++ [ originally posted by Erik ] ++
Stop that, that was said in confidence you traitor
Stop that, that was said in confidence you traitor
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Nick Against the World (29 Viewers)
- Thread starter IncuboRossonero
- Start date
prolly breach of some privacy act
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It's an odd phenomenon that seems to have some things wrapped up into identity. Part of that identity is unified with others. Part of that identity is separate from others.
I grew up on the South Side of Chicago, where every ethnic group in the area wore their hyphenated American stripes proudly on jackets, T-shirts, bumper stickers, etc. Italian-Americans. Irish-Americans. Mexican-Americans. Polish-Americans. Croatian-Americans. (Yes, even some Lithuanian-Americans, which was the clan I came from.)
On the one end, they all seem to identify themselves as Americans at some point or in some situations -- and particularly when it comes down to issues on a global scale. Many will wave the U.S. flag as much as anyone. And many see themselves as Americans when it comes to things like terrorism and issues of national pride.
But they also seem to have a strong sense of personal identity separate from each other wrapped into the first part of their hyphenations. It's what makes the Czech-Americans different from the German-Americans there. I'd liken it a little to the identities people get when they wear the T-shirts of certain bands, or even the sports teams that they follow. But they revel in those differences that aren't distinctively American at all.
The real irony is that for the groups that seemed to express both identities the strongest, they seemed to be less of a fully feldge member of either. Not exactly quite American. Not exactly quite their hyphenation. But within their own group, yes.
I grew up on the South Side of Chicago, where every ethnic group in the area wore their hyphenated American stripes proudly on jackets, T-shirts, bumper stickers, etc. Italian-Americans. Irish-Americans. Mexican-Americans. Polish-Americans. Croatian-Americans. (Yes, even some Lithuanian-Americans, which was the clan I came from.)
On the one end, they all seem to identify themselves as Americans at some point or in some situations -- and particularly when it comes down to issues on a global scale. Many will wave the U.S. flag as much as anyone. And many see themselves as Americans when it comes to things like terrorism and issues of national pride.
But they also seem to have a strong sense of personal identity separate from each other wrapped into the first part of their hyphenations. It's what makes the Czech-Americans different from the German-Americans there. I'd liken it a little to the identities people get when they wear the T-shirts of certain bands, or even the sports teams that they follow. But they revel in those differences that aren't distinctively American at all.
The real irony is that for the groups that seemed to express both identities the strongest, they seemed to be less of a fully feldge member of either. Not exactly quite American. Not exactly quite their hyphenation. But within their own group, yes.
Jae, in America I feel like I'm Italian and I feel like an American when I'm visiting Italy. You are absolutely correct, we don't fit in anywhere. I am thankful that my family raised me with an awareness of my ancestoral roots, but I chose to really embrace all things Italian as I got older and met with discrimination due to my Italian name and ethnicity. Honestly, nobody in New Jersey (where I was raised) ever considered me or other Italian-Americans as "American" until one polarising event: November 4, 1979. I was 13 years old when the American embassy in Tehran was overrun and Amercian hostages were held captive for 444 days. As of that day, Americans had an enemy and Italians and Greeks and Poles were no longer "foreigners" in our own neighborhoods.
@Libero - thanks for your response, and yes, I did think that you were among the Christian Democrats. My wife supports that party, but she is unaware of its criminal past. You make a good point about the former Communists who have shifted toward the center without reconciling their past. This is why Fidel Castro is my political ideal - Once a Communist, always a Communist. Why should he change?
Andreotti, I have always suspected, was one step above being knee-deep in mafia activity. I believe that he enjoyed all the mafia money and benefitted from never having to fear for his life, without ever having to call the Salvo brothers or Ciancimino and ask them what he should do. Andreotti was a far enough removed to avoid a conviction, but his greatest fear was an audit fo the money trail.
Andreotti, I have always suspected, was one step above being knee-deep in mafia activity. I believe that he enjoyed all the mafia money and benefitted from never having to fear for his life, without ever having to call the Salvo brothers or Ciancimino and ask them what he should do. Andreotti was a far enough removed to avoid a conviction, but his greatest fear was an audit fo the money trail.
That made me think.
One analogy is how you can always bicker with your family, but no matter what, if an outside force comes against it all the bickering drops and theres unity that wasnt seen before.
I suppose its like belonging to a group within a group.
As for two equal groups- I believe thats where the real conflict will lie. A certain ex was a redhead. Irish mom, Polish dad, yet her inclination was wholly towards Irish pride.
One analogy is how you can always bicker with your family, but no matter what, if an outside force comes against it all the bickering drops and theres unity that wasnt seen before.
I suppose its like belonging to a group within a group.
As for two equal groups- I believe thats where the real conflict will lie. A certain ex was a redhead. Irish mom, Polish dad, yet her inclination was wholly towards Irish pride.
Greg, would I be correct to say the Southside of Chicago is where the majority of European immigrants called home years ago while the Northside is where primarily the South and Central Americans and Asians settled in the city?
I drove through many of the parts of North Chicago, right through Chinatown and parts of the Korean and Costa Rican sectors of the city. To be honest I have never really seen something like that before, even in Washington DC and the parts of New York I visited.
I drove through many of the parts of North Chicago, right through Chinatown and parts of the Korean and Costa Rican sectors of the city. To be honest I have never really seen something like that before, even in Washington DC and the parts of New York I visited.
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