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Rami

The Linuxologist
Dec 24, 2004
8,065
#41
Why do they hate us? Listen to Qana (again)

By Jonathan Cook

07/31/06 "Information Clearing House" -- -- The crowds in Beirut last year demanding a Cedar Revolution, “the first shoots of democracy” supposedly planted by the United States, are a distant memory. Yesterday we saw in their place the fury of Lebanon directed against the capital’s United Nations building -- an early “birth pang” in Condoleeza Rice’s new Middle East.

If Israel wanted to widen its war, it could not have chosen a better way to achieve it than by sending its war planes back to the mixed Muslim and Christian village of Qana in south Lebanon to massacre civilians there, as if marking a morbid anniversary. A decade ago, Israeli shelling on the village killed more than 100 Lebanese civilians sheltering in a local UN post.

To the Lebanese, and most in the Arab world, the United Nations now symbolises everything that is corrupt about the international community and its “conscience”. The world body, it has become clearer by the day, is a mere plaything of the United States and, by default, of Israel too. It is nothing more than a talking shop, one so enfeebled that it lacks the moral backbone even to denouce unequivocally the murder of four of its unarmed observers by the Israeli army last week. How can Lebanon expect protection for its civilians from an international body as emasculated as this?

The rage we saw directed against the United Nations building in Beirut, as if we needed reminding, will be converted in time into more violence against the West, to more 9/11s and to more London and Madrid bombings. Will these attacks wake up the slumbering Western publics to stop their leaders engineering a global war, or will more of us simply be persuaded that the Arab world is fundamentally irrational and savage?

Why do they hate us? Qana provides the answers but it appears few in the West are really listening.

All morning when Arab channels were showing the crushed building in Qana, and the Red Crescent workers extracting from under it more than 60 bodies, mostly children, embalmed in blood and dust, Israel was showing family movies on its main television networks.

Foreign channels were hardly better. It is in the first responses of the Western broadcasters -- before they have had time to hone and polish their scripts and cover all the bases -- that their partisan agenda is at its most transparent. So all morning their attention was directed less at the new Qana massacre than at the destruction of the UN building in Beirut, as though it was our last rampart against the rampaging hordes of Islam. In this framing of the world, our provocative acts appear so much less significant than the mystifying response, the Other’s delusional anger.

Noticeably, our news anchors were careful to avoid referring to the massacre of Lebanese children at Qana as “an escalation” by Israel. That word, intoned so solemnly when eight Israeli railway workers were killed by a Hizbullah rocket in Haifa a fortnight ago, was not uttered on this occasion. According to our media, when we suffer, it is an escalation demanding retaliation; when they suffer, maybe it is time to begin talks about talks about a ceasefire.

BBC World’s presenter in Beirut, Lyse Doucet, personifies this moral blindness. She chided Lebanese speaker after speaker for the crowds attacking the UN building. “Why are they doing this when the UN is trying to broker a ceasefire?” she demanded in bafflement of each. The headlines at 11am GMT even began with her quoting an expression of regret she had extracted from a Hizbullah MP for the attack on the Beirut building, as though amid all that morning’s carnage the destruction of UN property was the real issue.

This presumably is what our media mean when they talk about “balance”.

Jim Muir, the BBC’s fine reporter in Tyre, observed in the same broadcast that it was non-combatants who were paying the price in this war, and that the majority of the dead on both sides were civilian. Where did he get that idea? In Israel, the great majority of dead are soldiers, but you would hardly know it listening to our media. In the same spirit, Jonathan Charles in Haifa observed that it had been “a difficult day” for both countries, adding -- in case we could not fathom what he meant -- that Israel had faced a hard day on the diplomatic front. What lengths our broadcasters must go to to remain even-handed when we massacre innocence.

Israel, as usual, can be relied on to defend the indefensible. A government spokeswoman told the BBC in another easy-ride interview that the army would never target an area if it knew Lebanese civilians were there. Then she performed a somersault of logic several times by arguing in her country’s defence that the army knows Hizbullah hides behind civilians. If she is right, then even as the pilot fired on the Hizbullah fighters he assumed were inside the building he knew civilians would pay the price too. But, of course, Hizbullah fighters were not in the building.

This endless sophistry is designed to lull us into acquiescence. Only vigilance keeps us asking the right questions. How, for example, after its reconnaissance planes and spy drones have been hovering over south Lebanon for the best part of three weeks, was Israel not aware that hundreds of civilians were still in Qana? But no one raised that question.

Cut through the apology, both from Israel and our media, and the aerial strike on Qana looks, at the very best interpretation, recklessly ambivalent about the likely civilian death toll. A cynic might go further. Was the attack meant as a warning to other civilians still in south Lebanon to get out -- and fast? After its clear failure to win a conventional war, does the Israeli army want a freer hand to begin the job of incinerating Hizbullah, using its cluster and incendiary bombs, the Middle East’s napalm? Was the answer to be found in the statement of Israel’s Prime Minister, Ehud Olmert, yesterday that, generously, he was giving civilians 24 hours safe passage to get out of the south.

Or was the massacre crafted as punishment for Qana’s villagers, for those living among Hizbullah, for those who are related to Hizbullah, for those who believe that Hizbullah is their best hope of preventing another Israeli occupation? Did Israel’s Justice Minister Haim Ramon not make precisely this point last week when he announced in a cabinet meeting: “Everyone in southern Lebanon is a terrorist and is connected to Hizbollah.”?

Moshe Marzouk, a former senior Israeli army officer who has turned his hand to being a “counter-terrorism expert” in one of the country’s leading academic institutions, told the American Jewish weekly The Forward that one of Israel’s goal in this war is to teach Lebanon’s Shiite community that it will pay a tremendous price for Hizbullah’s actions. Maybe Qana was part of the price he was talking about.

Israel offers a second excuse for the massacre: it says it dropped leaflets on Qana warning civilians to leave the area. Again, our cynic could point out that those leaflets were dropped 10 days ago, as they were across most of south Lebanon. Qana had no reason to expect worse than anywhere else -- and possibly it expected better, assuming that Israel would not dare to stage a war crime here for a second time after it troops massacred more than 100 civilians in 1996.

Our cynic could also note that Israel has bombed the escape roads from the south and is shooting at anything that moves on what is left of them. And he could point out that many of Qana’s families have no cars to leave in, that they can find no petrol to fill the cars that remain after Israel bombed all the petrol stations, and that in any case they have nowhere else to go.

Though these things are all true, they distract us from the real issue: that Israel has no right to empty south Lebanon of its population, to make a million people homeless, just because its leaflets say they must leave. Jim Muir let us and himself down when he observed that south Lebanon is “not an area which can become depopulated overnight”. No it isn’t, but the deeper question is why should it be depopulated? At what point did the international broadcasters fall unnoticed behind an agenda that demands south Lebanon be ethnically cleansed to satisfy Israel?

Our media are oblivious to the double standards. Did Hizbullah’s leader Hassan Nasrallah not publicly warn that he would attack Haifa days before he did so, if Israel continued its aggression and refused to negotiate over a prisoner swap? Were Israelis not warned to leave too? And would we allow Hizbulllah to use that as a justification for its rocket fire on Israel?

On Friday Hizbullah fired its first khaibar missile, packed with 100kg of explosives, close by Nazareth -- we could feel the earth tremble from the impact. The Shiite militia waited more than two weeks before launching a warhead of that size, after it made repeated threats to do so if Israel continued its onslaught. Who will point out that had Hizbullah wanted to, if Israel’s destruction was the real aim, it could have fired those khaibar rockets from day one?

And on Saturday Nasrallah promised to strike “beyond Haifa” with even more lethal rockets if Israel refused to countenance a ceasefire. Who on the BBC, or CNN or any of our other channels will quote that warning as justification if Hizbullah extends its fire to Hadera, Netanya or Tel Aviv in the coming days?

This is not a war of two narratives, nor even of two worldviews. It is a war in which we, the West, speak for both sides. Where we define the meaning of suffering and death, and of victory and peace. Where our humanity alone counts because we feel only our own pain as the birth pangs take hold.

Jonathan Cook is a writer and journalist based in Nazareth, Israel. His book, “Blood and Religion: The Unmasking of the Jewish and Democratic State”, is published by Pluto Press. His website is www.jkcook.net

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article14301.htm
 

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mnementh

Senior Member
Jun 5, 2005
2,122
#42
edpiero dude, anyone will do anything to protect his country from a massacare - you're underestimating the ideology of Hizballah. they care for nothing but death and destruction to all heretics of the world. Life means nothing to them... they wanted events like this to happen for their propaganda use, it's very obvious to me. Indeed, Tel Aviv is a nice city man. The best though is Jerusalem. :)

Ze Tahir, sorry man, but this is our homeland, and this is Israel. Palestina is simply a roman name given to the land of Israel.
 

scorpion10

Crusader of Justice
Jul 28, 2005
110
#43
mnementh said:
scorpion (probably cancer more likely), I won't answer to you since you're an ignorant nazi. Like I said. Just inventing stuff which has nothing to do with reality and blabbering about it like a lunatic while belittling the holocaust is a classic nazi argument, and it's very obvious what you are.

And REbel, we'll see who laughs last. Yeah, Hizballah is all mighty against innocent children like those who were killed in Israel the past few days (3 arab children died in israel yesterday), but we both know he'll end up in a coffin like his son. Kil kalb baj yumo. :p

and no scorpion, he doesn't live in israel, he's just a big phony.

And about anti-semitism, it is a phrase coined as a different term to anti-judaism (it sounded bad in german propaganda at the time), the fact that others are semites has nothing to do with it. you can choose any term you want though.
I didnt know it was in Judaism to be soo hateful. I don't know why we bother with people like you. I go to demonstrations and people talk about how an innocent life is an innocent life and here people like you act as if the 1,000 that died in Lebanon is nothing. Sure civilians died in Israel but there are way more on the other side because of your terrorism. And then if anybody says something about the holocaust, theyre a nazi. I repeat the only Nazis are the Israelis. You guys are in deep shit, the truth is coming out. Everyone is on to you. If it wasnt for you guys keeping a leash on some regimes, youd be done. People are on to their governments and it wont be long now. Justice will prevail and Palestenians will be able to live in their land in peace without cowards in tanks running through the streets. Cowards kill innocent people. If you were real men you wouldnt hide behind american made tanks and weapons. You guys use your civilians as sheilds. Start pickin what European country u like cuz it looks like you guys are moving back to where you came from. How about Germany?
 

Rami

The Linuxologist
Dec 24, 2004
8,065
#44
mnementh said:
edpiero dude, anyone will do anything to protect his country from a massacare - you're underestimating the ideology of Hizballah. they care for nothing but death and destruction to all heretics of the world. Life means nothing to them... they wanted events like this to happen for their propaganda use, it's very obvious to me. Indeed, Tel Aviv is a nice city man. The best though is Jerusalem. :)

Ze Tahir, sorry man, but this is our homeland, and this is Israel. Palestina is simply a roman name given to the land of Israel.
Except that you ignored the article just before your post that refutes all of your claims....
 

mnementh

Senior Member
Jun 5, 2005
2,122
#45
why don't you just shut up scoripion ? ignorance is bliss isn't it. stupid ****. You're a nazi, you'll end up like Eichman. Seriously, the U.S should extradite pricks like you to space.

No i didn't Rami, I didn't ignore anything. Btw, another Arab mother and her two children died today from hizballah in Israel. So I wonder who it is that's killing the arabs...

We want peace and we care for every innocent live lost. It is a common interest to all the region to rid itself of fanatic homicidal terrorist organizations such as Hamas and Hizballah and I hope everyone will realise that before innocent lives continue to perish. Or we can just support terrorists and wish for more death like scorpion here wants or we can choose peace. I choose peace. I sincerely believe most Lebanese choose peace as well.
 

Eddy

The Maestro
Aug 20, 2005
12,645
#46
mnementh said:
edpiero dude, anyone will do anything to protect his country from a massacare - you're underestimating the ideology of Hizballah. they care for nothing but death and destruction to all heretics of the world. Life means nothing to them... they wanted events like this to happen for their propaganda use, it's very obvious to me. Indeed, Tel Aviv is a nice city man. The best though is Jerusalem. :)

Ze Tahir, sorry man, but this is our homeland, and this is Israel. Palestina is simply a roman name given to the land of Israel.
From what I know it, Nasrallah is a very nice guy and helps the poor :agree:
No joke.

Hopefully I'll go to either one of them in the future :)
 

Eddy

The Maestro
Aug 20, 2005
12,645
#48
mnementh said:
Yes, it's a joke. :tdown: I'm sure Bin Laden helps the poor as well.

Well from what I know, he speaks a bit of Armenian and he has a hospital free of charge for Armenians, that's good for us :p
 

mnementh

Senior Member
Jun 5, 2005
2,122
#49
edpiero said:
Well from what I know, he speaks a bit of Armenian and he has a hospital free of charge for Armenians, that's good for us :p
Well I would be doubtful of this hospital. Recently, it turned out one of the hospitals (in baal bek) was used as a hizballah arsenal (not the team) center and HQ. It's quite possibly a cover-up edpiero. And make no mistakes, Hizballah firstly targets the Jews but then will target the rest of the heretic world. There is no place for anyone but shiites in their mind.
 

mnementh

Senior Member
Jun 5, 2005
2,122
#50
Notice how fucked up the situation is. Today a special commando force went to an apartment which serves as HQ for missle launching for Hizballah in Tyre. It went in the apartment by ground instead of blasting it from the air and had casuatlies as a result because it's surrounded by terrorists from around. When asked why they went through the ground, the IDF explains that Hizballah is hiding within the civilians purposely and in order to avoid civilian death, they went in by ground trooops even though it would have been very easily to target the apartment from the air. :disagree: yeah..... and Israel is to blame. :tdown: Hizballah when firing missles towards israel is attempting to hit civilians. And that's the whole difference.
 

Hambon

Lion of the Desert
Apr 22, 2005
8,073
#51
Rabbi Weiss remarked, "The Zionists use the Holocaust issue to their benefit. We, Jews who perished in the Holocaust, do not use it to advance our interests. We stress that there are hundreds of thousands Jews around the world who identify with our opposition to the Zionist ideology and who feel that Zionism is not Jewish, but a political agenda...What we want is not a withdrawal to the '67 borders, but to everything included in it, so the country can go back to the Palestinians and we could live with them..." [12][13]

Thats the truth that most isrealis turn thier heads to..... mnementh i am not directing this towards you but i truely beleive that all media is controlled by the jews,they want people to see only what the want them to see....especially the american people with their "Award winning " FOX network...
 

Hambon

Lion of the Desert
Apr 22, 2005
8,073
#52
mnementh said:
Notice how fucked up the situation is. Today a special commando force went to an apartment which serves as HQ for missle launching for Hizballah in Tyre. It went in the apartment by ground instead of blasting it from the air and had casuatlies as a result because it's surrounded by terrorists from around. When asked why they went through the ground, the IDF explains that Hizballah is hiding within the civilians purposely and in order to avoid civilian death, they went in by ground trooops even though it would have been very easily to target the apartment from the air. :disagree: yeah..... and Israel is to blame. :tdown: Hizballah when firing missles towards israel is attempting to hit civilians. And that's the whole difference.
Israel has yet to capture any land in southern Lebanon....they have not been able to secure land for more than a few hours.....Israel cannot win on the ground,they can only bomb innocent civilians from the air like cowards. Imagine if Hizboallah had an airforce? or weapons post WWII i really dont think there would been an Israel .....what do you think?

BTW - watch america will finally call a cease fire within these 2 coming days because they know israel cant gain any land on the ground....
 
OP
Zé Tahir

Zé Tahir

JhoolayLaaaal!
Moderator
Dec 10, 2004
29,281
  • Thread Starter
  • Thread Starter #53
    mnementh said:
    Ze Tahir, sorry man, but this is our homeland, and this is Israel. Palestina is simply a roman name given to the land of Israel.
    How is that just your homeland? You've always been outnumbered in that region by a significant number, so how? Because some religious text of your said so?


    and btw, you're always bolstering about how democratic Israel is. Tell me, isn't "majority rule" part of democracy? But you seem to have left that out of your democracy. Due to the fact that there are more arabs than jews, if the arabs were given their proper voice and power in the country, that would be end of the "jewish" state. Call that democracy?
     

    GordoDeCentral

    Diez
    Moderator
    Apr 14, 2005
    70,801
    #54
    scorpion10 said:
    I didnt know it was in Judaism to be soo hateful. I don't know why we bother with people like you. I go to demonstrations and people talk about how an innocent life is an innocent life and here people like you act as if the 1,000 that died in Lebanon is nothing. Sure civilians died in Israel but there are way more on the other side because of your terrorism. And then if anybody says something about the holocaust, theyre a nazi. I repeat the only Nazis are the Israelis. You guys are in deep shit, the truth is coming out. Everyone is on to you. If it wasnt for you guys keeping a leash on some regimes, youd be done. People are on to their governments and it wont be long now. Justice will prevail and Palestenians will be able to live in their land in peace without cowards in tanks running through the streets. Cowards kill innocent people. If you were real men you wouldnt hide behind american made tanks and weapons. You guys use your civilians as sheilds. Start pickin what European country u like cuz it looks like you guys are moving back to where you came from. How about Germany?

    Anyone who quotes shakespear is a-ok in my book.. great post
     

    mnementh

    Senior Member
    Jun 5, 2005
    2,122
    #55
    hambon said:
    Israel has yet to capture any land in southern Lebanon....they have not been able to secure land for more than a few hours.....Israel cannot win on the ground,they can only bomb innocent civilians from the air like cowards. Imagine if Hizboallah had an airforce? or weapons post WWII i really dont think there would been an Israel .....what do you think?

    BTW - watch america will finally call a cease fire within these 2 coming days because they know israel cant gain any land on the ground....
    your post is contradicting itself. Israel can very well win on the ground but it does not want to pledge a full scale war. As for the air, it's just the opposite. Israel can bomb all lebanon or even nuke it like you know, but it won't do it, because it doesn't want to hurt the civilian population unless unavoidable. Try reading my post again about the commando raid today, you'll see how it refutes your theory of Israel wanting to hurt civilans. Like you say, if one wants to eradicate a country from the air it's very much possible, and it's indeed what hizballah would try to do if it could. But this is the difference between Hizballah and Israel. Israel has a moral code, Hizballah doesn't. And their weapons btw are very modern - they're hi-tech weapons supplied by Iran.
     

    mnementh

    Senior Member
    Jun 5, 2005
    2,122
    #56
    Zé Tahir said:
    How is that just your homeland? You've always been outnumbered in that region by a significant number, so how? Because some religious text of your said so?
    This is false. Jews weren't outnumbered here at all. For hundreds of years for example, there's a majority of Jews in many places in Israel including Jerusalem. Also, population alone doesn't grant you statehood. The arab population saw themselves as part of a larger arab population and didn't see this area as an independent state. It is why they don't even have a name for the land. The Jews however are the only ones who established a strong connection with the land for thousands of years. It's not about textx, it's about facts, history and culture.

    and btw, you're always bolstering about how democratic Israel is. Tell me, isn't "majority rule" part of democracy? But you seem to have left that out of your democracy. Due to the fact that there are more arabs than jews, if the arabs were given their proper voice and power in the country, that would be end of the "jewish" state. Call that democracy?
    There aren't more arabs than Jews in Israel. There are 5 million jews in Israel, 1 million arabs. They all have voting rights and they all enjoy the entire civil rights (arabs more than jews since they pay less taxes and don't serve in the army as well).
     

    Hambon

    Lion of the Desert
    Apr 22, 2005
    8,073
    #57
    mnementh said:
    your post is contradicting itself. :disagree: . As for the air, it's just the opposite. Israel can bomb all lebanon or even nuke it like you know, but it won't do it, because it doesn't want to hurt the civilian population unless unavoidable. Try reading my post again about the commando raid today, you'll see how it refutes your theory of Israel wanting to hurt civilans. Like you say, if one wants to eradicate a country from the air it's very much possible, and it's indeed what hizballah would try to do if it could. But this is the difference between Hizballah and Israel. Israel has a moral code, Hizballah doesn't. And their weapons btw are very modern - they're hi-tech weapons supplied by Iran.
    Isreal doesnt want to wage a full scale war?? thats funny..Plus It can never win on the ground especially against Hizboallah....as for the commando raid today that was just a publicity stunt to show that israel does give a Fcuk bout civilian life.

    Weapons are modern?? my ass bro...if they were there wouldnt be an israeli state.....and isreal nuke lebanon?? they dont have the balls to do so......Israelis in general are cowards....they care more bout thier lives and materials ...they would never risk that...unlike hizboallah who live to die...

    Israel will never defeat hizboallah....
     

    mnementh

    Senior Member
    Jun 5, 2005
    2,122
    #58
    Israel can defeat any army... of course with terrorists, they can always harm you. Like they do to U.S troops in Iraq, there's no 100% escape from terrorism, that's true. The only cowards in this story are the hizballah terrorists who run and hide within civilians, little kids and women, because they're afraid to face the IDF. This is why there are civilian causlties, Hizballah keep running away and hiding within civilian population, and that's sick.

    And yeah, you can say that everything is a publicicty stunt, look at everything in a cynical way and dismiss facts with rhetorics. Or you can just face the reality and see the truth ! This whole conflict started with Hizballah and they're the only ones to blame ... anyone can see it.
     

    mnementh

    Senior Member
    Jun 5, 2005
    2,122
    #60
    Oh how I waited for the insightful comments of Rebel on the issue. :D Read my post again, and try to understand what you read next time. :agree: Forza Israel.
     
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