Massimiliano Allegri (224 Viewers)

[Stevie]

Deluded by saying Lippi is a better coach than Max or saying Lippi had better teams along with better competition?

Which of these statements do you disagree with?

Serie A was much much harder to win from 2001 to 2006. It was the best league In the world. Lippi also beat a great Barcelona team and Real Madrids Galacticos ( one of the best teams player for player ever assembled) on his run to the final.

 

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[Hist]

Right - putting the usual history discussion behind us for one moment, who think all this bus parking practice will help us against PSG?
For me it had better be the silver lining that allows us to land one on “Destroyers of Football as we know it” PSG.
In a sick sadistic way, Football needs a EuroMax tomorrow, it needs a prime juve.

I actually have a good feeling about it. A subversion of expectations. And PSG love to choke when faced with a big name club

 

[JUVEMOOD]

I actually have a good feeling about it. A subversion of expectations. And PSG love to choke when faced with a big name club

This works in any situation.. but with us.. we never fail to make sure of the opposite.

JJ against the odds man.. this is the real deal.

PSG choke against big name club "assuming we are".. but since JJ is always against the odds.. we are not getting close.

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[lgorTudor]

IlMuppetano

I make it easy for you:

We measure football in results. Lippi won the Champions League with Juventus. Which means by definition he is a better couch than anybody who falls short of this achievement. Such as Max or Conte or Capello. If Vincenzo Italiano wins the Champions League with JJ next season he will be better than Max, Conte and Capello.

End of

 

[IlCapitano]

This is laughable on so many levels


Trying to compare the 5 league titles of Allegri with a 2nd place place of that of Lippi is a disgrace.. beyond stupidity..

Stick to "but bur 3-0 vs Barca" for fuck sake


Even the r16 to THE Deportivo exist is still much much much better than 3-0 vs. Fucking Vilarreal


Fucking Vilarreal




This Allegri delusion is beyond repair

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Wtf are you on about? I am talking about titles and levels of teams they had along with their competition. What does Villarreal have to do with it or Deportivo? Shall we also mention Lippi was the favorite in every single final and Allegri was not? Competition was stronger then and he still had favored teams, what does that tell you?

I also said multiple times Lippi is my favorite coach ever and the best Juve ever had, what is unclear?

I swear you people are beyond help with the Allegri hate. Literally everything about him is belittled and rewritten history at this point.

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Serie A was much much harder to win from 2001 to 2006. It was the best league In the world. Lippi also beat a great Barcelona team and Real Madrids Galacticos ( one of the best teams player for player ever assembled) on his run to the final.

Yeah, nobody denied that or took anything away from Lippi. You also cannot deny he had a fucking superteam on level with any of those teams, especially Milan and that early RM in 97 98 99

Yeah the league was the best but he also had a top 3 team in the world comparable to todays RM, Bayern, Barca, City etc.

Again, not taking anything from Lippi or saying Allegri is better, he is not. Level of competition corresponds to the level of their teams

 

[JUVEMOOD]

So 2nd group stage exit (Leverkusen, Deportivo, Arsenal), final loss (Milan), Ro.16 exit (Deportivo) is better to you than final (GOAT Barca), Ro.16 (Bayern), final (GOAT Madrid), QF (Madrid again)? Just be be clear

@IlCapitano
I was replying to this..

Lippi had one pretty much one bad run in CL.. vs. 2 of Allegri (Ajax and Vilareal)
If I am not mistaken as well... I believe we used to rest players in CL league games for a next big game in Serie A..
(Btw.. Something Conte did while he was at Inter)

And shit happens in a one-off game.. cant really say Juve were The Favorite (without Nedved) vs. Milan in 2003 and arguably vs. RM in 98


As for comparisons in Serie A.. What are you on trying to compare Serie A back in the late 90 and early 2000 to Serie A post 2013...

Current Juve squad (without the injuries) should run over Serie A and by far should be the favorite..

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[Vlad]

Lippi is more succesful coach, ofc, no one can deny that. But the level of expectations back then were bigger than during Allegri's reign. Juve could have boasted of being among the top 2-3 clubs financially (with Real and United) and CL was genuine objective each season. Juve reaching 3 consecutive finals in 90s was expected, we were tipped as heavy favorites before the tournament would start, considering our finances, star players and competition, which was weaker than these days. There were no oil clubs, Barca was a mess, Bayern wasnt such a powerhouse and the best players played in Serie A which was sort of NBA among European leagues. In comparison, we are barely among the top 10 clubs financially these days and Serie A is behind EPL and La Liga.

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@IlCapitano
I was replying to this..

Lippi had one pretty much one bad run in CL.. vs. 2 of Allegri (Ajax and Vilareal)
If I am not mistaken as well... I believe we used to rest players in CL league games for a next big game in Serie A..
(Btw.. Something Conte did while he was at Inter)

And shit happens in a one-off game.. cant really say Juve were The Favorite (without Nedved) vs. Milan in 2003 and arguably vs. RM in 98


As for comparisons in Serie A.. What are you on trying to compare Serie A back in the late 90 and early 2000 to Serie A post 2013...

Current Juve squad (without the injuries) should run over Serie A and by far should be the favorite..

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Make it 2, getting eliminated by Depor in 2nd round, a year after we played CL final, was surprising. With all due respect to them, Depor trashed Milan later on, but we played like shit in both games.

 

[zizinho]

I do. So you want to compare since 2001? A CL final in which we narrowly lost on penalities and would of won easily if Nedved wasn't suspended. 2 scuddetto, 2 super Coppas when serie A was the best league in the world is still more impressive than what Allegri achieved. He had by far the best squad in an awfully weak Serie A with barely any competition and one of the best squads in Europe.

So you proceed to argue against facts instead of admitting you're wrong. 2014-2018 was our most successful period post in this millennium, like it or not

 

[Stevie]

So you proceed to argue against facts instead of admitting you're wrong. 2014-2018 was our most successful period post in this millennium, like it or not

Due to Serie A being absolutely pathetic. Nobody outside of Italy gave a shit about our records in Serie A

 

[zizinho]

@IlCapitano
I was replying to this..

Lippi had one pretty much one bad run in CL.. vs. 2 of Allegri (Ajax and Vilareal)
If I am not mistaken as well... I believe we used to rest players in CL league games for a next big game in Serie A..
(Btw.. Something Conte did while he was at Inter)

And shit happens in a one-off game.. cant really say Juve were The Favorite (without Nedved) vs. Milan in 2003 and arguably vs. RM in 98


As for comparisons in Serie A.. What are you on trying to compare Serie A back in the late 90 and early 2000 to Serie A post 2013...

Current Juve squad (without the injuries) should run over Serie A and by far should be the favorite..

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If you reply to that then reply to what that post says
2001-2022
Most successful period for Juventus has been....
Drums
2014-2018. If you disagree, there is something wrong with you

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Due to Serie A being absolutely pathetic. Nobody outside of Italy gave a shit about our records in Serie A

That's your excuse or your view of the situation, not a fact

 

[Patrizi]

I've never understood these silly comparisons. They're illogical.

Like people arguing over Cheerios vs Honey Nut Cheerios. Silly.

There is no way to know what Allegri would have managed with Lippi's team. And there's no way to know what Lippi could do with our team today.

Discussions like these belong on youtube. Very low football IQ.

 

[Vlad]

If you reply to that then reply to what that post says
2001-2022
Most successful period for Juventus has been....
Drums
2014-2018. If you disagree, there is something wrong with you

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That's your excuse or your view of the situation, not a fact

Definitely. Even if you downplay Serie A achievements, we had more sucess in Europe in that period. Id say Juve between 2001-2006 underachieved in Europe considering our squad and budget, while we overachieved between 2014-2018. Anyone who saw Juve's 2 group stage exits in a row in the early 00s felt disappointed.

 

[Lion]

imagine aruguing about scenarios that didn't happen and cannot happen. instead of enjoying life or finer things on internet.

 

[Vlad]

I've never understood these silly comparisons. They're illogical.

Like people arguing over Cheerios vs Honey Nut Cheerios. Silly.

There is no way to know what Allegri would have managed with Lippi's team. And there's no way to know what Lippi could do with our team today.

Discussions like these belong on youtube

or football forums

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Serie A was much much harder to win from 2001 to 2006. It was the best league In the world. Lippi also beat a great Barcelona team and Real Madrids Galacticos ( one of the best teams player for player ever assembled) on his run to the final.

Was it better than Barcelona's team led by Messi, or Real with CR7, 2 arguably the greatest players of all time that won 5-6 CLs in the period of 7-8 seasons? Gimme a break. Do you even recall how we played vs Barca in 2003? Buffon and Thuram were our best players at Camp Nou. We were outpossesed, pinned practically inside our box, conceded more shots on target and fluked our way into the semis. Forum members around here would have a field day and would rip into Lippi.

 

[JUVEMOOD]

or football forums

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Was it better than Barcelona's team led by Messi, or Real with CR7, 2 arguably the greatest players of all time that won 5-6 CLs in the period of 7-8 seasons? Gimme a break. Do you even recall how we played vs Barca in 2003? Buffon and Thuram were our best players at Camp Nou. We were outpossesed, pinned practically inside our box, conceded more shots on target and fluked our way into the semis. Forum members around here would have a field day and would rip into Lippi.

True.
And we were a man down I guess iirc vs. Barca and without ADP (or ADP having a fucking bad day)

Anyway.. i have to agree that it makes no sense to compare different era with many different factors involved...


And till this current Juve develop a style of play that is winning games and bringing titles (regardless what style it is), I and many members here will have no option but to consider Allegri is the main responsible.

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[duranfj]

So you proceed to argue against facts instead of admitting you're wrong. 2014-2018 was our most successful period post in this millennium, like it or not

Max got a team with an identity, 4th title in a row and the best MF in the world, Max did a great job but let’s not rewrite the history like the other Max fanboy claims others are doing against Max when in fact they are the ones talking nonsense with tireless posts

 

[Bianconero81]

The Greatest Coaches in the history of Juventus are Lippi and Trap - I give the edge to Lippi because he won the World Cup with Italy (yes, I know it's not Juventus). Those two are 1 and 2, or the roles can be reversed, depending on preference. After that, it's probably Don Allegrone, but it's not even close (when comparing him to Lippi and Trap).

I am obviously basing this on accomplishments and achievements, both domestically and internationally, irrespective of era or any other shit - otherwise it becomes impossible as there are too many metrics to consider.

It would be more fun to discuss the worst coach in the history of Juventus.

 

[Papi-a]

The Greatest Coaches in the history of Juventus are Lippi and Trap - I give the edge to Lippi because he won the World Cup with Italy (yes, I know it's not Juventus). Those two are 1 and 2, or the roles can be reversed, depending on preference. After that, it's probably Don Allegrone, but it's not even close (when comparing him to Lippi and Trap).

I am obviously basing this on accomplishments and achievements, both domestically and internationally, irrespective of era or any other shit - otherwise it becomes impossible as there are too many metrics to consider.

It would be more fun to discuss the worst coach in the history of Juventus.

If this shit continues… then i would say Allegri’s second stint here will go down as one of the worst coaches in history. His past safes him. But his second period is beyond terrible.

we play without a doubt the worst football in Europe, and without good results. He is making every single player we have a worse player then they usualy are. Nothing about this second stint is positive! I cant single out on decent thing! He May still turn it around, but i dont think anyone really believe that will actualy happen.

Ciro ferrara and del neri did worse yes, but with a much weaker squad - i dont think any coach in serie a could do worse with our current squad than allegri!

 

[Hist]

Wtf are you on about? I am talking about titles and levels of teams they had along with their competition. What does Villarreal have to do with it or Deportivo? Shall we also mention Lippi was the favorite in every single final and Allegri was not? Competition was stronger then and he still had favored teams, what does that tell you?

I also said multiple times Lippi is my favorite coach ever and the best Juve ever had, what is unclear?

I swear you people are beyond help with the Allegri hate. Literally everything about him is belittled and rewritten history at this point.

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Yeah, nobody denied that or took anything away from Lippi. You also cannot deny he had a fucking superteam on level with any of those teams, especially Milan and that early RM in 97 98 99

Yeah the league was the best but he also had a top 3 team in the world comparable to todays RM, Bayern, Barca, City etc.

Again, not taking anything from Lippi or saying Allegri is better, he is not. Level of competition corresponds to the level of their teams

Thats where you are mistaken. When Lippi was winning the league in 2002/03. Milan had an equal if not better squad. Inter's squad was very strong too.

When Allegri was winning, yes his Juve was not as star studded as pre-calciopoli Juve but the Inter and Milan teams he faced were beyond horrid. Lippi won when there was near parity in the league between the top 3 on paper and in finances/purchasing power. Allegri won when there was no Inter nor Milan. Toughest team he faced was Sarri's Napoli ffs. Teams operating with half the budget who we could buy their top goal scorer the following season. Mancini's Inter won when there was no Juve and no Milan.

In a nutshell, Allegri & Mancini barely faced any local competition from an equal. Thats why even Sarri won the league and the over confidence made us try out an amateur coach in Pirlo. We figured if Sarri could do it then it can't be that difficult. In Lippi's time it was never a given that he'd win the league every year.

 

[singus]

What Allegri has been producing in his last season in his first stint, his 1st streeting as well as his 2nd spell here, will definitely deduct from his overall achievements with the club. He is on the verge of not being considered a club legend anymore, but one of the biggest frauds we ever had and couldnt get rid of.