Libya 2011 Demonstrations (77 Viewers)
- Thread starter ReBeL
- Start date
Gerald Celente: Obama demands regime change in #Libya. GC: "Get out of White House & onto the white horse & lead charge 2 take out Qaddafi, tough guy!"
NO WAY ,ARE YOU SERIOUS!!!Let us be quick and warn all libyans to hide their children ,their wives and all their valuables that may be of some interest for these humanitarian troops who are looking forward with great anticipation to rape ,kiil and bring the hell down to Misrata .
Are we playing hide and seek here??
Preach Father ,preaaaach :haddadjunior:
It would be great if thats all they do PavelNevel, but unfortunately history tells us that deploying foreign ground troops rarely is a good thing. I would much rather they let the rebels use Gedaffi's frozen assets to buy more weapons. We can manage ourselves if theres a level playing field between us and Gedaffi's troops
I do not condone or approve in any way a foreign intervention or deployment of ground troops in Libya without an explicit consent or request from the libyan people.I think though that the potential damages from the western participation in this internal conflict are hugely exaggerated .I also find it very amusing to constantly read and hear how different kinds of self-proclaimed prophets and experts try to impose and sell their distorted opinions to generally ignorant people.I do really think that in the begining of this conflict the West had good intentions and the intervention wasn't mainly for the oil.If they didn't act we would've probably witnessed a massacre in Benghazi and the price of oil wouldn't be sky high now.Let us be honest here - these western democracies ,indebted to the neck ,can't afford to lead long lasting wars and oil prices volatility is in no way beneficial to the economic recovery.Libya,and I don't mean to offend any libyan around here ,has a relatively small population ,weak army and the appeal of the struggling rebels asking for western military intervention were very important preconditions facilitating the necessity of using military force and predispose the opinion of the international community in favor of the air strikes.So far the coalition and NATO are very reluctant to use more aggressive and potentially more harmful approach that could result in more civilian casualties and for me that is an evidence of the clear intentions to not exceed their authority and stick to the humanitarian mission.I'm afraid that without any significant increase of the international support for the rebels through any means necessary they won't be able to turn around the odds in their favor and this conflict will continue to be a blood bath.
Photographers including the Director of acclaimed documentary Restrepo will killed in Libya.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/21/world/africa/21photographers.html?_r=1&hp
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/21/world/africa/21photographers.html?_r=1&hp
as things stand now fred i understand the dilemma in making the decision but i'm afriad there is no other option bec the more time is delayed in any forms of intervention the more people lose there lives and the stronger Ghadaffi position grows domestically.
however i feel not everything has been done, or in other words there is one more step that can be taken instead of waiting for military intervention. this morning i was reading an article which discusses the meeting that toke place in cairo between the egyptain human rights council and a delegation of the rebels discussing the exact picture of things happening on the ground in libya and also a clearer picture on how ghadaffi is using people who r stuck there weather libyans, egyptains, or tunisians to protect facilities. while reading this it caught my eye that to this instant the military council here has not approved of the rebel council!! ( i dont know if tunisia did the same or not) may be there is a legit reason for not doing so ?( fear of more mascares towards the egyptain citizens there specially in mesrata, bec with out even approving they r being killed by ghadaffi forces, also ghadaffi has it in his head that egypt, tunisia, algeria, and a gulf state namely saudi are behind the up-rising which is him being deelluisonal and not being able to get it in his head that people have had enough of his BS and mad talk ) but it cant get any worse to be honest, and i think its about time to approve and take there side. i understand clearly egypt and tunisia being the countries directly neighboring libya cant get in to help out due to the domestic scene but the least that can be done is approving the rebels government and showing them support. this will strengthen there position in my opinion. i dont know how the idea of arab states funding the rebels will sit, but and lets be honest here ok its the least of two evils, they dont want a new afghanstan true, but u dont want nato or any military force next door and usually that does'nt sit well with the people when it lasts longer than it should. i mean if these land forces being proposed would go in finish off the job and then leave that will be fine and libya pays off the bill from fuel money then ok that wont be too bad but the fear of these forces staying and having bases in libya is what does'nt sit well with the people.
if non of this happens sooner rather then later i support military intervention on a full scale bec put aside making the rev succeed there is a lot of human life being wasted on daily basis, and for once there is a very legit reason for military intervention in a chance to preserve life that ghadaffi and his army are soo easily tearing apart for reason or no reason as proven by the use of civilians as shields to protect important places and facilities.
however i feel not everything has been done, or in other words there is one more step that can be taken instead of waiting for military intervention. this morning i was reading an article which discusses the meeting that toke place in cairo between the egyptain human rights council and a delegation of the rebels discussing the exact picture of things happening on the ground in libya and also a clearer picture on how ghadaffi is using people who r stuck there weather libyans, egyptains, or tunisians to protect facilities. while reading this it caught my eye that to this instant the military council here has not approved of the rebel council!! ( i dont know if tunisia did the same or not) may be there is a legit reason for not doing so ?( fear of more mascares towards the egyptain citizens there specially in mesrata, bec with out even approving they r being killed by ghadaffi forces, also ghadaffi has it in his head that egypt, tunisia, algeria, and a gulf state namely saudi are behind the up-rising which is him being deelluisonal and not being able to get it in his head that people have had enough of his BS and mad talk ) but it cant get any worse to be honest, and i think its about time to approve and take there side. i understand clearly egypt and tunisia being the countries directly neighboring libya cant get in to help out due to the domestic scene but the least that can be done is approving the rebels government and showing them support. this will strengthen there position in my opinion. i dont know how the idea of arab states funding the rebels will sit, but and lets be honest here ok its the least of two evils, they dont want a new afghanstan true, but u dont want nato or any military force next door and usually that does'nt sit well with the people when it lasts longer than it should. i mean if these land forces being proposed would go in finish off the job and then leave that will be fine and libya pays off the bill from fuel money then ok that wont be too bad but the fear of these forces staying and having bases in libya is what does'nt sit well with the people.
if non of this happens sooner rather then later i support military intervention on a full scale bec put aside making the rev succeed there is a lot of human life being wasted on daily basis, and for once there is a very legit reason for military intervention in a chance to preserve life that ghadaffi and his army are soo easily tearing apart for reason or no reason as proven by the use of civilians as shields to protect important places and facilities.
Is Gaddafi too big to fail?
Analysis: Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi has spent a lot of money in Africa, and now he is cashing in.
Tristan McConnellApril 21, 2011 06:24
NAIROBI, Kenya — With news that Britain and France and Italy will send military advisers to help Libya's rebels, there remains a pressing need for a mediator to negotiate between both sides.
The African Union tried to negotiate a ceasefire to Libya's civil war by sending South African President Jacob Zuma to Tripoli last week, but the effort failed. Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi accepted the African Union's proposal but the rebels flatly rejected it.
The reason the African Union team has been ineffective is probably because Libya's rebels see the 53-nation group as being in the pocket of Gaddafi. It is well known that the Libyan leader has made large donations to the African Union and individual African countries.
When the AU delegation headed by Zuma went to Libya on April 11, clutching a freshly drafted peace plan, the reception in Tripoli and in Benghazi could not have been more different.
Gaddafi welcomed the AU negotiators with open arms. In contrast, the rebels sent the Africans packing, saying that any deal must begin with the departure of Gaddafi.
“No one is likely to outplay Gaddafi, a devoted reader of Machiavelli, in the cynicism stakes.”
~Africa Confidential
The AU proposal for a ceasefire, access for humanitarian aid, protection of foreigners and opening of dialogue won Gaddafi’s backing but was stillborn as a result of its rejection by the rebels’ Interim Transitional National Council.
With Zuma were the presidents of Congo-Brazzaville, Mali and Mauritania as well as the foreign minister of Uganda. Gaddafi seized power in a coup in 1969 and, while Zuma and Mali’s Amadou Toumani Toure were democratically elected, the leaders of the other three countries in the AU team are putschists and all are old friends of the Libyan leader.
Earlier this month the influential newsletter Africa Confidential wrote: “No one is likely to outplay Gaddafi, a devoted reader of Machiavelli, in the cynicism stakes.” Certainly when it comes to his southern neighbors in Africa, the Libyan leader has been playing a long game and now he is cashing in the favors.
The most obvious conflict of interest is Libya’s contributions to the AU and to the African Development Bank. Libya is one of five countries that provides 75 percent of the AU’s annual budget. The others are Algeria, Egypt, Nigeria and South Africa. Libya’s estimated $370 million stake in the African Development Bank makes it the fifth largest contributor in Africa.
Gaddafi has shown a willingness to invest where others would not, earning him friends and influence across Africa. The Libyan African Investment Portfolio (LAIP), financed by oil money and invested across Africa, is worth about $5 billion, part of Libya’s $65 billion sovereign wealth fund. The portfolio’s main investment vehicle is the Libyan Arab African Investment Company (LAAICO).
LAAICO has hotels, real estate, telecoms, mining and agriculture interests in 25 African countries, according to Charles Goredema of the Institute for Security Studies in Pretoria, South Africa.
Through LAAICO the Libyan state owns 14 luxury 'Laico’ hotels and resorts in 11 countries, it has stakes in vast farms in Chad and Mali, plantations in Ghana and Madagascar, fruit factories in Benin and Guinea, mining companies in Democratic Republic of Congo and Central African Republic, forestry concessions in Congo-Brazzaville and Gabon … the list goes on and on.
Another arm of LAIP is Libya Oil Holdings with more than 1,200 petrol stations in 20 countries branded "OiLibya."
There is also a specialist telecoms fund called LAP Green Networks which has invested in mobile phone companies in Niger, Rwanda and Uganda and at least five other countries.
And then there are the impressive monuments to Gaddafi’s vanity and wealth that bear his name and litter the continent, often winning the approval of citizens and governments. From the 15,000-capacity Grand Mosque in Kampala, Uganda — one of the largest on the continent, completed last year by Gaddafi who finished a job started by his friend Idi Amin in the 1970s — to the new $100 million administrative quarter in Bamako, Mali.
But it is not so simple as Gaddafi’s oil billions buying unquestioning influence on an impoverished continent. Some may be pleased to see him go.
Last year Gaddafi made one of the characteristically long-winded yet rash pronouncements that win him few friends, offering Libya’s entire $97 billion worth of foreign reserves to develop Africa as long as African leaders renounced corruption. The offer was not well received by African leaders.
source: http://www.globalpost.com/dispatch/news/regions/africa/110419/why-african-mediation-failed-libya
Analysis: Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi has spent a lot of money in Africa, and now he is cashing in.
Tristan McConnellApril 21, 2011 06:24
NAIROBI, Kenya — With news that Britain and France and Italy will send military advisers to help Libya's rebels, there remains a pressing need for a mediator to negotiate between both sides.
The African Union tried to negotiate a ceasefire to Libya's civil war by sending South African President Jacob Zuma to Tripoli last week, but the effort failed. Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi accepted the African Union's proposal but the rebels flatly rejected it.
The reason the African Union team has been ineffective is probably because Libya's rebels see the 53-nation group as being in the pocket of Gaddafi. It is well known that the Libyan leader has made large donations to the African Union and individual African countries.
When the AU delegation headed by Zuma went to Libya on April 11, clutching a freshly drafted peace plan, the reception in Tripoli and in Benghazi could not have been more different.
Gaddafi welcomed the AU negotiators with open arms. In contrast, the rebels sent the Africans packing, saying that any deal must begin with the departure of Gaddafi.
“No one is likely to outplay Gaddafi, a devoted reader of Machiavelli, in the cynicism stakes.”
~Africa Confidential
The AU proposal for a ceasefire, access for humanitarian aid, protection of foreigners and opening of dialogue won Gaddafi’s backing but was stillborn as a result of its rejection by the rebels’ Interim Transitional National Council.
With Zuma were the presidents of Congo-Brazzaville, Mali and Mauritania as well as the foreign minister of Uganda. Gaddafi seized power in a coup in 1969 and, while Zuma and Mali’s Amadou Toumani Toure were democratically elected, the leaders of the other three countries in the AU team are putschists and all are old friends of the Libyan leader.
Earlier this month the influential newsletter Africa Confidential wrote: “No one is likely to outplay Gaddafi, a devoted reader of Machiavelli, in the cynicism stakes.” Certainly when it comes to his southern neighbors in Africa, the Libyan leader has been playing a long game and now he is cashing in the favors.
The most obvious conflict of interest is Libya’s contributions to the AU and to the African Development Bank. Libya is one of five countries that provides 75 percent of the AU’s annual budget. The others are Algeria, Egypt, Nigeria and South Africa. Libya’s estimated $370 million stake in the African Development Bank makes it the fifth largest contributor in Africa.
Gaddafi has shown a willingness to invest where others would not, earning him friends and influence across Africa. The Libyan African Investment Portfolio (LAIP), financed by oil money and invested across Africa, is worth about $5 billion, part of Libya’s $65 billion sovereign wealth fund. The portfolio’s main investment vehicle is the Libyan Arab African Investment Company (LAAICO).
LAAICO has hotels, real estate, telecoms, mining and agriculture interests in 25 African countries, according to Charles Goredema of the Institute for Security Studies in Pretoria, South Africa.
Through LAAICO the Libyan state owns 14 luxury 'Laico’ hotels and resorts in 11 countries, it has stakes in vast farms in Chad and Mali, plantations in Ghana and Madagascar, fruit factories in Benin and Guinea, mining companies in Democratic Republic of Congo and Central African Republic, forestry concessions in Congo-Brazzaville and Gabon … the list goes on and on.
Another arm of LAIP is Libya Oil Holdings with more than 1,200 petrol stations in 20 countries branded "OiLibya."
There is also a specialist telecoms fund called LAP Green Networks which has invested in mobile phone companies in Niger, Rwanda and Uganda and at least five other countries.
And then there are the impressive monuments to Gaddafi’s vanity and wealth that bear his name and litter the continent, often winning the approval of citizens and governments. From the 15,000-capacity Grand Mosque in Kampala, Uganda — one of the largest on the continent, completed last year by Gaddafi who finished a job started by his friend Idi Amin in the 1970s — to the new $100 million administrative quarter in Bamako, Mali.
But it is not so simple as Gaddafi’s oil billions buying unquestioning influence on an impoverished continent. Some may be pleased to see him go.
Last year Gaddafi made one of the characteristically long-winded yet rash pronouncements that win him few friends, offering Libya’s entire $97 billion worth of foreign reserves to develop Africa as long as African leaders renounced corruption. The offer was not well received by African leaders.
source: http://www.globalpost.com/dispatch/news/regions/africa/110419/why-african-mediation-failed-libya
