Nick Against the World (41 Viewers)

[IncuboRossonero]

Milan club doctor Massimiliano Sala said that in the case of players who refused the blood tests more stringent tests were carried out on the urine sample.

"If a player refuses to put himself forward for a blood analysis he doesn't do it to escape from an anti-doping control because in reality on the basis of that refusal he undergoes a more accurate control ," Sala said.

 

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[Respaul]

++ [ originally posted by IncuboRossonero ] ++
firstly, a urine test is sufficient to detect most banned substances (such as EPO ..remember that one?!)

You wanna check your research on that one Nick... Look at the differences between the now accepted only true test for EPO use (The newer blood test) and the Urine test.... You can quite easily take EPO without failing the urine test... Its proven look it up. The urine test cannot be counted on to detect EPO use.

HGH cannot be detected by urine test, transfusions (the current choice amongst athletes) cannot be detected by Urine tests... actovegen, aranesp etc etc cannot be detected by urine test, possibly most importantly the use of insulin cannot be detected by urine test, the list goes on and on... The urine test is no longer an acceptable tool to catch dopers or a satisfactory measure to be employed by coni and the figc agaisnt Doping.

Paul is absolutely right a player can refuse a blood test.

Would i have made such a statement if it wasnt true? .... NO


On the whole a reasonable though somewhat predictable response.
You have yet to say what you think of coni and the figc's statements?

 

[Respaul]

++ [ originally posted by IncuboRossonero ] ++
Milan club doctor Massimiliano Sala said that in the case of players who refused the blood tests more stringent tests were carried out on the urine sample.

"If a player refuses to put himself forward for a blood analysis he doesn't do it to escape from an anti-doping control because in reality on the basis of that refusal he undergoes a more accurate control ," Sala said.

Im sorry nick... but that is jus a standard response to satisfy those that know nothing of the subject and has no real relevance, As i stated earlier so many of the choice drugs used by athletes to day are not possible to detect by urine test alone... as such looking at the urine test more closely will make No difference whatsoever... The only reason for the extended urine test is if you have the blood test to go with it as the results of the extended urine test can confirm or deny anomalies in the blood sample.

Please do some research before you place that rubbish in front of me





Also... what about Galliani's recent statement regarding the blood test ::

"Anyone not giving a sample should not be playing football. Not only should they not be called up for the national team but should also change profession,"

 

[ßöмßäяðîëя]

Cummon, doping is illigal, but it is fun. Let's start taking steroids too, could you imagine a 120 kilo Crespo.

 

[IncuboRossonero]

++ [ originally posted by Shadowfax ] ++


Im sorry nick... but that is jus a standard response to satisfy those that know nothing of the subject and has no real relevance, As i stated earlier so many of the choice drugs used by athletes to day are not possible to detect by urine test alone... as such looking at the urine test more closely will make No difference whatsoever... The only reason for the extended urine test is if you have the blood test to go with it as the results of the extended urine test can confirm or deny anomalies in the blood sample.

Please do some research before you place that rubbish in front of me

What rubbish...its a layman's reponse which makes a lot of sense. Sometimes one has to look at the common approach to it:

If someone is using illegal substances why bring these things to the forefront in REFUSING a blood test but submitting to a urine test? One is only bringing more attention to the situation.
Given Gattuso's anti-establishment attitude and 'not giving an inch' I'm not surprised he is refusing to adhere to a policy which is neither set in stone nor clear.

FIGC response? that a player who refuses will NOT play for the NT? I agree...but they are kind of surpassing their competence (power wise) as I don't think they have the right to refuse a player when the regulation does not force a test.

 

[IncuboRossonero]

++ [ originally posted by Shadowfax ] ++
Also... what about Galliani's recent statement regarding the blood test ::

"Anyone not giving a sample should not be playing football. Not only should they not be called up for the national team but should also change profession,"

I don't think he will change his TUNE anytime soon...Milan pride themselves on reputation and class. They are not afraid of getting rid of trouble makers or individuals who will bring down the image of the team regardless of their talent: Davids, Contra, Panucci and Coco were all shown the door. NO player is above the team...that goes for Rino too.

 

[Eaglesnake_1]

Adriano Galliani, appena un anno fa cosi' si era espresso: "Chi non fa i controlli del sangue non deve giocare a calcio. Non solo non deve andare in Nazionale, deve cambiare mestiere". Forse avra' cambiato idea, visto che Gattuso e' gia' in ritiro con Lippi e sembra difficile ipotizzare un suo allontanamento dal club azzurro. Un fatto comunque e' certo: sospetti e veleni a parte, la gaffe a livello di immagine per il club campione d'Italia non e' di poco conto.

 

[Fred]

++ [ originally posted by IncuboRossonero ] ++


ahhhh somehand Pizza a tissue please

i actually like being a teenager,didnt you?

 

[Bjerknes]

http://www.channel4.com/sport/football_italia/mar22h.html



Why didn't you want to take the test Rino?

 

[IncuboRossonero]

++ [ originally posted by Andy ] ++
http://www.channel4.com/sport/football_italia/mar22h.html



Why didn't you want to take the test Rino?

www.gazzetta.it

Rino took the test and is making it available for all to see the results..he said he is willing to give "10 litres" if necessary..he also said his doping is Chili pepper and a horseshoe up his ass. More over he stated that he entered the 'test' room at 11:30 pm after being dead tired and with a confusion in the room..10 people mingling about....needles piled up. He stated he is not an animal ... if it is to be done..it is to be done professionally.

Like I said "MUCH ADO ABOUT NOTHING"

“Quando sono entrato nella sala antidoping dell'Olimpico erano le 23.30, avevo tutto lo stress della partita, c'erano dieci persone e una gran confusione, e le siringhe sigillate buttate da una parte. Non siamo animali, nè io, nè i miei colleghi”. “Possono venire anche a casa a farmi le analisi del sangue - ha aggiunto Gattuso - ma se non ci sono regolamenti chiari non si può andare avanti. Io ho firmato il consenso a queste iniziative, ma ogni volta se ne inventano una nuova: prima il controllo c'è, poi non c'è, poi ritorna”.

 

[Respaul]

++ [ originally posted by IncuboRossonero ] ++


www.gazzetta.it

Rino took the test and is making it available for all to see the results..he said he is willing to give "10 litres" if necessary..

Doesnt mean anything really... Rio took the test 48 hours later as well...
Taking a test 48 hours later is plenty enough to mask anything in your system as everyone knows.

More over he stated that he entered the 'test' room at 11:30 pm after being dead tired and with a confusion in the room..10 people mingling about....needles piled up. He stated he is not an animal ... if it is to be done..it is to be done professionally.

And we are supposed to like sheep believe that? ... This has been denied by several witnesses

Like I said "MUCH ADO ABOUT NOTHING"

Not really... No



How exactly was my other post..'Rubbish'

It was a factual statement as to the use of the extended urine test... how exactly a fact is rubbish i do not know




BTW: I am not saying they have or have not taken anything... my original post was jus to ask your thoughts on the issue

 

[Bjerknes]

++ [ originally posted by IncuboRossonero ] ++


www.gazzetta.it

Rino took the test and is making it available for all to see the results..he said he is willing to give "10 litres" if necessary..he also said his doping is Chili pepper and a horseshoe up his ass. More over he stated that he entered the 'test' room at 11:30 pm after being dead tired and with a confusion in the room..10 people mingling about....needles piled up. He stated he is not an animal ... if it is to be done..it is to be done professionally.

Like I said "MUCH ADO ABOUT NOTHING"

“Quando sono entrato nella sala antidoping dell'Olimpico erano le 23.30, avevo tutto lo stress della partita, c'erano dieci persone e una gran confusione, e le siringhe sigillate buttate da una parte. Non siamo animali, nè io, nè i miei colleghi”. “Possono venire anche a casa a farmi le analisi del sangue - ha aggiunto Gattuso - ma se non ci sono regolamenti chiari non si può andare avanti. Io ho firmato il consenso a queste iniziative, ma ogni volta se ne inventano una nuova: prima il controllo c'è, poi non c'è, poi ritorna”.

I'm not that good at reading Italian so your summary could make it seem to be "much ado about nothing," however with what people are saying it might actually be something. I think players who refuse a blood test are rather suspicious characters, and him giving a urine sample instead just seems a bit strange. All this after Galliani slams players who don't take the tests..

 

[mikhail]

"I’ll even give 10 litres if they want. I have nothing to hide because my doping is hot chilli peppers and hard work in the week."

Anyone else eager to see Gatusso give ten litres? Should slow him down for a week or forever.

Seriously, if there is no compulsary test, he's within his rights not to give a sample. If anyone needs to be castigated here, it's the Italian FA for leting such a farce occur legally.

 

[Vinman]

Paul is 100% correct.

EPO and human growth hormone (HGH) CANNOT be detected in a urine sample

A blood test is required to detect these substances (and thats not always fullproof, either)

I'm not saying that Riino and Pancaro took anything illegal, but it wouldnt surprise me if they did

Look at all sports- baseball, American football, hockey, all olympic sports, bodybuilding, bicycling, soccer, and even my other favorite sport ; boxing, are all infested with performance enhancing drugs

 

[mikhail]

++ [ originally posted by Vinman ] ++
Paul is 100% correct.

EPO and human growth hormone (HGH) CANNOT be detected in a urine sample

True, but my point stands. They have done nothing wrong. The onus is on the governing body, in this case the Italian FA, to sort the rules out.

 

[Vinman]

++ [ originally posted by mikhail ] ++

True, but my point stands. They have done nothing wrong. The onus is on the governing body, in this case the Italian FA, to sort the rules out.

I agree with that too...

If the FIGC doesnt have a policy in place , then whose fault is that ??

 

[Respaul]

++ [ originally posted by Vinman ] ++
Paul is 100% correct.

I wouldnt post something on such a subject if it wasnt vinni.

EPO and human growth hormone (HGH) CANNOT be detected in a urine sample

Thats not exactly true Vin... but close.
HGH cannot in anyway shape or form be detected in urine.

Using the old Urine epo test you can detect epo for a very short time... only whilst in a certain state... Using the urine test you can only detect epo for approx 3 days after administration... bearing in mind after a course of treatment of epo the effects peak for in the region of 3 weeks, (and if taken in the correct manor the drug will raise your natural haematocrit level for a very long time.(in the region of 6 months) as long as you continue your normal training routine. not a massive benefit but still a sustained improvement).

Where as the latest blood test will detect epo for upto 3 weeks after administration.

The urine test has also been proven to be easy to get around, It also does not detect many of the current forms of artificial epo

 

[Respaul]

++ [ originally posted by mikhail ] ++

True, but my point stands. They have done nothing wrong. The onus is on the governing body, in this case the Italian FA, to sort the rules out.

This is correct and as i said earlier the stand point of the figc and coni regarding this is an absolute joke.

However i do think there is a moral issue here and also the simple question..... Why?

 

[mikhail]

++ [ originally posted by Shadowfax ] ++
However i do think there is a moral issue here and also the simple question..... Why?

I tend to agree with you there. It does look rather suspicious. The reasons given for not taking the test seem really unsatisfactory.

 

[IncuboRossonero]

++ [ originally posted by Andy ] ++


I'm not that good at reading Italian so your summary could make it seem to be "much ado about nothing," however with what people are saying it might actually be something. I think players who refuse a blood test are rather suspicious characters, and him giving a urine sample instead just seems a bit strange. All this after Galliani slams players who don't take the tests..

Given his character...given his stubborn ways and given his lack of patience for stupidity I think its perfectly understandable he refused.
By the way Paul, Rino admitted that the needless were WRAPPED but people in the room didn't know if they were coming or going and there was actually an autograph hound in the room (WTF).
I think Galliani is right..RINO should have submitted to the blood test. No excuse. However, if the system treats players like barn yard animals or cows at a bovine auction AND its not mandatory then its a good peaceful demonstration by a player to bring out the weakness and poor procedure of the system.
The radio kept saying today that EPO can be detected in URINE (I am far from an expert in anything scientific so I will believe Vin and Paul). The 48 hour delay..everyone mentioned it today but some experts said the "HARD STUFF" would still be in his system and it is the small stuff that would not. More over, apparently Milan had a third party do a test the morning after which is to be released as well.