage match ended) or not to go out vs barca with a last-gasp regular goal which was disallowed. chelsea could have been losing 0-4 until that corner (bayern had like 40 shots iirc, probably the highest shot count in any cl final by a single team), so chelsea also needed a lot of luck that night.

there's this book:


i love it and hate it at the same time. it reveals that football is the team sport that is mostly driven by luck. the book brings some stats from major leagues, and iirc in baseball it's like around 80% of the matches that are won by the stronger team on paper. in football, with the inclusion of the draw as a possible outcome, the underdog won't lose the match in around 50% of the cases. statistically, 50% of the goals is preceded by a lucky incident (deflection, big defensive mistake, refereeing mistake, etc).

i'm not playing down the importance of a team effort, i'm just saying that drogba is asked about the '12 final at first place because bayern literally missed dozens of chances that night. it was almost the same bayern that happened to become arguably the best team of the century just a season later. we can say that outstanding team efforts are rewarded by luck, but the '15 final shows otherwise. let's hope we'll deserve and get some luck in the coming years. gonna be hard without the old guard, without a strong italian core and with a bunch of mercenaries on board. i can't even expect dime a dozen players like danilo or rabiot, or a coach with strong neapolitan roots to die for the jersey. i expected ronaldo's professionalism and endless desire to win to lift the team spirit, and all i see is dybala, demiral, cuadrado and de ligt putting on some spirited performances on a regular basis. the others are usually soft as fuck.

but at least we got rid of mandzukic. SAD!

- - - Updated - - -

Honestly, I've no idea. But I'm not paid to make those decisions...

Arthur for Pjanic is sideways, so is Jorginho on paper. But if either can make Sarri's plan work better than tired Mire and his half a season effort than it stops being a sideways step and becomes an improvement, it's not just about stature and prestige. We chose Sarri and we know he's a coach where system is nearly all-important. Allegri was more flexible, but that can also have drawbacks in terms of identity.

Who is more likely to succeed short term? Obviously Jorginho. Knows the coach, knows the league.

We talk about Pogba, but aside from the financial cost, does he really suit Sarri's way of playing? Is he going to raise his game again or be the same dabho we see in Manchester? I know we can't be super strict with Sarri's way but you get the impression already that he's trying to fit square pegs into round holes even with super talents like Ronaldo or Dybala, let alone the likes of Matuidi or Ramsey. But that's another story, we won't see the best Juve midfield or the best Juve full stop for more than a season, just depends if he gets time or if it's a failed experiment.

I'm happy to let this happen:

LCM - Jorginho - Bentancur

Matuidi, Ramsey, Rabiot as backups

LCM has to be someone of quality and balls, not necessarily as experienced or high profile as Pogba. In an ideal world it would be someone to come in and his stock rise rapidly, like Vidal's did. People knew him as a talent and he was wanted by clubs, but he went from a middling Euro team to a big team and took off. Another one of those for €20m or €25m wouldn't go amiss. If Barella had still been at Cagliari maybe he would have been an interesting option, he seems to have that spark and talent, but you won't find hardly any CMs who score goals like Vidal did. Tonali is not quite the same, I see him having a similar slow progress and style to what Bentancur has.
good points. i don't find our options too exciting either. barca already bought de jong, my previous darling ndombélé probably wasn't mentally prepared to make a step up after leaving lyon, rodri was always gonna be too expensive, otherwise i didn't really see ready-made classy young mids lately. maybe aouar...? but a complete box to box beast like vidal is basically impossible to find.

the club's transfer policy doesn't help either. allegri never got the players he looked for, and i guess market opportunities will drive our transfers above sarri's needs. (not that i expect sarri to remain for more than 2 years anyway.)

as for tonali, those who are expecting a new pirlo are up for a disappointment. besides the accurate long balls, he's nothing like pirlo. more physical, without pirlo's vision and creativity.

btw i fully expect rabiot to leave during the next transfer window.
 
Last edited:

JuveJay

起死回生
Moderator
Mar 6, 2007
60,318
good points. i don't find our options too exciting either. barca already bought de jong, my previous darling ndombélé probably wasn't mentally prepared to make a step up after leaving lyon, rodri was always gonna be too expensive, otherwise i didn't really see ready-made classy young mids lately. maybe aouar...? but a complete box to box beast like vidal is basically impossible to find.

the club's transfer policy doesn't help either. allegri never got the players he looked for, and i guess market opportunities will drive our transfers above sarri's needs. (not that i expect sarri to remain for more than 2 years anyway.)

as for tonali, those who are expecting a new pirlo are up for a disappointment. besides the accurate long balls, he's nothing like pirlo. more physical, without pirlo's vision and creativity.

btw i fully expect rabiot to leave during the next transfer window.
I'm neither here or there with Rabiot or whether he leaves or not. If Tonali could replace him then great. I think Covid-19 has created more unsettled players than would naturally happen over the season. We could be talking now about how Rabiot ended the season with some gradual improvement and could carry on next year, but this stop changes a lot of things.

What about some other names?

Donny van der Beek
Hamed Traoré
Gaetano Castrovilli
SMS (presuming a pipe dream because of Lotito)
Lorenzo Pellegrini

We also need to remember the presence of Kulusevski next season.
 
Apr 14, 2005
60,846
i love these fairy tales in sport and football is of course a team effort, but ironically real's recent success story was co-written by the biggest ego in football, and they needed plenty of luck too.

i guess you can't find the recipe for cl success, because there isn't a universal one unfortunately.

our '15 team was a complete team effort, on pirlo's last chance. still, we missed chiellini and got unlucky in the 2nd half with that penalty incident at 1-1 and the following counter with barca's winner. we rarely speak about luck as a deciding factor. inda were lucky not to go get eliminated in the group stage (they were gonna be 3rd in their group like literally 10 minutes before the last group stage match ended) or not to go out vs barca with a last-gasp regular goal which was disallowed. chelsea could have been losing 0-4 until that corner (bayern had like 40 shots iirc, probably the highest shot count in any cl final by a single team), so chelsea also needed a lot of luck that night.

there's this book:


i love it and hate it at the same time. it reveals that football is the team sport that is mostly driven by luck. the book brings some stats from major leagues, and iirc in baseball it's like around 80% of the matches that are won by the stronger team on paper. in football, with the inclusion of the draw as a possible outcome, the underdog won't lose the match in around 50% of the cases. statistically, 50% of the goals is preceded by a lucky incident (deflection, big defensive mistake, refereeing mistake, etc).

i'm not playing down the importance of a team effort, i'm just saying that drogba is asked about the '12 final at first place because bayern literally missed dozens of chances that night. it was almost the same bayern that happened to become arguably the best team of the century just a season later. we can say that outstanding team efforts are rewarded by luck, but the '15 final shows otherwise. let's hope we'll deserve and get some luck in the coming years. gonna be hard without the old guard, without a strong italian core and with a bunch of mercenaries on board. i can't even expect dime a dozen players like danilo or rabiot, or a coach with strong neapolitan roots to die for the jersey. i expected ronaldo's professionalism and endless desire to win to lift the team spirit, and all i see is dybala, demiral, cuadrado and de ligt putting on some spirited performances on a regular basis. the others are usually soft as fuck.

but at least we got rid of mandzukic. SAD!

- - - Updated - - -


good points. i don't find our options too exciting either. barca already bought de jong, my previous darling ndombélé probably wasn't mentally prepared to make a step up after leaving lyon, rodri was always gonna be too expensive, otherwise i didn't really see ready-made classy young mids lately. maybe aouar...? but a complete box to box beast like vidal is basically impossible to find.

the club's transfer policy doesn't help either. allegri never got the players he looked for, and i guess market opportunities will drive our transfers above sarri's needs. (not that i expect sarri to remain for more than 2 years anyway.)

as for tonali, those who are expecting a new pirlo are up for a disappointment. besides the accurate long balls, he's nothing like pirlo. more physical, without pirlo's vision and creativity.

btw i fully expect rabiot to leave during the next transfer window.
You missed my point, i never said you don't need the talent but for the talent to put ego aside and work for the team, and that's where the problem lies. And in the absence of that you are better off sacrificing some talent for more character. In the words of the winningest coach ever "The one thing I’ve definitely learned is you’ve got to count on your most dependable people… It might not be your most talented people. But you count on your most dependable people".

Also we are not taking into consideration other variables like bad coaching, egregious bad calls... This is about players recruitment and management philosophy.
 
May 4, 2020
56
According to calciomercato Juve is interested in Jordi Alba. Does that mean Alex Sandro si going?Possible swap?
It seems like Jorginho is more realistic option then Arthur, who is not willing to go out of club.

Barca and Juve ar seeking for profit from deal. Hard that something will happen knowing that both clubs are offering shit players for better.
 

Bianconero81

Ageing Veteran
Contributor
Jan 26, 2009
28,316
You missed my point, i never said you don't need the talent but for the talent to put ego aside and work for the team, and that's where the problem lies. And in the absence of that you are better off sacrificing some talent for more character. In the words of the winningest coach ever "The one thing I’ve definitely learned is you’ve got to count on your most dependable people… It might not be your most talented people. But you count on your most dependable people".

Also we are not taking into consideration other variables like bad coaching, egregious bad calls... This is about players recruitment and management philosophy.
We're already at a disadvantage because we don't have a winning coach or an expert motivator at the helm.

If we win, it's because individual quality and one or two leaders/senior members of the squad.

We need both character and talent, but more importantly we need a coach who can guide us to the "promised land."

It's like having Phil Jackson and then replacing him with David Fizdale to win you a championship.

- - - Updated - - -

I'm neither here or there with Rabiot or whether he leaves or not. If Tonali could replace him then great. I think Covid-19 has created more unsettled players than would naturally happen over the season. We could be talking now about how Rabiot ended the season with some gradual improvement and could carry on next year, but this stop changes a lot of things.

What about some other names?

Donny van der Beek
Hamed Traoré
Gaetano Castrovilli
SMS (presuming a pipe dream because of Lotito)
Lorenzo Pellegrini

We also need to remember the presence of Kulusevski next season.
SMS is even more prohibitive than Pogba.

Castrovilli and Traore would be great options, off the bench.

Donald Of The Beak is an interesting option.

Pellegrini is the type of player I don't like - I really don't see anything special in him. He reminds me of that Inter cunt Motta and Roma's Perotta.

- - - Updated - - -

According to calciomercato Juve is interested in Jordi Alba. Does that mean Alex Sandro si going?Possible swap?
It seems like Jorginho is more realistic option then Arthur, who is not willing to go out of club.

Barca and Juve ar seeking for profit from deal. Hard that something will happen knowing that both clubs are offering shit players for better.
:yuck: :inter: No to that ageing POS. Can we stop targeting geezers FFS?
 

s4tch

¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Contributor
Mar 23, 2015
11,973
You missed my point, i never said you don't need the talent but for the talent to put ego aside and work for the team, and that's where the problem lies.
yeah, i most certainly missed your point that you started with vidal. i didn't get the context at all. speaking of vidal, he won zero cl's, but i don't blame his dependability for it. on the pitch, he was a pro when he was healthy. and his dismissal during that infamous real-bayern was none of his fault either, he got a red for a hard, but well-made tackle from an unreliable ref who has already fallen out of favor with uefa. he's a winner with the nt, he won a lot with bayern and juve, and as i said, you need plenty of luck for the cl.

also, i was referring to his attributes as a player (workrate, versatility, top defensive contribution, very good movement inside the box, etc) which we are missing. his antics outside of the pi

i didn't say that you said you don't need talent. my point was that it's ironic that the biggest ego of them all is the most successful cl player since the '60s.

btw paratici already said several times that a player's family background, personality are just as important as his strengths on the pitch. that's why i don't get why we signed a troubled guy like rabiot, and why we are chasing icardi, arguably the biggest cunt in world football at the moment, a player marotta fired like a dog.
 

Bianconero81

Ageing Veteran
Contributor
Jan 26, 2009
28,316
btw paratici already said several times that a player's family background, personality are just as important as his strengths on the pitch. that's why i don't get why we signed a troubled guy like rabiot, and why we are chasing icardi, arguably the biggest cunt in world football at the moment, a player marotta fired like a dog.
Tumorous Tootsie :rofl: :howler:

Do you trust anything that incompetent upstart says?
 

s4tch

¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Contributor
Mar 23, 2015
11,973
What about some other names?

Donny van der Beek
Hamed Traoré
Gaetano Castrovilli
SMS (presuming a pipe dream because of Lotito)
Lorenzo Pellegrini

We also need to remember the presence of Kulusevski next season.
kulusevski looks like some muscle flexing towards inda, i'm not sure we'll use him too much.

traoré is an other darling of mine, but imo he's a bit lightweight and inconsistent for a starter place here. pellegrini's progress slowed down, i'd still take him as a depth option. van de beek is a good idea, he has brilliant engine and tactical awareness, like a top condition khedira on steroids, and he's pretty good in the box too, but he's got pl and spanish offers, not an easy target at all. if castrovilli is doable, he's a must, in 2-3 years he could be one of the top italian mids, but at the moment, he's like tonali: at the beginning of his learning curve, isn't he.

sms would be one of my first picks, but he's so unrealistic because of lotito that i stopped mentioning him.

partey's name popped up a couple of months ago then the rumor died. i'd take him as an ideal matuidi replacement.

- - - Updated - - -

Tumorous Tootsie :rofl: :howler:

Do you trust anything that incompetent upstart says?
yeah, i know... because of the demiral deal i still trust his scouting instinct somehow. but he'll need a more experienced manager to work on strategy, because these salaries and the composition of our squad are ticking bombs. also, why hire a coach with a pretty strict, one-dimensional football, then not provide him with proper players
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 15, Guests: 38)