I really doubt we'll going to sign someone. We'll probably stick to Kimmich - Goretzka double pivot and have Tolisso as some kind of Thiago's replacement.
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@Enron here’s an insightful article I think you’d be interested in
https://theathletic.com/2070370/202...the-deal-happened/?source=user_shared_article
https://theathletic.com/2070370/202...the-deal-happened/?source=user_shared_article
Just £5m up front – how Liverpool signed Thiago
James Pearce and more Sep 18, 2020
(Additional contributors: David Ornstein, Simon Hughes, Raphael Honigstein, Adam Crafton, Daniel Taylor)
It all started with a phone call in June.
Thiago Alcantara was close to signing a lucrative new four-year contract with Bayern Munich, worth around £12 million per year (£230,000 per week), when his head was turned.
The Spain international was informed that Jurgen Klopp wanted him at Liverpool.
A friend of Thiago’s family told The Athletic: “Earlier this year, it seemed certain that he was going to extend his contract with Bayern Munich but then Liverpool’s interest escalated and this suddenly changed everything.
“The serious talks only began around three months ago with Liverpool. There has been speculation about Manchester United but Liverpool’s interest was absolutely clear and direct from the beginning. He’s been sure he’s been going there for several months.”
Klopp had long since admired Thiago and it soon became clear during their discussions that the feeling was mutual. The 29-year-old playmaker had been on the receiving end of Klopp’s Liverpool juggernaut when Bayern were dumped out of the Champions League’s last 16 in March 2019 after a 3-1 defeat at the Allianz Arena. A few weeks earlier he had been blown away by the atmosphere in a goalless first leg stalemate at Anfield.
Watching Liverpool’s march to Premier League title glory in 2019-20 had served to strengthen his desire to one day experience life in England’s top flight.
Having enjoyed a trophy-laden seven years in Germany, he informed Bayern he wanted to pursue a new challenge. That new deal was rejected and, having entered the final year of his existing contract, he knew the serial Bundesliga champions would have little option but to sell him.
When he said his emotional goodbyes to his team-mates at the end of last season he didn’t think he would be returning to the Sabener Strasse training complex. He had already put his house in Munich up for sale.
But Thiago had to be patient. He ended up starting pre-season back at Bayern after this month’s international fixtures.
Finally, early on Thursday, he was informed that the finer details of an agreement between Liverpool sporting director Michael Edwards and Bayern counterpart Hasan Salihamidzic had been completed. He again said farewell to team-mates and staff, and the Bayern manager Hansi Flick congratulated Klopp on signing “an extraordinary player and a great person”.
A source with experience of working with Thiago says: “He is a top guy and one of the most professional players in this world. As for Liverpool, it’s a dream come true for him. The dream for him for years has been the Premier League.”
By then, Liverpool’s club doctor Jim Moxon had flown to Munich to oversee his medical. A four-year deal worth around £200,000 per week was already in place. His favoured No 6 shirt was conveniently vacant following Dejan Lovren’s move to Zenit St Petersburg in July.
Klopp had secured the services of a man he regards as “a game-changer”. The manager had pushed hard for the deal to get done and ultimately FSG president Mike Gordon and Edwards delivered.
For Liverpool, it was always about trying to make the numbers work after revenues were hit heavily by the COVID-19 pandemic. They had long since known that Bayern’s asking price was €30 million (£27 million).
Until recently, their stance was that they would only proceed with thrashing out a deal if another central midfielder was to leave the club. Liverpool had been braced for a bid from Barcelona for Georginio Wijnaldum, who has entered the final year of his contract. However, with no offers forthcoming and with the Dutchman not pushing for a transfer, earlier this week Liverpool made their move for Thiago.
Edwards is a famously tough negotiator and the passage of time had strengthened Liverpool’s hand. Thiago’s heart was set on Anfield and Bayern were keen for the saga not to overshadow the start to their new season.
The breakdown of the fee is extraordinary given the calibre of the player Liverpool have signed. They will pay a guaranteed £20 million with the rest to potentially follow in add-ons related to team success and individual awards. However, The Athletic understands that £20 million will be spread over the course of Thiago’s contract, with an initial outlay of just £5 million. Put into context, Edwards sold striker Dominic Solanke to Bournemouth for £19 million last year.
“It’s a fantastic deal for the football club,” says a Liverpool source close to the negotiations. “With Thiago having some time off and then the international fixtures at the start of the month, there was no rush to get it done. Klopp wanted the player, the player wanted Liverpool and Bayern were willing to deal.”
It’s a statement signing and the sense of excitement among supporters when the news of a fee being agreed was broken by The Athletic was replicated at Melwood when Klopp’s squad arrived for duty on Thursday.
“All the boys were talking about it,” one dressing-room source tells The Athletic. “A signing like this gives everyone a boost. It shows that the club really mean business and extra competition for places puts even more hunger in the squad.
“We’re not talking about someone coming in as back-up, we’re talking about an elite player who has won loads of trophies and can really make a big difference on the field. He fits the ilk of the kind of player you want to see Liverpool bring in.
“The midfield is one area that Klopp regularly rotates and, with the schedule as it is, the more options we have in there the better.”
The signing of Thiago, whose father Mazinho was a World Cup winner with Brazil in 1994, represents a significant departure from the transfer policy that helped Liverpool win the Champions League, UEFA Super Cup, Club World Cup and the title in the space of 13 months. Owner FSG has always favoured a model of investing in younger talent with big potential.
Klopp has traditionally elevated players into the world-class bracket rather than bought gems at the peak of their career who didn’t need polishing. Even big-money buys such as Virgil van Dijk and Alisson weren’t serial winners the way Thiago is.
In fact, prior to Thiago, the only player over the age of 26 who Liverpool had paid a fee for during Klopp’s reign was Estonian centre-back Ragnar Klavan, a modest £4.2 million stop-gap purchase from Augsburg of Germany in 2016.
This wasn’t a signing being pushed over an extended period by Liverpool’s esteemed team of data analysts. In fact, he was outside of their prescribed remit. However, when Edwards asked them to examine the numbers on Thiago, their findings backed up why Klopp was so desperate to bring him on board.
His expert range of passing and creative spark are well-known. But just as important to Liverpool was the data in terms of winning back possession and operating in tight spaces by keeping the ball when under pressure. He ticked all the boxes.
Thiago suffered a serious knee injury in 2014 which ruled him out for a year but Liverpool had no concerns on that front. He had proved his robust nature by clocking up 220 games for club and country over the past five seasons.
The absence of any real sell-on value, given that he will be 33 when his contract runs out, was deemed unimportant given the relatively low transfer fee and the commercial benefits his signing will undoubtedly yield. Shirt sales since Nike took over from New Balance as the club’s kit supplier this summer are already up by more than 20 per cent and Thiago’s arrival is bound to fuel demand further.
“The player made a strong, early commitment to come to us,” a senior member of staff at Melwood tells The Athletic. “Looking at the fixture list, we knew we needed depth in midfield. Thiago can play the final ball and that’s something that was missing. He’s also outstanding in terms of being press-resistant and he has a superb football brain.”
Klopp and his backroom staff had a drink together in Hotel Gut Brandlhof, close to the picturesque town of Saalfelden, watching the Champions League final during last month’s pre-season training camp in Austria. All eyes were on Thiago, who ran the show and was integral to Bayern’s triumph over Paris Saint-Germain.
It was a performance which reinforced Klopp’s belief that he was an elegant player who could give Liverpool a new dimension. Klopp regards him as one of the most complete and balanced midfielders he’s ever seen.
He and assistant Pep Lijnders often talk about the need for Liverpool to stay “unpredictable”. They like to keep opponents guessing. It’s why they work to ensure that the style of the team evolves from year to year.
So much of their attacking threat currently comes from the wide areas, with the quality provided by full-backs Trent Alexander-Arnold and Andy Robertson. But with Thiago on board, they will have someone capable of dissecting defences from central areas. The front three of Mohamed Salah, Sadio Mane and Roberto Firmino should be licking their lips.
“Improving this title-winning team isn’t easy,” says another senior Melwood source. “But Thiago is one of the few who can. In the end, the deal was a no-brainer.”
His presence will give Klopp give greater flexibility in terms of whether to play 4-3-3 or 4-2-3-1. It also makes signing another centre-back to replace Lovren less important, given that Thiago’s presence frees up Fabinho to play in the back line when needs must.
Liverpool insist the arrival of Thiago doesn’t mean that another senior midfielder is inevitably on the way out. Wijnaldum has indicated he wants to stay put for the coming season following positive talks with Klopp but a number of fringe men will depart to generate cash. The first of those appears to be Holland youth international Ki-Jana Hoever, who looks set to join Wolves for a fee of over £10 million.
“Klopp knows he needs to sell but he wants to as well,” says a source close to the owners. “He’s wary of the squad becoming bloated.”
Having suffered at the hands of Bayern cherry-picking the likes of Robert Lewandowski, Mats Hummels and Mario Gotze when he was in charge of German rivals Borussia Dortmund, Klopp has now lured an elite midfielder in his prime away from the new European champions.
It’s testament to Klopp’s pulling power and Liverpool’s current status globally. Six years ago, Liverpool’s attempts to sign Toni Kroos involved Brendan Rodgers asking Steven Gerrard to send the Germany midfielder a text message.
Thiago had also been linked with Manchester United this summer but although they held discussions with his representatives there were no direct talks with Bayern.
He had been pursued by both Arsenal and Chelsea in recent years, too. Bayern put feelers out to those two clubs once again in the hope of creating a bidding war with Liverpool, but it never developed. Sources indicate that other potential suitors were quoted salary demands of £17 million a year (£327,000 per week). Barcelona did consider re-signing him, but swapping Arthur for Juventus’ Miralem Pjanic was deemed a more sensible financial decision.
Thiago and his wife, Julia Vigas, had previously expressed a wish to live in London, so when Liverpool became an option some around him weren’t sure if it would appeal to him but he soon put them right. A move to Manchester City and a reunion with Pep Guardiola, who had taken him along in 2013 when he swapped the Nou Camp for Bayern, was never on the cards.
“They had a good professional relationship but as with many players under Pep’s management, the experience together was too intense. Very, very few go running back to him,” one source close to the player and to Barcelona explains.
Thiago really should have graced the Premier League long before now. In 2013, a deal was effectively done to take him from Barcelona to Manchester United. United had tracked him for years and had a mountain of scouting reports, from his days playing for Spain Under-16s right through to life as a full international.
He was 22 and the retiring United manager Sir Alex Ferguson viewed him as one of his two leaving presents to his successor. The other was to bomb out Wayne Rooney following their fallout. However, incoming manager David Moyes decided to keep Rooney and dithered over Thiago.
Both the fee and personal terms had been agreed but Moyes got cold feet. He decided that he didn’t feel comfortable spending money on a player he had never seen play live. Moyes even had a clause in his contract that allowed a certain number of private jets each season for watching players.
The deal collapsed and Moyes ended up going back to previous club Everton to sign Marouane Fellaini for £27.5 million on deadline day. Moyes had also wanted Cesc Fabregas but that failed to materialise too.
Seven years on, Thiago has finally arrived in the Premier League and Klopp’s Liverpool have the show of ambition in the transfer market which will fuel the belief they can retain their crown.
James Pearce and more Sep 18, 2020
(Additional contributors: David Ornstein, Simon Hughes, Raphael Honigstein, Adam Crafton, Daniel Taylor)
It all started with a phone call in June.
Thiago Alcantara was close to signing a lucrative new four-year contract with Bayern Munich, worth around £12 million per year (£230,000 per week), when his head was turned.
The Spain international was informed that Jurgen Klopp wanted him at Liverpool.
A friend of Thiago’s family told The Athletic: “Earlier this year, it seemed certain that he was going to extend his contract with Bayern Munich but then Liverpool’s interest escalated and this suddenly changed everything.
“The serious talks only began around three months ago with Liverpool. There has been speculation about Manchester United but Liverpool’s interest was absolutely clear and direct from the beginning. He’s been sure he’s been going there for several months.”
Klopp had long since admired Thiago and it soon became clear during their discussions that the feeling was mutual. The 29-year-old playmaker had been on the receiving end of Klopp’s Liverpool juggernaut when Bayern were dumped out of the Champions League’s last 16 in March 2019 after a 3-1 defeat at the Allianz Arena. A few weeks earlier he had been blown away by the atmosphere in a goalless first leg stalemate at Anfield.
Watching Liverpool’s march to Premier League title glory in 2019-20 had served to strengthen his desire to one day experience life in England’s top flight.
Having enjoyed a trophy-laden seven years in Germany, he informed Bayern he wanted to pursue a new challenge. That new deal was rejected and, having entered the final year of his existing contract, he knew the serial Bundesliga champions would have little option but to sell him.
When he said his emotional goodbyes to his team-mates at the end of last season he didn’t think he would be returning to the Sabener Strasse training complex. He had already put his house in Munich up for sale.
But Thiago had to be patient. He ended up starting pre-season back at Bayern after this month’s international fixtures.
Finally, early on Thursday, he was informed that the finer details of an agreement between Liverpool sporting director Michael Edwards and Bayern counterpart Hasan Salihamidzic had been completed. He again said farewell to team-mates and staff, and the Bayern manager Hansi Flick congratulated Klopp on signing “an extraordinary player and a great person”.
A source with experience of working with Thiago says: “He is a top guy and one of the most professional players in this world. As for Liverpool, it’s a dream come true for him. The dream for him for years has been the Premier League.”
By then, Liverpool’s club doctor Jim Moxon had flown to Munich to oversee his medical. A four-year deal worth around £200,000 per week was already in place. His favoured No 6 shirt was conveniently vacant following Dejan Lovren’s move to Zenit St Petersburg in July.
Klopp had secured the services of a man he regards as “a game-changer”. The manager had pushed hard for the deal to get done and ultimately FSG president Mike Gordon and Edwards delivered.
For Liverpool, it was always about trying to make the numbers work after revenues were hit heavily by the COVID-19 pandemic. They had long since known that Bayern’s asking price was €30 million (£27 million).
Until recently, their stance was that they would only proceed with thrashing out a deal if another central midfielder was to leave the club. Liverpool had been braced for a bid from Barcelona for Georginio Wijnaldum, who has entered the final year of his contract. However, with no offers forthcoming and with the Dutchman not pushing for a transfer, earlier this week Liverpool made their move for Thiago.
Edwards is a famously tough negotiator and the passage of time had strengthened Liverpool’s hand. Thiago’s heart was set on Anfield and Bayern were keen for the saga not to overshadow the start to their new season.
The breakdown of the fee is extraordinary given the calibre of the player Liverpool have signed. They will pay a guaranteed £20 million with the rest to potentially follow in add-ons related to team success and individual awards. However, The Athletic understands that £20 million will be spread over the course of Thiago’s contract, with an initial outlay of just £5 million. Put into context, Edwards sold striker Dominic Solanke to Bournemouth for £19 million last year.
“It’s a fantastic deal for the football club,” says a Liverpool source close to the negotiations. “With Thiago having some time off and then the international fixtures at the start of the month, there was no rush to get it done. Klopp wanted the player, the player wanted Liverpool and Bayern were willing to deal.”
It’s a statement signing and the sense of excitement among supporters when the news of a fee being agreed was broken by The Athletic was replicated at Melwood when Klopp’s squad arrived for duty on Thursday.
“All the boys were talking about it,” one dressing-room source tells The Athletic. “A signing like this gives everyone a boost. It shows that the club really mean business and extra competition for places puts even more hunger in the squad.
“We’re not talking about someone coming in as back-up, we’re talking about an elite player who has won loads of trophies and can really make a big difference on the field. He fits the ilk of the kind of player you want to see Liverpool bring in.
“The midfield is one area that Klopp regularly rotates and, with the schedule as it is, the more options we have in there the better.”
The signing of Thiago, whose father Mazinho was a World Cup winner with Brazil in 1994, represents a significant departure from the transfer policy that helped Liverpool win the Champions League, UEFA Super Cup, Club World Cup and the title in the space of 13 months. Owner FSG has always favoured a model of investing in younger talent with big potential.
Klopp has traditionally elevated players into the world-class bracket rather than bought gems at the peak of their career who didn’t need polishing. Even big-money buys such as Virgil van Dijk and Alisson weren’t serial winners the way Thiago is.
In fact, prior to Thiago, the only player over the age of 26 who Liverpool had paid a fee for during Klopp’s reign was Estonian centre-back Ragnar Klavan, a modest £4.2 million stop-gap purchase from Augsburg of Germany in 2016.
This wasn’t a signing being pushed over an extended period by Liverpool’s esteemed team of data analysts. In fact, he was outside of their prescribed remit. However, when Edwards asked them to examine the numbers on Thiago, their findings backed up why Klopp was so desperate to bring him on board.
His expert range of passing and creative spark are well-known. But just as important to Liverpool was the data in terms of winning back possession and operating in tight spaces by keeping the ball when under pressure. He ticked all the boxes.
Thiago suffered a serious knee injury in 2014 which ruled him out for a year but Liverpool had no concerns on that front. He had proved his robust nature by clocking up 220 games for club and country over the past five seasons.
The absence of any real sell-on value, given that he will be 33 when his contract runs out, was deemed unimportant given the relatively low transfer fee and the commercial benefits his signing will undoubtedly yield. Shirt sales since Nike took over from New Balance as the club’s kit supplier this summer are already up by more than 20 per cent and Thiago’s arrival is bound to fuel demand further.
“The player made a strong, early commitment to come to us,” a senior member of staff at Melwood tells The Athletic. “Looking at the fixture list, we knew we needed depth in midfield. Thiago can play the final ball and that’s something that was missing. He’s also outstanding in terms of being press-resistant and he has a superb football brain.”
Klopp and his backroom staff had a drink together in Hotel Gut Brandlhof, close to the picturesque town of Saalfelden, watching the Champions League final during last month’s pre-season training camp in Austria. All eyes were on Thiago, who ran the show and was integral to Bayern’s triumph over Paris Saint-Germain.
It was a performance which reinforced Klopp’s belief that he was an elegant player who could give Liverpool a new dimension. Klopp regards him as one of the most complete and balanced midfielders he’s ever seen.
He and assistant Pep Lijnders often talk about the need for Liverpool to stay “unpredictable”. They like to keep opponents guessing. It’s why they work to ensure that the style of the team evolves from year to year.
So much of their attacking threat currently comes from the wide areas, with the quality provided by full-backs Trent Alexander-Arnold and Andy Robertson. But with Thiago on board, they will have someone capable of dissecting defences from central areas. The front three of Mohamed Salah, Sadio Mane and Roberto Firmino should be licking their lips.
“Improving this title-winning team isn’t easy,” says another senior Melwood source. “But Thiago is one of the few who can. In the end, the deal was a no-brainer.”
His presence will give Klopp give greater flexibility in terms of whether to play 4-3-3 or 4-2-3-1. It also makes signing another centre-back to replace Lovren less important, given that Thiago’s presence frees up Fabinho to play in the back line when needs must.
Liverpool insist the arrival of Thiago doesn’t mean that another senior midfielder is inevitably on the way out. Wijnaldum has indicated he wants to stay put for the coming season following positive talks with Klopp but a number of fringe men will depart to generate cash. The first of those appears to be Holland youth international Ki-Jana Hoever, who looks set to join Wolves for a fee of over £10 million.
“Klopp knows he needs to sell but he wants to as well,” says a source close to the owners. “He’s wary of the squad becoming bloated.”
Having suffered at the hands of Bayern cherry-picking the likes of Robert Lewandowski, Mats Hummels and Mario Gotze when he was in charge of German rivals Borussia Dortmund, Klopp has now lured an elite midfielder in his prime away from the new European champions.
It’s testament to Klopp’s pulling power and Liverpool’s current status globally. Six years ago, Liverpool’s attempts to sign Toni Kroos involved Brendan Rodgers asking Steven Gerrard to send the Germany midfielder a text message.
Thiago had also been linked with Manchester United this summer but although they held discussions with his representatives there were no direct talks with Bayern.
He had been pursued by both Arsenal and Chelsea in recent years, too. Bayern put feelers out to those two clubs once again in the hope of creating a bidding war with Liverpool, but it never developed. Sources indicate that other potential suitors were quoted salary demands of £17 million a year (£327,000 per week). Barcelona did consider re-signing him, but swapping Arthur for Juventus’ Miralem Pjanic was deemed a more sensible financial decision.
Thiago and his wife, Julia Vigas, had previously expressed a wish to live in London, so when Liverpool became an option some around him weren’t sure if it would appeal to him but he soon put them right. A move to Manchester City and a reunion with Pep Guardiola, who had taken him along in 2013 when he swapped the Nou Camp for Bayern, was never on the cards.
“They had a good professional relationship but as with many players under Pep’s management, the experience together was too intense. Very, very few go running back to him,” one source close to the player and to Barcelona explains.
Thiago really should have graced the Premier League long before now. In 2013, a deal was effectively done to take him from Barcelona to Manchester United. United had tracked him for years and had a mountain of scouting reports, from his days playing for Spain Under-16s right through to life as a full international.
He was 22 and the retiring United manager Sir Alex Ferguson viewed him as one of his two leaving presents to his successor. The other was to bomb out Wayne Rooney following their fallout. However, incoming manager David Moyes decided to keep Rooney and dithered over Thiago.
Both the fee and personal terms had been agreed but Moyes got cold feet. He decided that he didn’t feel comfortable spending money on a player he had never seen play live. Moyes even had a clause in his contract that allowed a certain number of private jets each season for watching players.
The deal collapsed and Moyes ended up going back to previous club Everton to sign Marouane Fellaini for £27.5 million on deadline day. Moyes had also wanted Cesc Fabregas but that failed to materialise too.
Seven years on, Thiago has finally arrived in the Premier League and Klopp’s Liverpool have the show of ambition in the transfer market which will fuel the belief they can retain their crown.
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