Massimiliano Allegri (225 Viewers)

[Xperd]

Midfield was a problem last season too.

But Allegri masked it by switching formation and deploying 2 hard working players on the wing. That is why it worked so well.

 

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[B3N]

Its weaker than last season though. Undoubtedly.

Nice strawman argument there.

I'm discussing how this team compares to last season and like it or not , the starting eleven has gotten weaker. Not just by losing starters but also the older players are underperforming/declining. That was my point.

That wasn't mainly directed at you, but Alves' importance to the team is over exaggerated at times imo. I'll give him the Monaco game where he played an absolute world class game. And barca game was personal for him and had a very good game although we looked shaky on his side at times. Rest, he sucked for most of the season just a reminder and in the most important match how many times he got in the way of Dybala? He's confused whether he's a right back or a right forward. The whole shape of the team gotta adjust to accommodate his attacking tendencies.
Yes, I personally prefer to have someone like Berna in my squad and a more tactical sound right back. Especially considering his age , as that is also one of your complaints.

 

[Bianconero81]

Screw everyone says we don't have an elite team. Higuain, Dybala, Mandzukic, Cuad, Costa, Berna.. that's close to 300MIL spent on only attackers. Whomever thinks that way can go fuck themselves including Allegri.

Simplistic notion. You're a pretty smart poster, but that statement is one of a simpleton.

You seriously don't think our defense is getting older and slower? That our RB options are average at best? That our midfield lacks muscle and physicality? Every single time we have to field a midfield duo without Matuidi and with Khedira being one of the two, we look hopeless and are disgusting to watch. Khedira deploys passenger mode, and Pjanic cracks under the pressure. Sure, our attack is great, but Allegri asks our attackers to track back and defend, limiting their attacking impetus.

 

[B3N]

If you're referring to that 4:2 game against Fiorentina in 2013, that team had Valero and Pizzarro pulling the strings in midfield, some of the smartest midfielders in Serie A in the past decade and it's not like they didn't have guys to pass to, Guisseppe Rossi and Cuadrado were probably at the best point in their careers that season.

You seriously don't think we have a midfield problem?

No it wasn't pizzaro. Pizzaro was the Chilean version of Zanetti. He was cool. That guy was Croatian.

I don't think the midfield problem comes from the personnel we have. Although stronger options would certainly help. I think it's overall play and not just the midfield but the other areas suffer from it.

 

[pitbull]

No it wasn't pizzaro. Pizzaro was the Chilean version of Zanetti. He was cool. That guy was Croatian.

I don't think the midfield problem comes from the personnel we have. Although stronger options would certainly help. I think it's overall play and not just the midfield but the other areas suffer from it.

http://www.skysports.com/football/fiorentina-vs-juventus/teams/303899 David Pizarro, right there.

well then we just disagree, imo our attack and defense suffers immensely because of our central midfield, but I guess that depends on the way one sees football, I'm a central midfielder myself and some of my favorite players like Cristiano Zanetti and Edgar Davids were CMs, midfield for me is the most important part in football, that's why Pirlo was able to tip the balance when he moved to Juve

 

[Xperd]

That wasn't mainly directed at you, but Alves' importance to the team is over exaggerated at times imo. I'll give him the Monaco game where he played an absolute world class game. And barca game was personal for him and had a very good game although we looked shaky on his side at times. Rest, he sucked for most of the season just a reminder and in the most important match how many times he got in the way of Dybala? He's confused whether he's a right back or a right forward. The whole shape of the team gotta adjust to accommodate his attacking tendencies.
Yes, I personally prefer to have someone like Berna in my squad and a more tactical sound right back. Especially considering his age , as that is also one of your complaints.

As a squad, we have better depth for sure which is why I said that once new signings are fully integrated, we'll look better but depth dint take us to the final last year. Our starting eleven quality did. The motivation and intensity particularly of the older players was also very high which is many performed at their peak. This year, I haven't seen the same level from many of them.

Ya sure, even I would prefer to have Berna and a tactically sound RB in my team. Can these new adjustments take us to a CL final and on the cusp of a treble ? I don't know.

 

[Maddy]

And whilst Benatia can be a rock at the back, and is probably better at actually defending than Bonucci, he can't contribute in build up play like Bonucci did.
It's not really about missing steel in defense, but about missing important options in build up play.

Without the deepest of analysis behind this; I think selling Bonucci is a key factor in the bad passing/attacking football we've seen this season, while we don't miss him defensively we sure miss his passing and long balls behind the defensive line. It isn't enough with Pjanic. Teams put a midfielder and a forward to mark Pjanic; now who's gonna build up our play?

Tottenham is a great example to follow in this sense: they have three players that can create/take a leading part in the build-up. Dembele, Vertonghen, and Eriksen are all players you see distribute the ball around the field.

So Marotta got a job to do. Find a ball-playing centre-back and/or a midfielder to compliment Pjanic.

 

[B3N]

Simplistic notion. You're a pretty smart poster, but that statement is one of a simpleton.

You seriously don't think our defense is getting older and slower? That our RB options are average at best? That our midfield lacks muscle and physicality? Every single time we have to field a midfield duo without Matuidi and with Khedira being one of the two, we look hopeless and are disgusting to watch. Khedira deploys passenger mode, and Pjanic cracks under the pressure. Sure, our attack is great, but Allegri asks our attackers to track back and defend, limiting their attacking impetus.

In all these years following this team, I believe this squad belongs to one of the most stacked ones we ever had. Obviously there are issues with the side as no team is ever complete and perfect. Even Madrid's galactico eras.

It's just the 2nd tier comment didn't sit well with me. It wasn't the case when our most expensive attacker was Matri and it's certainly not now. No 2ND tier team pays their coach 7MIL a year. Someone needs to go back to the drawing board, instead of pulling excuses.

 

[Xperd]

One thing needs to be said, there is an over-reliance on Pjanić. We need at least one more playmaker or a ball playing defender who is good at spraying long passes and build up play from the back. Rugani could have been the one but Allegri doesn't trust him. So we have to rely on players like Chiellini playing out from the back and he's shown he isn't adept at doing that task.

As a result , our passing game is suffering and we are not in looking in total control when we have the ball compared to last season. Spurs game illustrated how we couldn't keep the ball for more than 5 seconds be it wayward passing from the back or lack of technical ability in midfield.

 

[Maddy]

In all these years following this team, I believe this squad belongs to one of the most stacked ones we ever had. Obviously there are issues with the side as no team is ever complete and perfect. Even Madrid's galactico eras.

It's the 2nd or 3rd best squad post calciopoli. Pre calciopoli you need to go back to the early 90s to find something that isn't better.

 

[B3N]

It's the 2nd or 3rd best squad post calciopoli. Pre calciopoli you need to go back to the early 90s to find something that isn't better.

I didn't say it's the best, but everyone's complaining about MDS and Sturaro, when they forget the Brindellis and Blasis we used to have.

 

[Maddy]

I didn't say it's the best, but everyone's complaining about MDS and Sturaro, when they forget the Brindellis and Blasis we used to have.

Okay..

In all these years following this team, I believe this squad belongs to one of the most stacked ones we ever had.

 

[Monty]

I'm just happy to be reading some decent discussion on here after the broken records and sht posting from the past few days

 

[B3N]

Okay..

Ones[\b]

To key

 

[Maddy]

Ones[\b]

To key

You simply need to decide. Either you stay with your original statement that I disagree with. I think you will to if you go thru Juventus' squads of the [70s, 80s,] (can't really use pre-bosman) 90s, and 00s:

In all these years following this team, I believe this squad belongs to one of the most stacked ones we ever had.

Or you argue that depth on a team can't be world class players:

I didn't say it's the best, but everyone's complaining about MDS and Sturaro, when they forget the Brindellis and Blasis we used to have.

What I pointed out is that this squad isn't one of the most stacked ever. It isn't even the best post-calciopoli squad.

 

[DAiDEViL]

OK, got it. Bonucci and Alves are the reasons we may go out against Tottenham. Good day fellas.

No. But it would be nice to have players at the back who are good with the ball, just in case your midfield is marked out of the game, no? BonBon and Alves were able to escape pressure with a neat dribbling or a well timed pass, DeS and Benatia can't offer that. Makes it easier to press us, and harder for us to play out of the back at the same time.

 

[B3N]

You simply need to decide. Either you stay with your original statement that I disagree with. I think you will to if you go thru Juventus' squads of the [70s, 80s,] (can't really use pre-bosman) 90s, and 00s:



Or you argue that depth on a team can't be world class players:



What I pointed out is that this squad isn't one of the most stacked ever. It isn't even the best post-calciopoli squad.

My definition of stacked is different to yours then perhaps. You don't judge the overall quality of a squad with its weakest nor it's best player. Right now in most positions we have atleast two options of equally very good players before we get to the squad fillers, where in any era we used to have. That is a definition of a stacked team as far as I'm concerned.

I don't know the 70's or 80's Juve, I have memories of Ravanelli, Vialli , Baggio and started following closely from the late 90's. What I believe and consider is this team can compare to in not only fielding but covering for its best eleven.

Frankly, I'm not interested nor have the time to go over every era to compare one by one, but from my memory again I do consider this team as one of the more complete ones.

 

[dolph]

One thing needs to be said, there is an over-reliance on Pjanić. We need at least one more playmaker or a ball playing defender who is good at spraying long passes and build up play from the back. Rugani could have been the one but Allegri doesn't trust him. So we have to rely on players like Chiellini playing out from the back and he's shown he isn't adept at doing that task.

As a result , our passing game is suffering and we are not in looking in total control when we have the ball compared to last season. Spurs game illustrated how we couldn't keep the ball for more than 5 seconds be it wayward passing from the back or lack of technical ability in midfield.

Rugani is not really that good of distributing the ball, and Allegri dont really have anybody in defense that can do it. The only solution in the current squad is to get Marchisio and or Bentancur in the lineup. I would like to see Bentancur and Marchisio share the DM spot and move Pjanic to RCM, were he can play closer to Higuain, Dybala and Costa. We would be so much better in possetion, be more creative without loosing any defensive stability.

 

[Hust]

Simplistic notion. You're a pretty smart poster, but that statement is one of a simpleton.

You seriously don't think our defense is getting older and slower? That our RB options are average at best? That our midfield lacks muscle and physicality? Every single time we have to field a midfield duo without Matuidi and with Khedira being one of the two, we look hopeless and are disgusting to watch. Khedira deploys passenger mode, and Pjanic cracks under the pressure. Sure, our attack is great, but Allegri asks our attackers to track back and defend, limiting their attacking impetus.

Are you opposed to Barzagli signing an extension?

 

[Bianconero81]

Are you opposed to Barzagli signing an extension?

I am not opposed to it, as long as he is a rotational option (4th-5th choice CB, coming off the bench).

Chiellini, Benatia, Caldara, Rugani, and Barza. Goodbye Howedes.