Summer Mercato Thread 2018 (168 Viewers)

[Xperd]

I think the frustration is we're not pushing a little extra to win the CL. We're mostly happy maintaining the status quo i.e winning Serie A and do as well as you can in CL. After years of Serie A domination, that's what the fans like to see. A real ambition for the Champions league.
For example keeping Pogba for another year and signing Higuain would have made us CL favourites.
But it looks like we have no real ambition to win the CL as evidenced by our last mercato so we have to be happy with what we have now and hope somehow we luck it out and do a 'Liverpool' in the CL.

 

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[Fr3sh]

I think the frustration is we're not pushing a little extra to win the CL. We're mostly happy maintaining the status quo i.e winning Serie A and do as well as you can in CL. After years of Serie A domination, that's what the fans like to see. A real ambition for the Champions league.
For example keeping Pogba for another year and signing Higuain would have made us CL favourites.
But it looks like we have no real ambition to win the CL as evidenced by our last mercato so we have to be happy with what we have now and hope somehow we luck it out and do a 'Liverpool' in the CL.

Pjanic Pogba Khedira/Marchisio would have been a sexy midfield, to top of Alves as RB and Sandro as LB, Dybala Higuain, Cuads
it's almost as if the club didnt want it to happen

 

[edgardavids2608]

I did not say we don't bring in talent... I said reinvest-
meaning actually spend money.

As for your last paragraph, what does that have to do with what I said?

Sorry I didnt know reinvest meant getting money from the owners. I thought it was getting money and then reinvesting in the team which is what we do. Not reinvesting would be getting Pogba money and then buying Matri...thats not reinvesting. Investing is putting money in that wasnt previously there

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I think the frustration is we're not pushing a little extra to win the CL. We're mostly happy maintaining the status quo i.e winning Serie A and do as well as you can in CL. After years of Serie A domination, that's what the fans like to see. A real ambition for the Champions league.
For example keeping Pogba for another year and signing Higuain would have made us CL favourites.
But it looks like we have no real ambition to win the CL as evidenced by our last mercato so we have to be happy with what we have now and hope somehow we luck it out and do a 'Liverpool' in the CL.

Thats where I disagree. I think we realised under Conte that having a quality attack was crucial. Not to just win the league but to win the CL. We then got Tevez and Llorente cheap and have been slowly building a world class attack. We are buying multiple 45 million doolar wingers to play along side Higuain and Dybala. I see this as a true intention of not being happy with serie a but just can disagree.

 

[lgorTudor]

I think the frustration is we're not pushing a little extra to win the CL. We're mostly happy maintaining the status quo i.e winning Serie A and do as well as you can in CL. After years of Serie A domination, that's what the fans like to see. A real ambition for the Champions league.
For example keeping Pogba for another year and signing Higuain would have made us CL favourites.
But it looks like we have no real ambition to win the CL as evidenced by our last mercato so we have to be happy with what we have now and hope somehow we luck it out and do a 'Liverpool' in the CL.

What adds to the frustration is that we have been CL top/top3 earner and despite that kept our net spend at Dortmund level. It just indicates we are not interested in making the leap and that's despicable in a competitive sense

 

[Quetzalcoatl]

Sorry I didnt know reinvest meant getting money from the owners. I thought it was getting money and then reinvesting in the team which is what we do. Not reinvesting would be getting Pogba money and then buying Matri...thats not reinvesting. Investing is putting money in that wasnt previously there

No, not getting money from the owners. Reinvesting the money that we earn from reaching CL finals, TV rights, etc. NOT reinvesting the money that we get from selling our best players, which is the minimum we should do, if we must sell.

That is, not necessarily having to have a net expenditure of 10M.

 

[edgardavids2608]

What adds to the frustration is that we have been CL top/top3 earner and despite that kept our net spend at Dortmund level. It just indicates we are not interested in making the leap and that's despicable in a competitive sense

Look at where we are in total income though...Dont look at one stat and say they can spend like madrid because they made the same in the CL. At the end of the day they brough in more than 200 million more than us. Maybe thats not big in your mind but if we were to ultrainvest and something happened to where we had a bad CL run we couldnt depend on owners personal money to keep us afloat. We would be fine and keep building because thats the way we run. Like a business with sustainable growth

 

[lgorTudor]

Look at where we are in total income though...Dont look at one stat and say they can spend like madrid because they made the same in the CL. At the end of the day they brough in more than 200 million more than us. Maybe thats not big in your mind but if we were to ultrainvest and something happened to where we had a bad CL run we couldnt depend on owners personal money to keep us afloat. We would be fine and keep building because thats the way we run. Like a business with sustainable growth

Point is not to spend more than clubs with bigger revenue, but to spend more than clubs with a significantly smaller revenue

 

[Xperd]

One of those winger deals financed by sale of a key player.

See we are bringing in good players but we're also letting good players go too and easily infact.

It's almost like we can't build on top of something for atleast a season. And then we blame the coach once he can't figure out to handle the weaknesses in the squad which in the first place is caused by selling key players every year.

 

[juventus4life]

After close to 25 years, a quarter of a century supporting this team, I think I'm owed another a CL title

I've suffered and endured, and the management weakening the team is definitely gonna see me lose interest. I'm always gonna love and support Juve, but if we keep losing our best players, it's natural to gradually become disinterested.

I feel a bit disinterested, too after 32 years of following this club. And yes I have seen the club didn't win anything for a long long time after the European Cup in Heysel. I really enjoy Lippi' first era though. They pressed opponents like Bayern do nowadays.

 

[-=DJANGO=-]

Do not depair bianconeri faithful. Last few years our boy Elkann was busy moving BIG money around. (tens of billions) I think they've settled it and now have more of a what-next problem, but what he was after is done and dusted.

It would look very badly if we bought the title in Italy, but next year other Italian teams should start getting their ducks in a row and we will spend. I think he might raise the capital of the club another time, but there is a risk of pissing small shareholders.

Don't expect a Neymar deal, but I do predict big moves for us this summer. 100M+ net spend.

 

[edgardavids2608]

What adds to the frustration is that we have been CL top/top3 earner and despite that kept our net spend at Dortmund level. It just indicates we are not interested in making the leap and that's despicable in a competitive sense

Look at where we are in total income though...Dont look at one stat and say they can spend like madrid because they made the same in the CL. At the end of the day they brough in more than 200 million more than us. Maybe thats not big in your mind but if we were to ultrainvest and something happened to where we had a bad CL run we couldnt depend on owners personal money to keep us afloat. We would be fine and keep building because thats the way we run. Like a business with sustainable growth

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One of those winger deals financed by sale of a key player.

See we are bringing in good players but we're also letting good players go too and easily infact.

It's almost like we can't build on top of something for atleast a season. And then we blame the coach once he can't figure out to handle the weaknesses in the squad which in the first place is caused by selling key players every year.

Bonucci? So you are telling me it was a bad idea to get Benatia an buy Bernadeschi? I disagree. Benatia has proven to be great and we got younger faster and more creative on offense over the offseason. Alves hurt us bad and I truly dont think we saw this coming. But Bonucci doesnt bother me at all. It seems like a neverending wheel of Blame towards the board.

We had the best midfield in the world that we assembled basically for free and then people said without wingers like robben and ribery and Messi ronaldo neymar we cant win. We are still building IMO. 7 years from 7th place twice to 2 cl finals in 3 years and 6 league titles. We are getting better and younger and IMO there is no reason to think that we will decline. We are constantly reinvesting in young talent while keeping our competitive edge not just in the league but in europe.

I peronally like the project we have going on and think we have a very powerfull future ahead of us. I do agree that it can be frusterating at times though to lose key players but we are on a 10 year plan to dominate all fronts. Hard to say its not a effective model from where we came from and what we have done both financially and on the field

 

[Orgut]

Would take Balo in a heartbeat, injury crisis or no injury crisis, you already knew that.

I guess I would too.. I think he can be used as a LW and be a devastating LW
Add brain to Balo and you get everything we look to in a football player

 

[GiocataGrande]

you cant just add brain to Balo. Thats like sprinkling oregano over a pile of sand

 

[pitbull]

No, not getting money from the owners. Reinvesting the money that we earn from reaching CL finals, TV rights, etc. NOT reinvesting the money that we get from selling our best players, which is the minimum we should do, if we must sell.

That is, not necessarily having to have a net expenditure of 10M.

Look at our wage bill, thats the main cost for any team not from Manchester or called PSG. Our net spend is almost zero, but our wage bill is exploding year after year and this summer we'll probably move even closer to 200m euros. We'll add free agent Can, hopefully another top CM, hopefully tie down A.Sandro and we'll have to replace some very modest earners like Licht and Asamoah, thats like +15m net to the 160m we have currently. We're significantly investing in our wages to keep up with the big boys, we're not rich enough to also splash big on transfers

 

[dolph]

You're absolutely right, Dolph. Costa and Bernardeschi were decent investments this past summer (price wise, and for the future). Szczęsny and Caldara were less expensive, but I think they'll also be key players for an extended period in the near future. But it is also important to remember how many of our quality players came in for cheap.

Pirlo (free), Barzagli (300K), Vidal (10.5M), Tevez (something like 9-12M), Pogba (Free), Khedira (Free), Rugani (4.15M) -- 26.95M! (my numbers may be off, but the point stands). Khedira should be phased out now, but all of those guy were or will be important for us.

Juve does need to spend money, but the club also needs to scout well and find important opportunities. Dybala was a huge opportunity, Pjanic was a huge opportunity, Szczęsny and Caldara were solid plays, etc.

I find the excessive criticism of Allegri absolutely ridiculous, and Management has earned some leeway given what they've produced in recent years. Gotta remember the importance of continuity in professional sports. Eventually a coach's message may become stale, but I really don't see that being anywhere near the case with Max at this point.

What annoys me about a lot of the player acquisition discussions here at the moment, is that people are actually getting pissed off and blaming management for transactions that haven't actually happened. All the talk about the Italian mediocrity that we're supposedly bringing in... the daily sports rags in Italy are basically only fit for wiping your butt with. They get something like 98% of their rumours wrong. This isn't exactly an ItalJuve club at the moment, we have plenty of international flavour.

Let's just be patient, and see what management turns up come June. And ffs, let's hope we win every competition possible, because all that does is increase performance based revenue, increase visibility, increase our fan base -- all of which contribute to increasing our budget and thus the calibre of players that the club can buy.

I agree that we have to keep an eye out for good deals and be smart with the money we have. However I think that we also have to be willing to spend big once in a while, to prevent us from having a midfield were Pjanic is the only one good enough to be a starter, and MDS as out Best right back. If we can keep doing Pogba, Barza, Pirlo etc. deals then there is no need to spend money, but I dont think we will be able to pull of these deals consistently enough to remain competitive.

What irritates me sometimes, is when we start penny pinching, and settle for the 2nd or 3rd Best thing because we cant do the deal on our terms. In those instances our financial restriction/ principals are just to stright IMO, and we need to be able to get the money available to get the players we are aiming for in the first place.

I must admit, that I enjoy the reaction and discussion about transfer targets even though I know that 99% are BS. For me its all a part of the fun of the wishlist thread, but I guess we are different in that way.

 

[Badass J Elkann]

More Fabinho rumors

http://m.calciomercato.com/en/news/paper-talk-36066

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Darmian shopping in Italy

http://m.calciomercato.com/en/news/...r-goes-shopping-in-turin-as-juventus-mo-83711

FAB...


!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[dolph]

Look at our wage bill, thats the main cost for any team not from Manchester or called PSG. Our net spend is almost zero, but our wage bill is exploding year after year and this summer we'll probably move even closer to 200m euros. We'll add free agent Can, hopefully another top CM, hopefully tie down A.Sandro and we'll have to replace some very modest earners like Licht and Asamoah

Apart from the general increase in players wages, we often buy “older” players or sign freebies, which means higher than normal wages.

Therefore it makes more sense to look at the wage bill and players amortisation and compare this to our revenue.

 

[Rollie]

Aurier and it's not even close! Only RB better then him is Alves!

How much did you love Aurier being Tottenhams absolute worst player in the first leg? Dude was terrible!

I agree that we have to keep an eye out for good deals and be smart with the money we have. However I think that we also have to be willing to spend big once in a while, to prevent us from having a midfield were Pjanic is the only one good enough to be a starter, and MDS as out Best right back. If we can keep doing Pogba, Barza, Pirlo etc. deals then there is no need to spend money, but I dont think we will be able to pull of these deals consistently enough to remain competitive.

What irritates me sometimes, is when we start penny pinching, and settle for the 2nd or 3rd Best thing because we cant do the deal on our terms. In those instances our financial restriction/ principals are just to stright IMO, and we need to be able to get the money available to get the players we are aiming for in the first place.

I must admit, that I enjoy the reaction and discussion about transfer targets even though I know that 99% are BS. For me its all a part of the fun of the wishlist thread, but I guess we are different in that way.

Right, the cheap good deals are necessary to be able to spend a bit more at other times. I think we can consistently operate for 2-3 players per mercato in that 40-60M range, but I wouldn't expect us to get into the upper range of transfer fees post Neymar/Mbappe/Coutinho/Dembele. When big moves like that fail, they really hurt the team longer term.

I think there's a way to combine intelligence with substantial offers.

As for the rumours thing, it's not that I dislike rumours, or peoples opinions about potential players; I tune into that stuff all the time.

What gets annoying is when people are castigating/denigrating our management for moves they haven't actually made, and saying that we should fire them when they've done amazing/historic things for the club.

 

[dolph]

How much did you love Aurier being Tottenhams absolute worst player in the first leg? Dude was terrible!



Right, the cheap good deals are necessary to be able to spend a bit more at other times. I think we can consistently operate for 2-3 players per mercato in that 40-60M range, but I wouldn't expect us to get into the upper range of transfer fees post Neymar/Mbappe/Coutinho/Dembele. When big moves like that fail, they really hurt the team longer term.

I think there's a way to combine intelligence with substantial offers.

As for the rumours thing, it's not that I dislike rumours, or peoples opinions about potential players; I tune into that stuff all the time.

What gets annoying is when people are castigating/denigrating our management for moves they haven't actually made, and saying that we should fire them when they've done amazing/historic things for the club.

Firing our management would be absolutely retarded. They are some of the very best in the business. However discussing the nuances good and bad is some of the things, I enjoy about being on this forum.

I do agree the the general sentiment about AA, Beppe, Allegri, Elkann becomes to black and white at times.

 

[DAiDEViL]

Wish I grew up watching Bayern Munich with my dad and uncles @BayernFan

What about them? Did they stop after one try? Did they try something different? Change their environment?

They failed Plenty of times but eventually got it right.