Naturalising players (10 Viewers)

[vitoria_Ally]

++ [ originally posted by Erik ] ++
The French Republic is known for its humane stance on immigration. Their laws are based on the Gemeinschaft principle; everyone may apply for a French passport and when it is granted to you, you are 100% French.

The German Federation has its laws based on the Gesellschaft principle; unless both of your parents are German born, you're never 100% German.

The Dutch and the Italians are somewhere in between; they demand your family has been in possession of the nationality in question for a certain period of time before you are 100% Dutch or Italian by law.

These differences in opinion and law led to some nations easily naturalising 'foreign' players into their national squads where some other nations refrained from it. Where do you stand on the matter?

Hmm... you're not 100% correct here...
Cause indeed, all countries use those Gemeinschaft and Gesellschaft principles, btw: it's called ius soli (the place you're born determines your citizenship) and ius sanguinins (the citizenship of parents determines your citizenship).

One of them is always principle, but in practice both of them are used in country.

So even if case of Germany, rules are not that strickt.
If one of parents is German, and the other is not, they still have right to choose German citizenship for their kid, otherwise the country would refuse to give to that kid one of the his main rights.
In the face of law such kid is 100% German.

 

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[arc]

England has pride

 

[delpiero10]

++ [ originally posted by archaon ] ++
England has pride

?

 

[Martin]

++ [ originally posted by delpiero10 ] ++
Suppose to be funny?, Camoranesi has Italian family members, Italian passport, and lived in Italy many years plus being and argentine, whats the problem with having him on Italy, its not like France who has full of black players from Africa on their team.

Yes I suppose I was being "funny".

But that parallell you draw with France once agains puts you in a bad light suggesting ignorance, I thought we were over that already?

The question is not about his parents, I could care less. It's about him. Is he Italian? Does he feel Italian? If he does then for my sake he can represent Italy no matter where he's from.

 

[Torkel]

++ [ originally posted by archaon ] ++
England has pride

I feel that your meaning with this sentence is going to upset me, but still, you could explain what you mean by it?

++ [ originally posted by Martin ] ++
The question is not about his parents, I could care less. It's about him. Is he Italian? Does he feel Italian? If he does then for my sake he can represent Italy no matter where he's from.

Agreed.

And I don't understand the argument about some French players descending from Africa. Is it important that they come from Africa instead of Spain or Italy for example?

 

[vitoria_Ally]

France is not good example, when it comes to talk about naturalising players. Most/many of them is from ex-French colonies, and as far as I remember, they have right to get French citizenship very easy cause of that, so it's hard to say about naturalisation in their case.

 

[Lawnchair Bes]

++ [ originally posted by archaon ] ++
England has pride

ye thats why they got a swedish manager. not offence to swedish people intended.

++ [ originally posted by Torkel ] ++

I feel that your meaning with this sentence is going to upset me, but still, you could explain what you mean by it?

true

 

[Martin]

++ [ originally posted by vitoria_Ally ] ++
France is not good example, when it comes to talk about naturalising players. Most/many of them is from ex-French colonies, and as far as I remember, they have right to get French citizenship very easy cause of that, so it's hard to say about naturalisation in their case.

Erik already told us how the Dutch government passed a law to make the citizens of former colonies Dutch citizens. I know the British empire did a similar thing in its day, there was a regulation stating that all citizens of their colonies could move freely and reside anywhere inside the commonwealth. So it's a somewhat common situation.

 

[vitoria_Ally]

Exactly, so it's hard to call those people "naturalising players".

 

[River]

++ [ originally posted by Don Bes ] ++
ye thats why they got a swedish manager.

Yeah thats the most annoying thing in britian for me

To make it worse it annoys me to see him earn a rediculous amount, lose most games, not face the media rantings that every other english manager got after losing and be able to do things like cheat on his girlfriend and have it almost glorified.

f**k off sven.

 

[mikhail]

++ [ originally posted by Erik ] ++
Hold on there John! Holland didn't naturalise any player like Italy did with, for example, Camoranesi!

Kluivert, Davids and Seedorf (and others) were born in the 'colonies'. Because of the gruesome things the Dutch have caused in the colonies in the past it was decided in the second half of the 20th century that everyone who was born the "Kingdom of the Netherlands" was a Dutch citizen. That makes Kluivert, Davids and Seedorf just as Dutch as I am!!

I know Erik. I wasn't talking about naturalisation, a la Deco or Camo, but of immigration, as in the case of Zidane, Pires, et al.