'Murica! (148 Viewers)

campionesidd

Senior Member
Mar 16, 2013
16,828

Post Ironic

Senior Member
Feb 9, 2013
42,253
Only the libtard leftie la la land media misleads, right?

http://www.businessinsider.com/trudeau-quebec-mosque-shooting-fox-news-tweet-2017-1?

:howler:

Fox News left a tweet up for over 24 hours falsely insinuating that a Muslim man was the suspect in the Quebec Mosque shooting before finally complying with a Prime Minister's office request to have the tweet deleted or retracted.

:sergio:

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This breaks my heart
http://www.fox2detroit.com/news/local-news/232856168-story


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
That is heartbreaking.

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@Maddy

This piece is great. http://www.theglobeandmail.com/opin...ing-meaning-in-the-trump-era/article33617746/

Here's a little excerpt.

The phrase “fake news” has lost, or more accurately been robbed of, all meaning in the past few months, so please allow me to try to sort this out by telling you what fake news is not.

Fake news is not news published without thorough research and fact-checking. That’s what we call “bad journalism.”

Fake news is not news that some readers would prefer not to have read about. That is that thing that has traditionally been called “bad news.” That is news you don’t like.

Fake news is not news that, while thoroughly researched and seemingly verified to the best of the publication’s ability, turns out to be false – because honest mistakes do get made, an unfortunate fact of life in any profession.

Fake news is not even distantly related to opinion pieces or editorials that bug you.

A story going to print, and then later evolving – “Panicked people thought they heard another shooter” becomes “No, there is just one suspect” – does not retroactively become “fake news.” In that case, it just becomes “outdated reporting.”

Conspiracy theories are also not fake news, unless your local moon-landing-was-a-hoaxer has taken to publishing his claims at theglobeandmail.com.co. This, by the way, is a classic fake-news move. It’s the old mimicking-the-url,-logo-and-even-layout-of-actual-news-outlets-and-putting-some-generally-hate-filled-fancy-up-on-that-site gambit so popular of late.

Unfortunately, in a startlingly short period of time, all these things, along with a fair amount of just standard totally true news, are increasingly being described as “fake news.”

Which brings us back to Wednesday and Mr. Trump’s accusing CNN of running fake news. Accusing CNN of doing this is a popular pastime with his supporters as well, so, while I would love to say that the term “fake news” is dead, and ask you to please consider this column its obituary, it’s not.

The term fake news lurches on. It’s alive! It proved to be so useful that it has been co-opted, not just as a means of circling the wagons around all the actual lies that the spreaders of fake news profit from, benefit from and enjoy, but also as a means of silencing legitimate journalism and criticism.

Last week, CNN wrote something true that Mr. Trump didn’t like; namely, they reported that a two-page memo – including “allegations that Russian operatives claim to have compromising personal and financial information about Mr. Trump” – had been included in an intelligence briefing presented to Mr. Trump and President Barack Obama.

CNN’s sources included “multiple U.S. officials with direct knowledge of the briefings.” This would very much appear to be news, and CNN did not even go into detail on the specifics of the claims mentioned in the memo, let alone announce they were true.

CNN did its job, but this caused Donald Trump, the same man who built his political career claiming that President Obama, having been born in Kenya, was not a U.S. citizen, and was therefore not actually the president, to tweet, “I win an election easily, a great 'movement’ is verified, and crooked opponents try to belittle our victory with FAKE NEWS. A sorry state!”

He used the term fake news repeatedly this week. He’s like a kid with a new means of delegitimizing the free press. Or maybe not that new. You could be forgiven for feeling as if you’re watching the cultivation of a banana republic.
 

pitbull

Senior Member
Jul 26, 2007
11,045
Really curious why some people want authoritarian leaders. Is it to compensate for their own weakness and insecurity or are they just gullible and ill informed?
because if it works, it's the perfect political system, a good man with lots of power can do lots of good things without having to compromise all the time
 

Maddy

Oracle of Copenhagen
Jul 10, 2009
16,545
because if it works, it's the perfect political system, a good man with lots of power can do lots of good things without having to compromise all the time
Well it doesn't and never have, and it's not the reason why people support an authoritarian regime, there's far more irrational thinking such as fear, insecurity and ignorance behind.

Democracy's strongest asset and it's biggest weakness is the responsibility of those elected. Dmocracies are able to have 'regime-change' without violence; sadly that sometimes means that right-wing populist and anti-democrats like Trump wins.

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:tup:

In our social media-reality terms change so quickly it's almost impossible to navigate. Never have sincere journalism been more important.

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Its litterally crazy Trump gets away with appointing this guy, he is basically a sneaky version of David Duke.
:agree:

Bannon's rise to power is scary.

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wolfowitz, cheney etc. from the Bush administration looks like feeble lambs compared to Bannon.

War-mongering turds, but at least from a neo-con democratic viewpoint.

Not this extreme right wing borderline neo-nazi.
 

pitbull

Senior Member
Jul 26, 2007
11,045
Well it doesn't and never have, and it's not the reason why people support an authoritarian regime, there's far more irrational thinking such as fear, insecurity and ignorance behind.

Democracy's strongest asset and it's biggest weakness is the responsibility of those elected. Dmocracies are able to have 'regime-change' without violence; sadly that sometimes means that right-wing populist and anti-democrats like Trump wins.
Singapore is borderline authoritarian, works well for them. Latvia before WW2 for 6 years was legit authoritarian, easily the best times in our nearly 100 year history, everyone still speaks fondly of those times, I'm sure those are not the only examples
 

Zacheryah

Senior Member
Aug 29, 2010
42,251
FFS man, how long will it take for you to realize the insane cliche caricature Trump is? :D

He is a text book raging narcissistic feeble minded egomaniac who lashes out at anything and everything. Its not really complicated to really get how he is, he friggin flaunts it with every word he says. It has nothing to do with politics but personality and character, he SCREAMS a clownish brash dictator type in every way.


You actually said he can be the bigger man? DID YOU EVEN WATCH the dutch spoof of him you quoted me on? Its HILARIOUS becuase its so friggin true in how insanely dumb and simplistic he acts all the time, open your eyes man :D

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FFS how can anyone get used to the idea that the most powerful man in the world watches simplistic news show all day long and tweets angrily like a child about everything, and this is what he thinks governing is supposed to be :lol:
Why are you attacking me cause i said what he could have done, but didnt ?

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Are you out of your mind? Trump won't ever choose to be the bigger man.
Why are you attacking me when i said what he could have done, but didnt ?

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Zach.

I don't know when, if ever, you are going to get this.

Trump is an absolute scumbag of a man. His narcissism is only trumped by his ignorance.

And it's not that he's not doing anything to improve people's lives, no, he is out there actively hurting people.

I personally have never seen a politician act like him. He has the vocabulary of a 10 year old, seems to have no basic understanding of democracy and human rights, is incredibly volatile and spiteful towards those who do not support him.

The man is a monster.

And you sit there and bullshit about how onesided the media are. Please. Focus on what matters.

They are shocked because the man is basically Hitler.
Trump isnt Hitler. Lets calm down a bit.


Erdogan on the other hand...

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People keep saying he will be impeached, but how realistic is it? Its also likely he will just take stronger and stronger grip on things and become even more authoritarian. The people who voted him in havent shown a hint of turning against him at all. Its still too soon, but it would take insane amount of shit for ppl who voted him to even critique him slightly, things has been so divisive its not about even a hint of rational nation building anymore, just entrenched sides.
Trump wont get impeached. Thats a fallacy created by democrats seeing their archenemy in power.


He got elected for his program, and is executing everything very early. He' incredibly popular amongst his voters, and most rep voters.

Any rep who'll go in against him right now is politically dead and burried. Just look at Tez Cruz.


As long as he remains as popular, and a populist coached by bannon likely will, reps wont to shit. They value their self interests more
 

Seven

In bocca al lupo, Fabio.
Jun 25, 2003
39,344
Comparing him to Hitler is taking it too far tho. Let's settle down a bit.
Yeah 100% disagree every time Seven says it.


He is crazy enough on his own to not need to exaggerate it.



Trump isnt Hitler. Lets calm down a bit.

I don't know how much more you guys need to see from him. He is Hitler. Makes up a fake enemy to the people, incites hatred, fails to distance himself from it when armed mobs act on it and one could even say he quietly approves, excells in appealing to the masses with highly simplistic yet profoundly bizarre speeches and the best yet, his only supposed strong point is that he will create jobs through a state subsidized economy.

He's even got his own weird physical characteristics and hand signals. Just like Hitler.

I've never seen anyone come this close to be honest.
 

Maddy

Oracle of Copenhagen
Jul 10, 2009
16,545
How much influence do you think McCain's wing can have on US foreign policies? What about Mattis?
@igortudor

The sad thing about Trump's [Bannons] 'divide and conquer'-strategy is the facts that he doesn't need the establised republicans. As long as he can sell any failure on the 'establisment' he'll get stronger, so despite him being a republican, he is actually in opposition to those in the congress and the established party.

It's the extreme peculiar thing about the rise in right-wing populism. They are an empty shell of bullshit, but the shell is so well designed that people still buy it. Crack the shell and Trump is done, but it's a gigantic task.

That said; when we are nearing the next mid-term, we'll see peeps fighting for their power, and we most likely see candidates denouncing Trump, but they risk scoring an own-goal due to Bannon's strategy. Kinda ironic that Trump have attacked DC so much, 'cause his power is extremely centralised. I expect an increase in federalism if Trump stays on board for 4 years.

It's the media's job to stop posting and reporting on Trump's nonsense without nuances. That Trump and his supporters have been able to create a narrative of left-wing evil media is brilliant since it creates a barrier between media and the voters. Dangerous as fuck and the clearest step towards a non-democratic America - In a democracy: the media and the population should be allies in a critical and a enlighten opposition to any institution of power, but that is all but destroyed in 'murica.

How Putin (as an example) > CNN in reliability is beyond the normal thinking mind. "Cui Bono" is something very few ask themself in this mess. Who gains most from lying and manipulating?
 

Seven

In bocca al lupo, Fabio.
Jun 25, 2003
39,344
Why are you attacking me cause i said what he could have done, but didnt ?
Because it appears that you are a blind man. Why do you still believe he could be the bigger man? Also, technically I am attacking you over something he did. He chose not to be the bigger man. Stop trying to paint it as if you're looking at facts or actions from Trump, because you're not. The facts speak for themselves. It's been slightly over a week and he has attacked several fundamental democratic institutions, but you don't care.

At this point you're just being stubborn.
 

Maddy

Oracle of Copenhagen
Jul 10, 2009
16,545
Singapore is borderline authoritarian, works well for them. Latvia before WW2 for 6 years was legit authoritarian, easily the best times in our nearly 100 year history, everyone still speaks fondly of those times, I'm sure those are not the only examples
You need to come up with better examples than Singapore and 6 years Latvia pre-WW2

Every rule has an exception.
 

Seven

In bocca al lupo, Fabio.
Jun 25, 2003
39,344
Trump wont get impeached. Thats a fallacy created by democrats seeing their archenemy in power.

He got elected for his program, and is executing everything very early. He' incredibly popular amongst his voters, and most rep voters.

Any rep who'll go in against him right now is politically dead and burried. Just look at Tez Cruz.


As long as he remains as popular, and a populist coached by bannon likely will, reps wont to shit. They value their self interests more

And that's exactly why he will be impeached.

In a world where people acknowledge that actions have consequences, the people who vote for Trump should be happy when he executes his program. That won't be the case though. They will understand that his politics hurt them. And they will come after Trump hard.

Remember, these are people that during the campaign said they voted for Trump because it was hyperbole. And now they're saying he's great, because he delivers on his promises. Kind of like what you did too. When it all starts to go south, they will be quick to blame Trump and they'll be coming for his head.
 

Zacheryah

Senior Member
Aug 29, 2010
42,251
And that's exactly why he will be impeached.

In a world where people acknowledge that actions have consequences, the people who vote for Trump should be happy when he executes his program. That won't be the case though. They will understand that his politics hurt them. And they will come after Trump hard.

Remember, these are people that during the campaign said they voted for Trump because it was hyperbole. And now they're saying he's great, because he delivers on his promises. Kind of like what you did too. When it all starts to go south, they will be quick to blame Trump and they'll be coming for his head.
But if trump is actually a dictator like you said, it cant go south.
 

Post Ironic

Senior Member
Feb 9, 2013
42,253
The modern era is not conducive to being a Hitler-type in a country like America... He's president of the country, a democracy (however ineffectual at times) no less, that is the leader of the free world. And America is not in the disastrous situation Germany was in post-World War II. He's a scary fellow, but there are enough checks in place that the man cannot and will never be a leader of that sort.

However, if the political and cultural climate allowed for it today, I have no doubt in my mind that Trump, Bannon, and co would be exactly like the Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei...
 

Seven

In bocca al lupo, Fabio.
Jun 25, 2003
39,344
But if trump is actually a dictator like you said, it cant go south.
Trump is not a dictator yet. He's a would be dictator. At the very least even you will acknowledge that the man is crazy. Because even looking at his tweets alone you know that much. But even if I think Trump's behaviour comes mightily close to Hitler, the USA is not pre-war Germany. And the world today is not the world of 1930. People will react before Trump gets his way.

If he's smart I guess he could not take big decisions for a month or so. But I doubt that will happen.

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The modern era is not conducive to being a Hitler-type in a country like America... He's president of the country, a democracy (however ineffectual at times) no less, that is the leader of the free world. And America is not in the disastrous situation Germany was in post-World War II. He's a scary fellow, but there are enough checks in place that the man, cannot and will never be a leader of that sort.

However, if the political and cultural climate allowed for it today, I have no doubt in my mind that Trump, Bannon, and co would be exactly like the Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei...
Yep, exactly my point. People think this guy is different, but he's not. It's just that times are not the same.

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You need to come up with better examples than Singapore and 6 years Latvia pre-WW2

Every rule has an exception.
Pax Augusta?
 

Zacheryah

Senior Member
Aug 29, 2010
42,251
It's the media's job to stop posting and reporting on Trump's nonsense without nuances. That Trump and his supporters have been able to create a narrative of left-wing evil media is brilliant since it creates a barrier between media and the voters. Dangerous as fuck and the clearest step towards a non-democratic America - In a democracy: the media and the population should be allies in a critical and a enlighten opposition to any institution of power, but that is all but destroyed in 'murica.
Exactly. As i've said a few times now. The media continuing their implicit bias is Trumps re-election right there :tup:

How Putin (as an example) > CNN in reliability is beyond the normal thinking mind. "Cui Bono" is something very few ask themself in this mess. Who gains most from lying and manipulating?
Thats entirely CNN's own fault for allowing their implicit bias to go waaayyy out of control, and make it very easy to be treathed as such by publishing unveryfied reports, actual petty lies, and a substantional difference in threatment of Obama compared to Trump
 

Post Ironic

Senior Member
Feb 9, 2013
42,253
Trump is not a dictator yet. He's a would be dictator. At the very least even you will acknowledge that the man is crazy. Because even looking at his tweets alone you know that much. But even if I think Trump's behaviour comes mightily close to Hitler, the USA is not pre-war Germany. And the world today is not the world of 1930. People will react before Trump gets his way.

If he's smart I guess he could not take big decisions for a month or so. But I doubt that will happen.
I don't agree with you that he will get impeached... at least not very quickly. At the same time as the political climate doesn't allow this two-bit con man to become a real dictator, it does allow for a two-bit con man to get through four years without much trouble, especially with the absurd partisanship, the two sides so irrationally entrenched as @Osman put it.
 

Maddy

Oracle of Copenhagen
Jul 10, 2009
16,545
Serious?

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Exactly. As i've said a few times now. The media continuing their implicit bias is Trumps re-election right there :tup:



Thats entirely CNN's own fault for allowing their implicit bias to go waaayyy out of control, and make it very easy to be treathed as such by publishing unveryfied reports, actual petty lies, and a substantional difference in threatment of Obama compared to Trump
Thank you for improving my argument.
 

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