Julian Draxler - AM LC - Schalke 04 (48 Viewers)

[Bianconero_Aus]

difference is we were at least adding quality to our team like Morata. Can you honestly say we are stronger this season? no I wouldn't say so especially if we go into the season without a good AM in place.

Adding quality eh? So you werent whinging and whining when we signed the likes of Morata, Pereyra and Evra

Revionism at its best.

 

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[Ocelot]

Giacherrini was a steal and his value increased afterwards. That was a great piece of business.

If we are to sell Asamoah or Pereyra how much would we get for them? less than what we paid? maybe the same as what we paid for them? Certainly not more than the 18-20 mill we paid for them. 20 mill for any of these players out of Udinese was expensive.

In any case, I dont really care much beyond just saying that it wasn't all great business all the time. Zach ignored my main point and went for the meaningless details. Management had some very bad deals and they do make mistakes. Regardless of the mistakes and inefficiencies that could have been avoided, the total result is steady and rapid growth. This is what ultimately matters. That was my main point.


Barca has some terrible transfer market business in the past (Ibra, Eto etc..) but overall their management over the last decade have transformed a club that was nothing special and was going through a terrible dry spell into a club that is by far the best in the world over the last decade and grew into a financial powerhorse. Any Barca fan that focuses on 15 more mill that could have been gotten off of the sale of eto to say that management sucks definitely has his priorities fucked.

Pereyra's worth about 20 million right now.
Asamoah is a bit difficult due to his injury (which you honestly can't blame on the management), but before that, we could've easily sold him for 25 million.

Agree with the rest though.

 

[Badass J Elkann]

Adding quality eh? So you werent whinging and whining when we signed the likes of Morata, Pereyra and Evra

Revionism at its best.

I never whined about morata, if anything I was hugely supportive of the move because of his ability to create space upfront leaving less of a burden on tevez, you can quote me on that I've said that a dozen times. Pereyra was never seen as a 'quality' signing just someone adding depth and evra didn't exactly impress until later in the season

 

[Bianconero_Aus]

I'm so sick of reading "but we've been winning trophies" as an excuse to defend the board and their actions this summer. For the first time in 5 seasons I can honestly say I don't feel confident going into this season, I for one actually think we have weakened somewhat even if the departures of Pirlo and Tevez couldn't be helped but Vidal's departure with what seems to be a poor plan in place. Up until this season I don't recall in the previous 5 seasons where we are still putting vital pieces of the jigsaw together at this stage, usually we would be adding 'depth' or young prospects, this is hugely worrying in itself.

For the first time in 5 seasons I can honestly say I don't feel confident going into this season

first time in 5 seasons I can honestly say I don't feel confident going into this season

I can honestly say I don't feel confident going into this season

@Voller @Rabbit here is but a small example, the day Allegri was announced as our coach last year

just seeing the pics of allegri walking through the J museum today makes me sick, he looks absolutely clueless as to what it means to lead Juventus, mind you andrea agnelli doesn't exactly look like he has any clarity either. I f*cking chanted insults against allegri in 2011 at the scudetto party in Turin with 300,000 fans, i refuse to accept allegri, I can't fucking believe in the space of 4 hours yesterday we went from reigning champions to soon to be reigning chumps. I can never accept allegri as a coach, not for someone so tactically clueless and with the charisma of a turd I simply can't accept it.

 

[Badass J Elkann]

@Voller @Rabbit here is but a small example, the day Allegri was announced as our coach last year

just seeing the pics of allegri walking through the J museum today makes me sick, he looks absolutely clueless as to what it means to lead Juventus, mind you andrea agnelli doesn't exactly look like he has any clarity either. I f*cking chanted insults against allegri in 2011 at the scudetto party in Turin with 300,000 fans, i refuse to accept allegri, I can't fucking believe in the space of 4 hours yesterday we went from reigning champions to soon to be reigning chumps. I can never accept allegri as a coach, not for someone so tactically clueless and with the charisma of a turd I simply can't accept it.

yet I was in praise of allegri at the end of last season? stop with this bullshit. you have still yet to answer my question - do you honestly think having lost 3 massive pillars of our team that we are stronger than last season and considering how much our rivals have strengthened this season are you feeling confident? sure spew your rubbish about having won titles and all that shit but that doesn't hide the fact there is calls for concern with the season ahead especially since we are missing vital parts to our jigsaw

 

[JuveJay]

Whoever comes with the statement "we don't have money" should be shot in the head, seriously. It's one of the stupidest statements out there.

Yeah sure we don't have PSG, City or Madrid's money. But we've been constantly one of the top spenders in Europe for the past 5-6 years. Just look at the numbers, and you can't fault that.

I hear this from time to time so I thought I would in fact look at the numbers over '5-6 years' (2010-11 to this season).

Source is transfermarkt.it, as it is fairly concise and easy to compare across all the big European teams.

See attachment.

Top spenders
1. Manchester City €638.25m
2. Chelsea €622.25m
3. Liverpool €548.67m
4. Manchester United €534.86m
5. Real Madrid €533m
6. PSG €479.55m
7. Barcelona €479m
8. Juventus €405m
9. Roma €338.48m
10. Bayern Munich €332.5m
11. Arsenal €327.6m
12. Tottenham €307.05m
13. Internazionale €294.44m
14. Milan €269.35m

Top net spenders
1. Manchester City €498.49m
2. Manchester United €421.12m
3. PSG €415.8m
4. Chelsea €276.23m
5. Barcelona €262.95m
6. Real Madrid €253m
7. Liverpool €208.05m
8. Bayern Munich €191.3m
9. Juventus €174.42m
10. Arsenal €127.52m
11. Roma €92.87m
12. Milan €73.33m
13. Internazionale €58.12
14. Tottenham -€34.37m

Basically we are barely hanging on the edge of the market as far as the elite clubs go. We had that one splurge of a season where Exor funded a push to retrieve us from the abyss of mediocrity, and since then we have been very shrewd.

Then you have the whole issue of salaries, we are around 8th-9th place yearly in terms of that.

So really unless you are looking at solely what we have spent in the transfer market 'top 10' we aren't "constantly one of the biggest spenders in Europe", that is simply a myth.

I'll update this when the window closes.

 

[zizinho]

We all fall pray to individual decisions but I think more in the big picture as in all the pieces of the puzzle and how they will fit together over the course of the entire season. Much to popular belief I'm sure, I don;t think every signing we have will be a success rather I see the potential and try to focus on the "why" the club signed them rather then infamous "fee" people are going on and on about.

- - - Updated - - -

I've noticed the negative people here tend to focus on the ONE move they really don't agree with and that sets the pace for everything else beyond that move. Suddenly everything else must be questioned endlessly as if there is some retarded motive the club has. You know, like some seem to think its only a money maker for the evil owners...a "pet project". Doesn't matter how many times we win, how far we make it in whatever trophy ambition we have the same people come back to complain.


It's one thing to debate and question logically but some take it to such a level its almost laughable. Very little middle ground as we all know. My biggest issue with Marotta is always and will always be his selling ability. This year seems to be doing better but that's his weakness. As far as adding new players I trust he & Paratici 100% and if that makes me an overly annoying optimistic delusional fool then that's exactly what I am.

 

[LiquidPLP]

difference is we were at least adding quality to our team like Morata. Can you honestly say we are stronger this season? no I wouldn't say so especially if we go into the season without a good AM in place.

No point in comparing the squad to last season. Leave it in the past because you can't do anything else with it. If we kept Tevez, Pirlo and Vidal we most probably wouldn't be able to replicate the season we had anyway. Unmotivated players, even though WC and champions can do more harm than good too. Pirlo didn't have the legs for it any more and Tevez mentally left us in January when asked to be sold.

It's simply the end of an era, we couldn't keep Tevez and Pirlo any longer. As for Vidal, fuck knows what happened but I wouldn't make too much fuss about those 5m less we got. Some weird shit happened and I think both parties are guilty here so in the end they decided to part their ways. It happened so fast and it seems because of Vidal's agreement with Bayern we lost our leverage on the deal. Shit happens, we sold too cheap I agree with it but I don't think Marotta is an idiot that wanted to hurt the club. We simply don't know the whole story and most probably will never get a chance to.

I still don't see the point of getting Zaza for big money but if Beppe can get us a proper AM + LB I'll give the mercato a very high rating. Changes had to be made and I like all of our new players except Zaza.

 

[Bianconero_Aus]

Great post JuveJay only-juve likes to present his warped opinions as facts, glad you showed the hard data which shows we are nowhere near the top of the list of big spenders.

Oh and ROFL @ Liverpool. Pathetic losers.

 

[JuveJay]

Oh and ROFL @ Liverpool. Pathetic losers.

I laughed out loud when I saw how high they were, what a joke.

Spurs though, dem Jews.

 

[Badass J Elkann]

No point in comparing the squad to last season. Leave it in the past because you can't do anything else with it. If we kept Tevez, Pirlo and Vidal we most probably wouldn't be able to replicate the season we had anyway. Unmotivated players, even though WC and champions can do more harm than good too. Pirlo didn't have the legs for it any more and Tevez mentally left us in January when asked to be sold.

It's simply the end of an era, we couldn't keep Tevez and Pirlo any longer. As for Vidal, fuck knows what happened but I wouldn't make too much fuss about those 5m less we got. Some weird shit happened and I think both parties are guilty here so in the end they decided to part their ways. It happened so fast and it seems because of Vidal's agreement with Bayern we lost our leverage on the deal. Shit happens, we sold too cheap I agree with it but I don't think Marotta is an idiot that wanted to hurt the club. We simply don't know the whole story and most probably will never get a chance to.

I still don't see the point of getting Zaza for big money but if Beppe can get us a proper AM + LB I'll give the mercato a very high rating. Changes had to be made and I like all of our new players except Zaza.

Tevez and Pirlo aside, I can accept that but even if i accept what you are trying to say about having lost our leverage over Vidal he still had 2 years left on his contract with us we could have fought for a better deal, just as schalke are with draxler, hell we could have at least negotiated for a gotze - Vidal swap or something...

 

[Vlad]

No point in comparing the squad to last season. Leave it in the past because you can't do anything else with it. If we kept Tevez, Pirlo and Vidal we most probably wouldn't be able to replicate the season we had anyway. Unmotivated players, even though WC and champions can do more harm than good too. Pirlo didn't have the legs for it any more and Tevez mentally left us in January when asked to be sold.

It's simply the end of an era, we couldn't keep Tevez and Pirlo any longer. As for Vidal, fuck knows what happened but I wouldn't make too much fuss about those 5m less we got. Some weird shit happened and I think both parties are guilty here so in the end they decided to part their ways. It happened so fast and it seems because of Vidal's agreement with Bayern we lost our leverage on the deal. Shit happens, we sold too cheap I agree with it but I don't think Marotta is an idiot that wanted to hurt the club. We simply don't know the whole story and most probably will never get a chance to.

I still don't see the point of getting Zaza for big money but if Beppe can get us a proper AM + LB I'll give the mercato a very high rating. Changes had to be made and I like all of our new players except Zaza.

That's the only questionable deal for me this summer. With Dybala, Morata, Mandžukić and Coman, 5th striker should have been far cheaper solution imho. Other than that Vidal's sale made sense if the player expressed his desire to leave. Bayern offered him better terms and we weren't willing to match those. Mgt probably thought his best days are behind and this is the last summer we could actually make good profit on his sale. He was coming off abysmal year afterall, up until 2 months before the end of season he was having one bad game after another.

 

[Beki]

http://www.calciomercato.com/news/juve-offerta-per-draxler-entro-domenica-672256

If I understand properly, calciomercato says, Schalke gave time for us to make an improved bid for Draxler till this Sunday.

 

[alexjuventino]

http://www.calciomercato.com/news/juve-offerta-per-draxler-entro-domenica-672256

If I understand properly, calciomercato says, Schalke gave time for us to make an improved bid for Draxler till this Sunday.

Yea it says that they will be presenting the team or whatever so if they are to sell him, they want to know because they don't want to present a player and then sell him

 

[Rabbit]

@Voller @Rabbit here is but a small example, the day Allegri was announced as our coach last year

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Bianconero_Aus again.

 

[zizinho]

@Voller @Rabbit here is but a small example, the day Allegri was announced as our coach last year



yet I was in praise of allegri at the end of last season? stop with this bull$#@!. you have still yet to answer my question - do you honestly think having lost 3 massive pillars of our team that we are stronger than last season and considering how much our rivals have strengthened this season are you feeling confident? sure spew your rubbish about having won titles and all that $#@! but that doesn't hide the fact there is calls for concern with the season ahead especially since we are missing vital parts to our jigsaw

i want to answer. yes i feel very confident going into next season. if we dont get like 15 injuries we will win the scudetto comfortably. +10 pts atleast. as for CL, i believe we are capable on reaching the QF, if we can go further than that will depend on the draw a bit, our suspensions and injury status at that point and form. Coppa depends on how serious we enter the competition.

as for the first part of your question, the one that will be toughest to replace is Tevez, Vidal and Pirlo were important both as players on the field and (Pirlo much more) personalities in the locker room, but atleast on the field we have Marchisio who can replace Pirlo. in fact, majority of the people here wanted Pirlo benched last season so Marchisio can play regista, the same people are now going on about what a huge loss Pirlo is (i wish he stayed, hope he atleast returns to a loan in January). Marchisio in a full season as regista will be great to watch. Vidal wasnt the same player as he was in 2013/14. he declined due to his injury and even without a 100% Vidal we managed to come close to a treble. we brought in Khedira, Asamoah, who missed half a season last year, could return to the midfield in case we sign Kurzawa/Siqueira, Sturaro and Pereyra are also there. we have options in the midfield, ofcourse, none of them is as good as 100% Vidal, but Vidal from last season is replaceable. the biggest issue is losing Tevez, but we added a proven goalscorer in Mandzukic and a young Dybala for creativity. Morata is a year older, more experienced and is expected to start regularly, so this team potentially isnt weaker than last seasons one, considering Allegri can make them work together

 

[LiquidPLP]

Tevez and Pirlo aside, I can accept that but even if i accept what you are trying to say about having lost our leverage over Vidal he still had 2 years left on his contract with us we could have fought for a better deal, just as schalke are with draxler, hell we could have at least negotiated for a gotze - Vidal swap or something...

Yeah I'm myself not satisfied with how we sold Vidal. Gotze - Vidal swap was impossible it seems, the German was never interested in joining us IMO, he just wanted to use our interest to put the pressure on Bayern's board and Pep.

A couple if days ago talked to a die hard Madrid fan who claimed RM was interested in Vidal until the car accident. Perez is careful with this kind of players since Cassano and that's why they ended their interest. It seems MU lost their interest too. I don't know if the accident had such an important impact on the whole situation but definitely reduced the list of interested clubs so there we could lose our leverage with Bayern. All I want to say is: we shouldn't assume Beppe is an idiot who wants to hurt the club. He's made his mistakes and he'll make more but overall he's done very well for us. I trust the management and I think it's unnecessary for you to go full panic-retard mode. I'm worried for the AM myself but he still has a month to go.

 

[Beki]

Yea it says that they will be presenting the team or whatever so if they are to sell him, they want to know because they don't want to present a player and then sell him

So, prepare fot Saponara?

 

[alexjuventino]

So, prepare fot Saponara?

Naw neither saponara nor vasquez will come

 

[only-juve]

Great post JuveJay only-juve likes to present his warped opinions as facts, glad you showed the hard data which shows we are nowhere near the top of the list of big spenders.

Oh and ROFL @ Liverpool. Pathetic losers.

Well we're clearly ahead of many top clubs out there in our spending, if anything that stats actually prove my point not the other way around.

We're ahead of the likes of Bayern Munich and arsenal who are both constantly among last 16 in the CL. Some here try to paint a picture as if we're hardly spent much in the past years which is simply wrong.

Plus I've clearly said we're nowhere near the likes of City, madrid or PSG when it comes to spending but still we've constantly spend quiet a big sum in the market.