Paris attacks (9 Viewers)

[Post Ironic]

France bombing them too little*


Either destroy entirely or try the other way.

Yeah. Because we should really bomb Islamic people into extinction. Men, women, children... everyone. Just wipe-em out.

 

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[IrishZebra]

Yeah. Because we should really bomb Islamic people into extinction. Men, women, children... everyone. Just wipe-em out.

ISIS aren't representative of Islam dude.

 

[Post Ironic]

Heck even a Western Muslims like Cheesio have defended attacking Freedom of Speech now living in and with the Freedom of Speech he hates.

But obviously if the West haven't done what we have in the Middle East. Muslims all around the World would salute Freedom of Speech.

What am I trying to say. It ain't that simple. So many things cause the extremism we see among Muslims.

And of course, this is exactly what I'm saying. It isn't that simple. It's not just a case of a religion being a breeding ground for psychopaths, nor is it a case entirely of Western foreign policy... It's a deeply nuanced and complex issue, and until it's understood, and all these nuances and complexities are taken into account, ideas like bombing them back into the stone age, and wiping them all out, etc are just going to exacerbate this.

 

[IliveForJuve]

There's no reason to bomb them. That will only create more problems. If you wanna do something, do it right and take out their leaders, destroy their connections, their financial and military support/source, etc.

 

[Maddy]

And it has very little to do with cartoons... aside from being a tipping point, and a target upon which to vent their anger over the general condition of the Islamic world and its treatment by the west.

Don't be ridiculous here. These people don't wake up one day content, and then become violent extremists, exclusively because of a cartoon.

(nevermind we agree).

 

[Bjerknes]

We should stand with our allies, everybody else can get $#@!ed.

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Christian and Western are analogous for a lot of camel jockies around the world. The left give way worse treatment to Christians and Jews that you are making out. Muslims are held on a $#@!ing pedastel in Europe as victims in need of support and its our fault they aren't integrated, while Christians are derided in every sector of society.

Bingo.

Sorry for your loss, by the way.

 

[Post Ironic]

ISIS aren't representative of Islam dude.

Of course they aren't... but any suggestion of more extreme bombing means wiping out civilian populations of Islamic people in the areas they control. And if you think increased Civilian casualties are the way to win this, you are sadly mistaken.

 

[Hængebøffer]

And it has very little to do with cartoons... aside from being a tipping point, and a target upon which to vent their anger over the general condition of the Islamic world and its treatment by the west.

Don't be ridiculous here. These people don't wake up one day content, and then become violent extremists, exclusively because of a cartoon.

What? I didn't say that - neither did Maddy. As long as religion is the main force in politics, nothing will change. This is the biggest problem in Islamic countries.

 

[Osman]

If you wanna do something, do it right and take out their leaders, destroy their connections, their financial and military support/source, etc.

Kinda hard, when they funded, trained and given power as the chosen "rebel" group for the ongoing proxy war of the time. Until they "turn" on their masters that is. Isis will go away or become weaker, like Al Qaida became, dont be suprised if next threat is a current group being trained and supported to fight Isis/Syria/Iran/Russia etc.

 

[Ocelot]

We started this war, we started the atrocities, and your eye for an eye type primitive argument will get us nowhere fast.

I know you don't mean it in that sense, but it's exaclty this "we" and "them" logic that doesn't make sense. The people killed in Paris didn't start any war, and the civilians bombed in Syria didn't commit any terrorist acts.

Like Omar that committed the attack in Denmark in February. We gave his parents asylum, we gave him and his family a 2nd chance.

But apparently Danish Jews and a Cartoonist was a part of that "violent by Western foreign policy and atrocities in the Middle East".

Charlie Hebdo-attack was also caused by France's foreign policy?

Not directly, and not by France's in isolation, but it was very very much indirectly caused by what western (and other) countries have done in the region the past 100 years, and especially the past 25. Of course it's not the only cause either, but especially with the specific case of ISIS, the 2003 Iraq invasion was extremely crucial for the form and extent it took.

 

[IliveForJuve]

Of course they aren't... but any suggestion of more extreme bombing means wiping out civilian populations of Islamic people in the areas they control. And if you think increased Civilian casualties are the way to win this, you are sadly mistaken.

War is necessary whether you like it or not... now the methods you're gonna use are a whole different thing.

 

[IrishZebra]

Of course they aren't... but any suggestion of more extreme bombing means wiping out civilian populations of Islamic people in the areas they control. And if you think increased Civilian casualties are the way to win this, you are sadly mistaken.

Actually I'd be in favour of a UN backed intervention consisting of Western, Russian, Chinese, and AU troops.

Either way, civilians are going to die in Raqqa and elsewhere, that's war. There is no non-military way to defeat ISIS because they're an army now. The battle for ideas can be won only when this functional mess is cleaned up.

 

[Ocelot]

Starve them of their support network while creating an alternate workable system for those you can convince to join you, similar to the Malayan strategy.

That is the crucial part.

At least one thing we can agree on.

 

[Maddy]

And of course, this is exactly what I'm saying. It isn't that simple. It's not just a case of a religion being a breeding ground for psychopaths, nor is it a case entirely of Western foreign policy... It's a deeply nuanced and complex issue, and until it's understood, and all these nuances and complexities are taken into account, ideas like bombing them back into the stone age, and wiping them all out, etc are just going to exacerbate this.

I agree with this.

I just can't deal with people continously putting this on the West without seeing the evil that totalitarian Islam represent and the good that especially Europe has done to the Middle East.

Palestine would be a note in a history book if not for post 2nd WW Europe.

 

[IrishZebra]

That is the crucial part.

At least one thing we can agree on.

Try creating a functioning state in made up countries, you get Belgium, and nobody wants to be Belgian.

 

[Post Ironic]

I know you don't mean it in that sense, but it's exaclty this "we" and "them" logic that doesn't make sense. The people killed in Paris didn't start any war, and the civilians bombed in Syria didn't commit any terrorist acts.
.

Yeah. I don't really mean it in that us versus them kind of way... More so, that this is the dichotomy being created by extremism from both sides, and the idea that IrishZebra is expressing of "if they're not an ally, fuck em."

 

[IliveForJuve]

Try creating a functioning state in made up countries, you get Belgium, and nobody wants to be Belgian.

You can also send them to Canada. They need more population.

Send them to Vancouver plz.

 

[Ocelot]

He lost two ppl in the terrorist attack two days ago, stop being pieces of shits maybe for one second and just let him vent in peace

Okay there's probably a lot of truth in that

 

[Hængebøffer]

I agree with this.

I just can't deal with people continously putting this on the West without seeing the evil that totalitarian Islam represent and the good that especially Europe has done to the Middle East.

Palestine would be a note in a history book if not for post 2nd WW Europe.

Pure victim blaming.

 

[IliveForJuve]

Europe is guilty for the poverty in South America today.